Comparable to a DT ITK

[Dave Martell]

Let me get this straight, am I REALLY being called out because I dared to compare two knives on a KITCHEN KNIFE FORUM rather than contact the knifemaker first in private? WOW! If so, I hereby apologize for my audacity in discussing the attributes of various knives on a Kitchen Knife Forum. I promise I'll never make that mistake again.

No not at all, at least that's not how I see it.

My point on contacting the maker had nothing at all to do with perspectives, comparisons, likes/dis-likes at all. I was referring to situations that come up where there's a problem with a knife that could be handled by the maker if they were given a chance. I'm not talking about asking Devin to re-make his knife thinner - but in say the case of getting a knife with a broken handle or grind problem then that's a quality issue that should be taken to the maker. Too many times over the years I've seen people rake makers over the coals before they ever make the call and this is unfortunate.

Knife discussion forums are for discussing differences between knives - shoot - what else would we be talking about here if we didn't have that?

 

[cnochef]

I don't think you are being called out. I think your post just got people thinking. Take that as a compliment!

I actually went back and edited my original post, because I thought it was too strongly worded so maybe I'm too sensitive and PC myself!!!

 

[kalaeb]

Here's an example of why I mentioned cracked handle before....

On my first Hiromoto group buy knives I bought some bad wood. Some of this came to light while I was working the knives while some cracked and twisted while in the customer's hands. In every case, these customers came to me first and I made the situations right and none of this has gone public until right now. The reason why this is important is because had they started asking "is this normal" it could have become entered into potential customer's minds as this is the kind of work Dave turns out. People may have only heard of the problem - not the resolve - and associated me with doing bad work and maybe even shied away from doing re-handle business with me as a result. From my side I wasn't looking to contain this and not have it go public but I know that I was thankful for the chance to fix the problems beforehand.

Good point Dave, thank you for the view point. I let my argumentative side come out, sorry, I can see how in situations like this it would be best to contact the maker.

 

[Dave Martell]

I actually went back and edited my original post, because I thought it was too strongly worded so maybe I'm too sensitive and PC myself!!!

Please don't feel the need to edit your post, you didn't do anything wrong in asking the way you did.

 

[Cadillac J]

Too many times over the years I've seen people rake makers over the coals before they ever make the call and this is unfortunate.

I completely agree with this comment. However, asking if a cracked handle is normal or stating a knife might of been a bit over-ground is hardly "raking anyone over the coals". Basically I agree with your concept Dave, just not the example you used. lol.

Maybe it was just me, but I didn't read anything in this thread that I would of considered 'negative press' towards Hoss or his work....everything seemed like typical knife talk to me, which is the only reason why I felt the need to respond to all of this.

Let's also be honest here--whether or not there have been a few "issues" with the ITKs, 98% of reviews or comments have been nothing but positives...so no one's image or reputation is getting tarnished at all here.

It's all good.baby...without any type of disagreements, this place would be extremely boring!

 

[Craig]

Even if makers are willing to fix any problems that arise, it's not entirely without value to know which knives are or are not prone to which kinds of flaws. Note that I'm not saying anything about any particular maker or knife when I say that.

 

[DevinT]

A few more thoughts on this subject from a makers stand point.

I do not benifit much from public scrutiny. I do benifit from personal feed back from individuals who are using knives made by me and others. I know a lot about knives but I am far from knowing everything about them.

Pro's use knives differently than home cooks, and people who like to entertain are different yet.

The more input I have with individuals and how they use knives helps me learn what to make and improve.

I welcome all imput.

I am also asking that you, the forum members be sensitive to what is being posted because it can have an impact on who buy's my knives.

The support has been tremendous and I could not do any of this without the support of this forum and others like it.

It is impossible to sell high end knives to people who are ignorant. Dealing with educated, highly inteligent people can sometimes be a double edge sword. I am obviously not very smart, that's why I make knives.

I put everything I have into trying to make great knives, I guess that's why I am so sensitive about some of the comments. I am a person first and a brand second.

Much love and respect to all

Hoss

 

[apicius9]

I just looked at this one for the first time and would like to throw out here that I think we have two different discusions going on here.

One is about the ITK knives and how they compare to others. And this is where everybody's preferences may come in: Some prefer ultra-thin lasers and some somewhat heftier knives. I think it is perfectly legitimate to compare knives and comment on personal like and dislikes. However, as someone who dabbles in crafting things, I don't think it is realistic to expect from a hand-made product that it is perfectly consistent across a large number of copies, and comparing it to an 'industrial' product will always be difficult because not everybody will have exactly the same knife in his hands. This does not have anything to do with quality this is about personal preference, and - at most - about realistic or unrealistic expectations toward consistency in handcrafted products.

The second discussion is about how to address flaws like cracks, overgrinding, warping etc. I don't think there is anything wrong with asking here if you are not sure about something, but if it is an obvious flaw, I would also prefer to deal with the seller/maker first, as Dave suggests. Now the unfortunate thing is that this discussion about dealing with flaws has come up in a post about Devin's knives. And while I have not had the pleasure to use one of his knives, I don't think I have ever read any bad word about the craftsmenship, the fit and finish, the execution of details, and the care going into his knives. So, while 'How to deal with flawed knives?' is a great discussion point, I think it should not be discussed in a thread about Devin's knives because it could establish a connection that is simply not there, for all I know.

My two cts.,

Stefan

 

[so_sleepy]

Devin, in my case, I didn't contact you because I understood these were mid-tech (not custom) knives. I expect this to be a take it or leave it arrangement. If there was an issue right out of the box I expect the dealer to handle customer service, not you.

Selling through a dealer has pros and cons. It saves you the hassle of taking and filling orders, but it also insulates you from the customer relationship.

 

[mc2442]

Devin,

I am truly looking forward to experiencing one of your "lesser" works. I am new to this, and I don't know if I will ever go custom and get one of the beauties that I have seen posted, but everything I have read about your work has been very positive. For the noobie home cook, even the mid-tech is a pretty good investment for a kitchen knife. Due to all the great things said about your work, I wanted to jump into this and get a great, though modest by some standards, knife to benchmark what I would guess to be more purchases in the future.

This post took an odd turn. I thought there was going to be quite a while before the next batch of western ITKs were made. It seems like there are plenty of shows and custom work to keep you busy, so I was just looking to get suggestions to find something comparable to get for the immediate fix, while fully intending to get one of yours later.

Funny hobbie. A little lurking led to a Tojiro and a Boardsmith cutting board....not to mention the stones and stropping gear to keep everything sharp. Not that much longer, but a lot more lurking, has me wanting more. I don't even cook all that much, though I have always wanted to get into it more and have been taking steps in that direction.

Anyway, thank you in advance for what I am sure will be a wonderful knife,

Matt

 

[DevinT]

Thanks Matt,

Be carefull there is no known cure for this type of disease.

Hoss

 

[Audi's or knives]

Thanks Matt,

Be carefull there is no known cure for this type of disease.

Hoss

Going bankrupt and hocking them for money is one cure, of course you could sell your organs for money to buy more haha. You know your right there is no cure.

 

[mc2442]

I think I am already realizing that. My friends are already looking at me a bit oddly, but everyone needs a hobby. The widely varied, but accepting community does make it easy to get sucked in.

At least one friend is all for it....though me offering to sharpen his knives probably has something to do with it. Practice for me, though my first attempts seem very promising.

 

[Salty dog]

Boy, I don't know if I should comment on this thread because I have very strong opinions on two of the subjects. Hassles with new knives and wether we should talk about it? And how knife forums relate to knife sales. It's egg shell territory and it shouldn't be.

I will say one thing. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

OK, two things. I don't believe in wabi sabi.

 

[RRLOVER]

Wabi Sabi..........Now that's just F'in funny!:lol2:

 

[Cadillac J]

It's egg shell territory and it shouldn't be.

Agreed.

 

[bob]

Well said Salty. I have to agree with you there. I don't have an agenda in this discussion because i've never owned or handled any of the knives involved in the thread. However, if i was in the market for one, i would want all the information thats available here. The whole point of a knife forum is to talk about knives. And there's no point of discussing something if you only point out the good stuff.