Covid: the shape of things to come

[Nemo]

Understood, just specifically asking about situation in Oz. We are not seeing same in California so far even though cases are going up significantly. I am curious if this is due to Australia being spared earlier on due to stricter lock downs and general abidance by the rules or just us lagging. As we've all found out, vaccines are not very good at preventing infection with omicron and variants.

My impression is that after 2ish years of fairly strict covid control measures most people are "over" covid, even if covid isn't over them. Maybe like a rebound effect.

The semi - explicit contract was kinda like "help us control the virus until everyone is vaccinated, then everything will be OK" and this was broadly accepted. Now people expect everything to be OK. So there is absolutely zero political will to reinstitute control measures, even relatively mild ones like masks in crowded indoor settings.

Few wear masks or avoid high risk transmission situations, so transmission is out of control here. For example, I know multiple people who have caught covid at (separate) weddings in the last couple of weeks. As mentioned, our high vax rates are great at preventing severe disease in most people but not so good at reducing transmission. So we have the highest (or second highest?) transmission rate in the world (although our testing is probably more comprehensive than some places, so this may be exaggerated). Nonetheless, our death rates are very low by world standards even though most of the population has had covid (many have had it multiple times).

 

[Michi]

Understood, just specifically asking about situation in Oz. We are not seeing same in California so far even though cases are going up significantly. I am curious if this is due to Australia being spared earlier on due to stricter lock downs and general abidance by the rules or just us lagging. As we've all found out, vaccines are not very good at preventing infection with omicron and variants.

Well, we dropped almost all restrictions. Face masks are required only in health care settings (hospitals, pharmacies, aged care homes, etc.), on public transport and taxis, airports and planes. Mask requirements are not enforced. During a recent pharmacy visit, I saw that about half the patrons did not wear a mask, despite big signs pointing out the mask requirement. Pharmacy staff made no attempt to enforce the requirement. (I can see why; those workers are not security guards and don't want to spend their entire day arguing with people who decide that the rules don't apply to them.)

When someone tests positive, they are required to isolate for seven days. There is no requirement to have a negative test before leaving isolation, and the isolation requirement is not enforced in any way.

People are supposed to report on a website if they test positive on a RAT test. I strongly suspect that a large number of people couldn't be bothered though.

Tracking daily infections is now far less reliable than it was in the past. PCR tests are still counted accurately, but RAT tests are not. PCR positivity rate is between 5% and 10%, meaning that a large number of infections remain undetected.

Daily new infections are at around 50,000 and trending up. For comparison, that is the US equivalent of 600,000 new cases per day. The actual number of infections likely is much higher.

About 3,000 people are currently hospitalised with Covid, and around 40-45 people die each day. (As I said, that's a low death rate, by some definition of "low". That still is about 15 times the number of road fatalities.) There is no political will to try and curb infections, and it seems that we have decided to simply shrug our shoulders at 45 new deaths every day as an acceptable price.

Australia was spared for a long time because we closed the borders and, by and large, social distancing, lock-downs, and masks did a lot to limit the spread. Omicron is a lot more infectious than earlier variants. Combined with essentially no restrictions, that sent case numbers through the roof. Vaccine effectiveness is waning, so we are seeing more and more cases of people getting Covid for a second time.

I don't know whether the US is lagging Australia and will get another bad spike, or whether the US will be spared due to having had so many infections that herd immunity starts to affect case numbers.

At any rate, our hospitals are in deep trouble, and nurses and other medical professionals are leaving in droves because they can't take it any longer. And flu cases are starting to go up, making things worse.

It's a bad situation

 

[Barmoley]

Well, we dropped almost all restrictions. Face masks are required only in health care settings (hospitals, pharmacies, aged care homes, etc.), on public transport and taxis, airports and planes. Mask requirements are not enforced. During a recent pharmacy visit, I saw that about half the patrons did not wear a mask, despite big signs pointing out the mask requirement. Pharmacy staff made no attempt to enforce the requirement. (I can see why; those workers are not security guards and don't want to spend their entire day arguing with people who decide that the rules don't apply to them.)

When someone tests positive, they are required to isolate for seven days. There is no requirement to have a negative test before leaving isolation, and the isolation requirement is not enforced in any way.

People are supposed to report on a website if they test positive on a RAT test. I strongly suspect that a large number of people couldn't be bothered though.

Tracking daily infections is now far less reliable than it was in the past. PCR tests are still counted accurately, but RAT tests are not. PCR positivity rate is between 5% and 10%, meaning that a large number of infections remain undetected.

Daily new infections are at around 50,000 and trending up. For comparison, that is the US equivalent of 600,000 new cases per day. The actual number of infections likely is much higher.

About 3,000 people are currently hospitalised with Covid, and around 40-45 people die each day. (As I said, that's a low death rate, by some definition of "low". That still is about 15 times the number of road fatalities.) There is no political will to try and curb infections, and it seems that we have decided to simply shrug our shoulders at 45 new deaths every day as an acceptable price.

Australia was spared for a long time because we closed the borders and, by and large, social distancing, lock-downs, and masks did a lot to limit the spread. Omicron is a lot more infectious than earlier variants. Combined with essentially no restrictions, that sent case numbers through the roof. Vaccine effectiveness is waning, so we are seeing more and more cases of people getting Covid for a second time.

I don't know whether the US is lagging Australia and will get another bad spike, or whether the US will be spared due to having had so many infections that herd immunity starts to affect case numbers.

At any rate, our hospitals are in deep trouble, and nurses and other medical professionals are leaving in droves because they can't take it any longer. And flu cases are starting to go up, making things worse.

It's a bad situation

I am sorry to hear this. This sounds like what we had earlier around February time when omicron became the main variant.

 

[Luftmensch]

I am curious if this is due to Australia being spared earlier on due to stricter lock downs and general abidance by the rules or just us lagging.

For non-Australian readers. If you open the international news and thumb through to the last page.... you may have noticed that we have an election on Saturday.

The polls got it seriously wrong last election. The Opposition was expected to win and they did not. Currently the polls are struggling to predict an outcome with any confidence. There are many interesting things going on in this election - a lot of big factors.

Neither party want to touch the future of covid as a major talking point.

So there is absolutely zero political will to reinstitute control measures, even relatively mild ones like masks in crowded indoor settings.

There is no political will to try and curb infections, and it seems that we have decided to simply shrug our shoulders at 45 new deaths every day as an acceptable price.

I suspect the lack of will is because it is too easy for either side to weaponise covid. The Opposition can prosecute past covid missteps by the Government. If the opposition offered tighter policy, the Government could run a campaign on freedoms. It is politically convenient to maintain the status quo. There almost seems like there is a gentleman's agreement not to discuss it.

I also suspect it is a reflection of polling (the era of conviction politics is very far off in our rear view mirror). Again... this seems bipartisan. Being 'strong on covid' is not an election winning strategy for either side - assuming that is what either of the major parties wanted to do. While I am an advocate for more being done to reduce the burden on our hospital system... covid has consumed a lot of oxygen for the past two years. Lets be honest.... our major parties have not done much else for the past two years. I think the country is restless and wants to see other major issues being addressed. I am sympathetic to this. I foreshadowed this in post #1,819.

I am not willing to bet who will win... and it wouldnt be appropriate for this forum. If the incumbents lose, i think it is fair to say covid has played a role. Not just covid but the other crises we had - the 2019 bushfires and the floods. Disaster and pestilence has been an exhausting background malaise for three years. We have been watching how the Government responded. Yet the same is not true for the Opposition - it harder for disinterested voters to ignore what the Government did than to make an assessment on what the Opposition might have done (better or worse). After all, there is a political adage in Australia: "Oppositions dont win elections; Governments lose them".

I say this all dispassionately. I would strongly prefer we had a less partisan political ecosystem where we could discuss the current state of covid objectively, without it being an election issue (or any policy area for that matter).... but we dont...

 

[Jovidah]

My impression is that after 2ish years of fairly strict covid control measures most people are "over" covid, even if covid isn't over them.

I think this is the case almost everywhere at this point.
What's most worrysome is how we'll deal with another big wave in the future... because there's less and less enthusiasm for restrictions.

 

[chefknife69]

covid has changed the world as we know it , and not for good

 

[Luftmensch]

I am not willing to bet who will win... and it wouldnt be appropriate for this forum. If the incumbents lose, i think it is fair to say covid has played a role. Not just covid but the other crises we had - the 2019 bushfires and the floods.

The major results are in... albeit; votes are still being counted:

• The Liberal party (Incumbents - the 'conservative' party) have had a wipe out
• The Labor party (Opposition - the 'progressive' party) will form the next government
  • The Labor party has not secured enough seats (currently) to form a majority Government
  • Another few days of counting will see whether the Labor party can Govern with a majority or will need to strike a deal with the cross-bench

In the wash, the headline outcome is that the Liberal party lost its mandate to govern. While Labour (the Opposition) have picked up a few seats (currently only 3), according to the current count, seats have swung away from the Liberals (the incumbents). The swing appears to be mainly towards independent candidates. If you are engaged with Australian politics... this is quite interesting. It looks like a deterioration of the 'two party system'. Votes are being siphoned off to independent candidates. These candidates can narrow-cast to their electorate alone. They do not need to walk the tightrope of balancing conflicting views between regional and urban votes (particularly with regards to climate change). This is something that the major parties have struggled to negotiate in recent years.

Australia has had fire, flood, pestilence and plague in the past three years (our electoral term). We have had a parliamentary #MeToo movement. We have had a deterioration in confidence in our parliamentary integrity (corruption). I put it to you, the reader, it is impossible to pull apart the sum of these issues from the whole. The net effect of that sum, is that the voting public has losts its confidence in the incumbent/previous Government.

If anybody thinks this is a political statement. I refer back to my previous observation:

"Oppositions dont win elections; Governments lose them".

I think it is difficult to paint the current numbers in a different light.

 

[MarcelNL]

A move to one person fractions seems universal, not that is works as the process of reaching agreements becomes increasingly difficult. To me the system needs a change, from party politics to having the public vote for choices more like the Swiss do.

The covid situation in Germany was interesting, a mask was supposedly only required on local public transportation but nowhere else...had I known that we would sit 4 hours in the high speed train wearing a mask I'd have opted to drive the 6 hours to Munich.
For now Monkey pox appear to become a new potential issue, not sure how that comes about....from monkeying around too much?

 

[Jovidah]

For all the problems party politics have... I'm not sure having individual referenda is really the answer. It makes it impossible to do popular but necessary policies, it creates a massive opportunity for disinformation and manipulation campaigns to sway the public, and most of the time, especially on more technical issues, most people simply won't have a clue what they're voting on, or they're making choices based on false believes and assumptions.
Direct democracy only really works if you have a truly informed public... which is sadly not the case when it comes to a lot of issues.

Monkey pox... it's all speculation but I know of one potential source... and the timing is to say the least rather remarkable:
https://www.nonproliferation.org/wp-content/uploads/npr/alibek63.pdf
But it could simply be imported the regular way from abroad. I can imagine health authorities are busy tracing it all back at this point.

 

[Luftmensch]

A move to one person fractions seems universal, not that is works as the process of reaching agreements becomes increasingly difficult.

Maybe... There are two ways to paint this. One is that consensus is too difficult to reach - nobody has enough clout to pass legislation. The other is that forcing the majority party to negotiate means we end up with representative centrist policies - nobody has authority to ram policy through the system.

The bulk of our new independents are called 'teal independents'. They are slated to be economically 'conservative' but socially 'progressive'. Indeed, the teal independents have more or less exclusively picked up traditionally 'conservative' seats. Australia has lagged behind our allies in climate change policy. Suburbanites are punishing the Government for this. Many of the independent swings have occured in traditionally conservative, suburban electorates. This has been done on a platform that includes action on addressing climate change. Like I said before, both parties have struggled to find a middle ground on this issue. It is difficult for them to be 'progressive', they will alienate rural/mining seats. Similarly, if they are too 'conservative', they will lose suburban seats. Independents don't have this problem. They only need to speak to their electorate! This is why you see a swing away from the previous Government towards independents.

Will this create chaos? Will it create difficulty in reaching consensus? It depends which country. It depends who you ask. If you ask *me* in Australia... NO!!!! Yes; every party/representative will be forced to work harder to deliver for their constituents. But that is their job. For the 'average' Australian this ought to mean more representative policy. That said; it relies on our elected representatives having enough maturity to negotiate. For big ticket items.... I do believe this will happen.

It is too early to count our chickens. Majority Labor? Minority Labor? One of them will happen....either way, I have ZERO problem with independent representatives advocating for their specific constituencies.

 

[LostHighway]

covid has changed the world as we know it , and not for good

I'm not sure how much covid has actually changed the world as opposed to just shining a light on human tendencies that were already present but perhaps were a little less publicly visible.

"But what is government itself, but the greatest of all reflections on human nature?” –James Madison, Federalist 51

I can't think of a single national government that has acquitted itself well with regard to covid policy and the behavior of the general public certainly doesn't augur for a brighter future. In the US the performance of the professional technocratic class in the form of the CDC and the NIH haven't exactly inspired confidence either.

 

[KingShapton]

Monkey pox... it's all speculation but I know of one potential source... and the timing is to say the least rather remarkable:
https://www.nonproliferation.org/wp-content/uploads/npr/alibek63.pdf
But it could simply be imported the regular way from abroad. I can imagine health authorities are busy tracing it all back at this point.

Heavy reading!

I knew, superficially, a little bit about biological weapons and related research. But if you read this text, it becomes clear again what kind of sick **** that was and still is!

And considering the cases of monkeypox that are occurring right now.. I really hope that kind of monkeypox is of natural origin!!! I keep my fingers crossed!

 

[user 16756]

I'm not sure how much covid has actually changed the world as opposed to just shining a light on human tendencies that were already present but perhaps were a little less publicly visible.

"But what is government itself, but the greatest of all reflections on human nature?” –James Madison, Federalist 51

I can't think of a single national government that has acquitted itself well with regard to covid policy and the behavior of the general public certainly doesn't augur for a brighter future. In the US the performance of the professional technocratic class in the form of the CDC and the NIH haven't exactly inspired confidence either.

yes, it is so strange to me how people in America especially hate the government while in the next breadth praise America itself.

it's hysterical that the one thing Dave and I agree on is that the current admin (and the last, too) arent addressing covid on the facts, but are instead trying to prevent electoral wipe outs. The number of people who will die to serve the ego of two septuagenarians is disgusting.

oh also on the hospital front, in the US it REALLY isn't helping that so many hospitals have been bought up and brought into corporate hospital firm ways of doing things. the system was always heading for disaster if it ever got stressed. we were piling bodies up in trucks a while ago but no one seems to be out for blood from the people who set us up for that.

absolutely typical

 

[MarcelNL]

A country gets the health care system it pays for....errr the government it votes for, and through that a health care system they pay for...or they don't. I don't think it's fair to put that on the adminstration as it's a system (not) in place for decades.

In the past 2 decades I have worked with hospitals throughout (most of) the world and there are few countries that I know of where healthcare is so F%^$&# up as in the US.

Health Care in the US is ridiculously expensive and revenue focussed while at the same time full of CYA due to the habitual claims culture. There must be as many people without access because they cannot afford insurance or pay directly as there are folks living in one of the largest states (about 1 in 10 I believe is without insurance, at least that percentage appears to be inclusive and diverse...). Let's not even begin to talk about those who are underinsured.

 

[user 16756]

A country gets the health care system it pays for....errr the government it votes for, and through that a health care system they pay for...or they don't. I don't think it's fair to put that on the adminstration as it's a system (not) in place for decades.

In the past 2 decades I have worked with hospitals throughout (most of) the world and there are few countries that I know of where healthcare is so F%^$&# up as in the US.

Health Care in the US is ridiculously expensive and revenue focussed while at the same time full of CYA due to the habitual claims culture. There must be as many people without access because they cannot afford insurance or pay directly as there are folks living in one of the largest states (about 1 in 10 I believe is without insurance, at least that percentage appears to be inclusive and diverse...). Let's not even begin to talk about those who are underinsured.

to be clear Marcel, I would not argue that the US health care system is very good in any capacity (except nominally for some super advanced stuff though that is overblown as researchers around the world are very good too, obviously), but it _is_ also true that most of the hospitals have been aggregated lately and the new owners are not primarily focused on providing excess capacity, or even full capacity.

it's a contributing factor, not the only or even primary one, is what Im saying.

 

[MarcelNL]

to be clear Marcel, I would not argue that the US health care system is very good in any capacity (except nominally for some super advanced stuff though that is overblown as researchers around the world are very good too, obviously), but it _is_ also true that most of the hospitals have been aggregated lately and the new owners are not primarily focused on providing excess capacity, or even full capacity.

it's a contributing factor, not the only or even primary one, is what Im saying.

Sure, I did understand it that way, just that I think/suspect the real problem was not Covid itself or how it was handled...but we'll never know as the 'overage'deaths do include those dying of limited or no access to health care (sure there are numbers on that too).

 

[ReiHamono]

A very interesting read where every point is followed with citations to supporting studies.


As we look back we see that a lot of things that were being labeled as false have become known to in fact be true, and things that were labeled as true have become known to be 100% false.

COVID UPDATE: What is the truth?

“ For the first time in American history a president, governors, mayors, hospital administrators and federal bureaucrats are determining medical treatments based not on accurate scientifically based or even experience based information, but rather to force the acceptance of special forms of care and “prevention”—including remdesivir, use of respirators and ultimately a series of essentially untested messenger RNA vaccines. For the first time in history medical treatment, protocols are not being formulated based on the experience of the physicians treating the largest number of patients successfully, but rather individuals and bureaucracies that have never treated a single patient—including Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, EcoHealth Alliance, the CDC, WHO, state public health officers and hospital administrators.[23,38]”


“Dr. Peter McCullough, one of the most cited experts in his field, who has successfully treated over 2000 COVID patients by using a protocol of early treatment (which the so-called experts completely ignored), has been the victim of a particularly vicious assault by those benefiting financially from the vaccines. He has published his results in peer reviewed journals, reporting an 80% reduction in hospitalizations and a 75% reduction in deaths by using early treatment.[44] Despite this, he is under an unrelenting series of attacks by the information controllers, none of which have treated a single patient.“

“ Previous experience with the flu vaccines clearly demonstrates that the safety studies done by researchers and clinical doctors with ties to pharmaceutical companies were essentially all either poorly done or purposefully designed to falsely show safety and coverup side effects and complications. This was dramatically demonstrated with the previously mentioned phony studies designed to indicate that hydroxy Chloroquine and Ivermectin were ineffective and too dangerous to use.[34,36,37] These fake studies resulted in millions of deaths and severe health disasters worldwide. As stated, 80% of all deaths were unnecessary and could have been prevented with inexpensive, safe repurposed medications with a very long safety history among millions who have taken them for decades or even a lifetime.[43,44]”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9062939/

 

[JASinIL2006]

That journal, Surgical Neurology International, has an impact factor score of .86, which means almost no one cites that journal’s articles in other scientific articles.

It also has an acceptance rate of 100%, which means pretty much any crackpot article can get published in it.

 

[user 16756]

A very interesting read where every point is followed with citations to supporting studies.


As we look back we see that a lot of things that were being labeled as false have become known to in fact be true, and things that were labeled as true have become known to be 100% false.

COVID UPDATE: What is the truth?

“ For the first time in American history a president, governors, mayors, hospital administrators and federal bureaucrats are determining medical treatments based not on accurate scientifically based or even experience based information, but rather to force the acceptance of special forms of care and “prevention”—including remdesivir, use of respirators and ultimately a series of essentially untested messenger RNA vaccines. For the first time in history medical treatment, protocols are not being formulated based on the experience of the physicians treating the largest number of patients successfully, but rather individuals and bureaucracies that have never treated a single patient—including Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, EcoHealth Alliance, the CDC, WHO, state public health officers and hospital administrators.[23,38]”


“Dr. Peter McCullough, one of the most cited experts in his field, who has successfully treated over 2000 COVID patients by using a protocol of early treatment (which the so-called experts completely ignored), has been the victim of a particularly vicious assault by those benefiting financially from the vaccines. He has published his results in peer reviewed journals, reporting an 80% reduction in hospitalizations and a 75% reduction in deaths by using early treatment.[44] Despite this, he is under an unrelenting series of attacks by the information controllers, none of which have treated a single patient.“

“ Previous experience with the flu vaccines clearly demonstrates that the safety studies done by researchers and clinical doctors with ties to pharmaceutical companies were essentially all either poorly done or purposefully designed to falsely show safety and coverup side effects and complications. This was dramatically demonstrated with the previously mentioned phony studies designed to indicate that hydroxy Chloroquine and Ivermectin were ineffective and too dangerous to use.[34,36,37] These fake studies resulted in millions of deaths and severe health disasters worldwide. As stated, 80% of all deaths were unnecessary and could have been prevented with inexpensive, safe repurposed medications with a very long safety history among millions who have taken them for decades or even a lifetime.[43,44]”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9062939/

I have never read a more pathetic account of self victimization in my life

also Eric back on the horse dewormer train lmao. it's retro at this point I guess

 

[gregfisk]

A very interesting read where every point is followed with citations to supporting studies.


As we look back we see that a lot of things that were being labeled as false have become known to in fact be true, and things that were labeled as true have become known to be 100% false.

COVID UPDATE: What is the truth?

“ For the first time in American history a president, governors, mayors, hospital administrators and federal bureaucrats are determining medical treatments based not on accurate scientifically based or even experience based information, but rather to force the acceptance of special forms of care and “prevention”—including remdesivir, use of respirators and ultimately a series of essentially untested messenger RNA vaccines. For the first time in history medical treatment, protocols are not being formulated based on the experience of the physicians treating the largest number of patients successfully, but rather individuals and bureaucracies that have never treated a single patient—including Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, EcoHealth Alliance, the CDC, WHO, state public health officers and hospital administrators.[23,38]”


“Dr. Peter McCullough, one of the most cited experts in his field, who has successfully treated over 2000 COVID patients by using a protocol of early treatment (which the so-called experts completely ignored), has been the victim of a particularly vicious assault by those benefiting financially from the vaccines. He has published his results in peer reviewed journals, reporting an 80% reduction in hospitalizations and a 75% reduction in deaths by using early treatment.[44] Despite this, he is under an unrelenting series of attacks by the information controllers, none of which have treated a single patient.“

“ Previous experience with the flu vaccines clearly demonstrates that the safety studies done by researchers and clinical doctors with ties to pharmaceutical companies were essentially all either poorly done or purposefully designed to falsely show safety and coverup side effects and complications. This was dramatically demonstrated with the previously mentioned phony studies designed to indicate that hydroxy Chloroquine and Ivermectin were ineffective and too dangerous to use.[34,36,37] These fake studies resulted in millions of deaths and severe health disasters worldwide. As stated, 80% of all deaths were unnecessary and could have been prevented with inexpensive, safe repurposed medications with a very long safety history among millions who have taken them for decades or even a lifetime.[43,44]”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9062939/

That opinion piece has to be the most non informative article that I have ever read. Talk about a tasteless non filling nothing burger . And no, even though I’m still hungry I don’t want another one.

 

[Michi]

For the first time in history medical treatment, protocols are not being formulated based on the experience of the physicians treating the largest number of patients successfully, but rather individuals and bureaucracies that have never treated a single patient—including Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, EcoHealth Alliance, the CDC, WHO, state public health officers and hospital administrators.[23,38]”

Right. It's all a big conspiracy. The CDC, WHO, and all these other people are plotting to make sure that as many people as possible die of Covid. Makes perfect sense, doesn't it?

“Dr. Peter McCullough […] has been the victim of a particularly vicious assault by those benefiting financially from the vaccines. He has published his results in peer reviewed journals, reporting an 80% reduction in hospitalizations and a 75% reduction in deaths by using early treatment.[44] Despite this, he is under an unrelenting series of attacks by the information controllers, none of which have treated a single patient.“

Poor Dr McCullough, who is so terribly misunderstood and unfairly prosecuted. He, among other things, has claimed that the pandemic was planned and that health authorities have conspired to prevent Covid patients from getting early treatment. These, and other outrageous claims, have been thoroughly debunked.

This was dramatically demonstrated with the previously mentioned phony studies designed to indicate that hydroxy Chloroquine and Ivermectin were ineffective and too dangerous to use.[34,36,37] These fake studies resulted in millions of deaths and severe health disasters worldwide.

I see. Another conspiracy. Millions of people died because they didn't take medication that doesn't work. Most certainly.

Let me add a little to the list:

• Americans never landed on the moon, that was a hoax.
• The earth is flat.
• 9/11 was an inside job.
• The government is hiding an alien spacecraft at Area 51.

Did I miss anything?

 

[MarcelNL]

It keeps me amazed how much of this fluff floats around, and how the authors always seem to forget the international situation...try coordinate something across a few states, let alone dozens of countries is impossible, not even big old mean pharma can coodinate that...

@Michi I think you summed up the largest conspiracies, Ukrain may surface as another one as the conspiracy theorists seem to be drinking from a similar well about that one too.

 

[Michi]

Ukrain may surface as another one as the conspiracy theorists seem to be drinking from a similar well about that one too.

I cannot wait…

 

[MarcelNL]

well, over here a Summer wave seems to be 'happening' and this likely is the explanation....

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2206576
BA4 and BA5 seem to be good at escaping antibody responses, yet vaccination stil prevents from getting severily ill. Let's hope that is true....FWIW my GF came doen with another case of Covid, and it was worse than last time but still not anywhere near a severe illness.

 

[KingShapton]

The summer wave is also building up here in Germany, you can watch it - both in the official figures and in everyday life.

I find it bad that it was foreseeable when you observed the situation in other countries, but nobody in our population was interested.

In Germany, at least in the area where I live, 95% of the population behave as if there is no more Covid.

Worse, a few days ago we had a handyman at the apartment due to an emergency. My wife asked him to put on a mask at the apartment door and explained to him that I belong to the risk group due to my health condition. The answer was: "Covid?! That doesn't exist anymore, that's over!" She had to have a serious discussion with him so that he would still put on a mask. (Of course we also wore masks).

I totally understand that everyone wishes that Covid was "over" but I just can't understand the ignorance of many people. And that many people do not understand that with their behavior they are contributing to the fact that Covid is not over, or that it is becoming more harmless, i.e. endemic.

Of course, for many people Covid is not that dangerous at first, but for many it is. And then there are the cases of Long Covid - the numbers of them in Germany are also increasing again and there are far too few therapy places. Plus the fact that there are always new mutations that nobody can predict if they are more dangerous than the previous ones.

In summary: Covid is Sh#t but unfortunately so is the behavior of many people!

I have to add something, I'm increasingly noticing that you (here in Germany) are stared at like an alien if you wear a mask in public. It has happened to me and my wife several times that we were made fun of with stupid comments about it....sad and incomprehensible!

The fact that the masks are not comfortable is a fact that most people no longer wear them because there is no official obligation to do so is also a fact It's stupid, stupid but understandable
But that you have to justify yourself for wearing a mask for reasons of your own safety is simply incomprehensible, sad and it makes me more than angry!

How can anyone exercise the right to make fun of another human being who is taking measures to protect himself and his health and that of his family? I just don't get it!!

 

[ReiHamono]

The masks don’t work, everyone is getting sick regardless of wearing a mask or being vaccinated

A vaccination so good you still get sick and you still die, that doesn’t make any sense.

Before anybody had the vaccination the recovery rate was still over 99% depending on your age group and risk factors

The overwhelming majority of people who contract Covid recover just fine regardless.

The same people continue to die regardless of vaccination status, 65 years of age or older multiple comorbidities

99%+ of humanity is still just fine and will continue to be fine regardless of vaccination status or wearing a mask

Everyone at my hospital has been sick with Covid including myself regardless of all the boosters that we have been taking

My colleague’s 85-year-old mother who has well over four comorbidities contracted covid and recovered after receiving anti-viral medicine at Queens Hospital

Her whole entire family became sick with C19 even though they wear masks at home gloves everything as everybody works in the medical field

They have completely done a 180 and change their minds and now see the light ie antiviral treatment at the first sign of symptoms

My colleague’s one year old became ill with C19, she was recovered within three days, my girlfriend got sick she was recovered within three days, virtually everybody I know has recovered within three days regardless of vaccination status

I took two weeks to recover as I had strep (which I tested positive for) on top of the C19. The only symptom I had from the latest Covid strain was severe fatigue with zero coughing or any other symptom

 

[MarcelNL]

nice anecdotes, problem is that the anecdotal evidence that my grandfather who smoked like chimney and did not contract lung cancer in his lifetime does not mean smoking can not cause lung cancer.
Youy are also still ignoring the peer reviewed literature telling a vastly diferent story than what seems to be your rigid opinion.
The earth is flat.

 

[Michi]

The earth is flat.

Yep.

 

[inferno]

it was decided covid19 is done.

the new thing is mopox22

 

[gregfisk]

Just because some people, okay most people are okay after getting Covid doesn’t change the FACT that hundreds of thousands have died FROM COVID. The logic some people try to use to justify their ignorance is mind boggling. My 57 year old cousin almost died from Covid before there was a vaccine. He is still having health issues from getting it almost 2 years ago and spending 8 days in the hospital. My cousin’s friends who belonged to the same church were avid bike riders and in really great shape, yet they both died from Covid. Don’t think about that while you spew your nonsense across the internet though. If masks don’t work then why do surgeons and all of the hospitals staff wear them while taking care of people in the hospital? The lack of common sense from some humans on this planet is astounding. Unfortunately, intelligent humans have figured out how to keep even the dumbest people alive, so it’s no longer the survival of the fittest or the smartest. Too bad...