Buying first Gyuto today. Tanaka Ginsan/blue2, Waiku, or something more laserish?

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Isaiahm

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Hi All! Posting one last lat time before I pill the trigger. I posted similar thoughts a few weeks ago (accidentally) the kitchen knife knowledge section, hoping in the more broad section I'll get some additional thoughts and guidance!

I'm planning to buy my first gyuto after using more traditional western knives. I answered the questionnaire in a previous post.

I've been leaning Tanka (either Ginsan or blue 2) because it looks beautiful and seems like a solid starting point. I cut a looot of onions though, and the only complaints I've heard is that the tip isn't particularly thin which makes this particular task less fun.

I've also been looking at the Waiku, it sounds like Epic Edge's version is thinner than K&S's but I much prefer the ebony handle that K&S adds on. Anybody know if it would be a mistake to go with the K&S Waiku, and would the aforementioned tip problem be better here?

My last thought is maybe I should just go with one of the big laser names that get tossed around because they sound like a lot of fun and I'll only be using it for home use.

Thanks, best, and looking forward to hearing your thoughts! (even if it's a different knife entirely!)
 
Any of these knives will be fine in onoin.

However, the Wakuis are carbon core, so the edge may not hold up to the acid in onions as long.

The tip on the KnS Waku Tschime is certainly thinner than the rest of the knife but perhaps not too different to the Tanaka's tip (the Wakui Tsuchime is a thicker knife). I believe that the Wakui hairline is quite a bit thinner.

The problem with a laser is that the final cuts in a dice will cling to the blade more

Swings and roundabouts.
 
Tanaka will be a good choice. I've owned / used the ginsanko for quite awhile. Liked it a lot. Used a stainless clad blue and had a slight preference for it. The normal blue 2 is said to be pretty reactive - something I try and stay away from.
 
I have the B2 Tanaka, it gets a patina pretty easily and isn’t too reactive. Much less reactive than my Mazaki.

Wakui tip vs Tanaka b2 tip. Not much different.
08C8329E-76BF-4CBD-AB7B-64AE94463CE1.jpeg
 
daveb said:
Yoshi always better.

Yoshi > Shig
Yoshi > Kato
Yoshi > Toy
Yoshi > Tanaka
Yoshi ~ Wat (Don't ask)
Yoshi >>> Maz


Waiku? Isn't that one of the Hawaiian Islands?
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Ugh I work in tech and always read it "whack ui" and always typo it waiku. Sorry for the typo and thank you for the breadkdown!
 
I think the Yoshi is the better knife. But it comes with at least a 50% price premium. You gotta make that call.
 
daveb said:
Yoshi always better.

Yoshi > Shig
Yoshi > Kato
Yoshi > Toy
Yoshi > Tanaka
Yoshi ~ Wat (Don't ask)
Yoshi >>> Maz
Click to expand...
I have seen one KKF member selling off his Kato and Shig cheaply because TF Denka was the ONE, but I've never seen any KKF member do the same because they bought a Yoshi. Action speaks louder than words.
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/wts-kato-workhorse-shig-ikeda-suminagashi.47861/Yoshi may be better than Tanaka, but being always better is arguable.
 
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daveb said:
I think the Yoshi is the better knife. But it comes with at least a 50% price premium. You gotta make that call.
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With the black friday discount and without the Saya I'd get with the tanaka the difference ends up being closer (to non sale, pricing, of course) . I'd just need to figure out what to do without a Saya... store it in the box?

tchan001 said:
I have seen one KKF member selling off his Kato and Shig cheaply because TF Denka was the ONE, but I've never seen any KKF member do the same because they bought a Yoshi. Action speaks louder than words.
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/wts-kato-workhorse-shig-ikeda-suminagashi.47861/
Click to expand...

Thats a very reassuring point.

To both of you any thoughts between the stainless-clad white 2 or the SKD versions from K&S?
 
The seller of the Kato and Shig in that BST ad found the TF Denka as his perfect knife.
 
Both are very good, just choose the one you like the look of the most.
 
tchan001 said:
The seller of the Kato and Shig in that BST ad found the TF Denka as his perfect knife.
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so?

that dude sold 3 knives he never really used. is that what you're going to base your argument off of?

sometimes the discussion around here reminds me of the guitar forums where all these "amazing" R9s, PRS's and FCS guitars would get sold with perfect frets, while I had to resort to having a custom builder duplicate my favorite FCS guitar that I had blasted the frets off of in 18 months.

Yoshikane, Tanaka, Wakui are all nice choices. And I'll have to diverge from @daveb here I prefer my Mazaki to my Yoshikane (or, and here it comes, most of my knives) because I think with the KNS handle the Mazaki is the closest to being my ideal weight / weight distribution even if it's not the very best cutter I own, and I like the profile a LOT.

Here's my feeling, honestly: it's just a knife. I have yet to find a knife that has anything like the soul that a good guitar, classic car, watch or fountain pen has. It's a sharpened bit of metal you rub against some rocks and the best ones are the ones that just get out of your way and let you cook. I do think Yoshikane is a great choice I think Tanaka is too. If you look at the price of the Yoshi and dont want to pay that much, I dont think you should feel like you're missing out too much with a Tanaka ginsan or blue. Either of these will be a massive upgrade to most western chef's knives.
 
Some knives don't feel right the moment you grab it. Some knives don't feel right the moment when you try cutting with it. Why do you think we have so many catch and release sales on BST? Because those knives weren't the right knife for their owner for one reason or another. If a knife doesn't feel right, would you continue using it day after day, hour after hour? So I don't see your point about knives being sold because they were hardly ever used when trying to find a perfect knife. Of course what is the perfect knife for one person could be a dud for another. We all have our own personal preferences to explore.
If you really wanted a knife with the soul of a good chef, you could have tried to buy the Anthony Bourdain original Kramer when it was auctioned. Arguably it has the soul of a great chef behind it.
 
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I must say that there are many great knives discussed on this forum so you won't be wrong to try out the ones which have fan bases on KKF. So I would suggest using your budget as one of the main deciding factors.
 
My two cents has to do with profile...
Yoshi and Wakui have more flat spot.
Tanaka has a gentle radius profile.
Depending on how you like to cut (and what you cut), this may make a difference. Or not at all.
Yoshi and Wakui will do well with push-cutting. Tanaka can do a bit better with rocking. This said, things like grip, technique, etc. can change what you can get out of any knife. So maybe think of these more as characteristics as opposed to limitations, if that makes sense.
Height might also matter. Tanaka and Wakui are ~52mm. Yoshi is ~48-50mm. Some variation with these, but Yoshi will be the shortest. So, if you have meatpaws factor that in.
Personally, I think at $200 Wakui is an excellent value and punches about its weight class.
Bottom line--you'll be very happy with any of these three 🍻
 
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I had the wakui and yoshi. They are both very good knives, although I like the yoshi better. Tanaka has very good reputation too, so I think you wouldnt be unhappy with any of them.

Another factor I want to mention is steel type. My personal preference is blue 2 >> white 2. I’d recommend the skd version if you want to get a yoshi after all.
 
Hz_zzzzzz said:
I had the wakui and yoshi. They are both very good knives, although I like the yoshi better. Tanaka has very good reputation too, so I think you wouldnt be unhappy with any of them.

Another factor I want to mention is steel type. My personal preference is blue 2 >> white 2. I’d recommend the skd version if you want to get a yoshi after all.
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Interesting could you elaborate? I just read a reddit thread where they were saying go white 2 over the SKD because the skd won't be able to get as sharp and will be harder to sharpen?

Can you elaborate a bit on why you prefer blue 2 over white 2?
 
Isaiahm said:
Interesting could you elaborate? I just read a reddit thread where they were saying go white 2 over the SKD because the skd won't be able to get as sharp and will be harder to sharpen?

Can you elaborate a bit on why you prefer blue 2 over white 2?
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SKD sharpens up pretty easily. Definitely more like a simple carbon, somewhere around blue steels, than stainless.
 
None of these popular steels is really difficult to sharpen including the typical PM one like SG2 or CPM154. High wear resistance PM like m390 or zdp189 might be challenging but it’s really not as difficult as many describe IMO, especially when you just sharpen the small bevel. In terms of SKD it’s really easy to sharpen. Easier than say a hard white 1 like konosuke/Tanaka or just as easy as an average blue 2.

In terms of blue 2 vs white 2, call me crazy but I think when I want a lower grit toothy edge, blue 2 is easier to sharpen than white 2 for it being easier to deburr at a lower grit. It is true that if I want to do it all the way up to 10k grit, white 2 is easier and it probably get sharper in shorter period, but I don’t find that necessary or even desirable. And most importantly blue 2 stays sharp much longer when I cut acidic or waxy things like tomato or green pepper. I usually don’t care too much about edge retention given how many knives I have and how little cutting I need to do (compared to a pro), but with white 2 I can feel the noticeable deterioration of edge just after dicing a few tomatos, which could become a bit annoying.
 
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Isaiahm said:
Interesting could you elaborate? I just read a reddit thread where they were saying go white 2 over the SKD because the skd won't be able to get as sharp and will be harder to sharpen?

Can you elaborate a bit on why you prefer blue 2 over white 2?
Click to expand...

I would be skeptical of Reddit's sharpening ability and equipment as a general rule.

in general with stainless clad knives I see a lot less point to get a carbon core. I mean, I wont say no to it, but personally if Im getting a stainless clad knife I see less reason to get a super reactive core, so for Yoshi if I handnt gotten mine off BST I would have gone for SKD.

that being said I do like white 2 in general but yeah, edge retention is not the best even when it's run pretty hard.
 
tcmx3 said:
I would be skeptical of Reddit's sharpening ability and equipment as a general rule.
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I should honestly be more skeptical of just about everything on reddit.

Anyways I just bit the bullet and ordered! Yoshikane Amekiri SKD Gyuto 240mm Stainless Clad Nashiji Finish

Really wish I could have bought a saya with it buy it's sold out... I know it says he won't sell them separately, but anybody know if given the fact that I've bought a knife he'll sell it after the fact? I live in NYC and could swing by...?

I'm was/am also extremely tempted by:WTS - Tanaka Blue 2 Nashiji 270mm gyuto

but I had too many questions and didn't want to miss the black friday sale. Not a mistake.... right?
 
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