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mattrud

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I started collecting knives in 2002. Started with King stones, henckels and eventually got a Tojiro Gyuto (Which i still have and is now a Suji).
From then till 2014 basically bought none stop probably topped out around 20 stones and 100ish knives. Go back into the archives to see.

Basically got to a point with which most sit in a closet, which is not what tools are meant for. Moved into more of a corprate roll in 2013 vs being four wall chef. Knives got less use. Only reached for a few.
Sold most but there are a handful I either always reach to or have too much sentimental value to sell.

Doubt I buy another "nice" knife again.
 
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I started collecting knives in 2002. Started with King stones, henckels and eventually got a Tojiro Gyuto (Which i still have and is now a Suji).
From then till 2014 basically bought none stop probably topped out around 20 stones and 100ish knives. Go back into the archives to see.

Basically got to a point with which most sit in a closet, which is not what tools are meant for. Moved into more of a corprate toll in 2013 vs being four wall chef. Knives got less use. Only reached for a few.
Sold most but there are a handful I either always reach to or have too much sentimental value to sell.

Doubt I buy another "nice" knife again.
Good on you for recognizing it. Sometimes I think the things we own, own more of us than we do them (if that makes sense). Not saying collecting is wrong but it can be a slippery slope
 
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So contributing something meaningful, finally. I’m just starting the knife hobby but I’ve exited the pen one and hit my cap on watches. So drawing parallels here (pens are probably better since they fall in closer in price range than watches because there is basically no ceiling on that for 99.9%)

I like to think of it in terms of brackets of value. I think every hobby has clear cut offs in terms of value (each incremental money bracket = greater diminishing returns) so from, from my experience thus far. I think the brackets are (and feel free to correct me I’m still new)

Note brackets are flexible depending on what the item is so makers aren’t strictly in one category or another

( sub 100) - general mass market crap.
200 to 300 - artisan stuff probably most of the Japanese knives that are more mass produced (volume) I think most “normal” people would be just happy here if that can accept the price

500+ - this is where I think most of us knife people sit. We get access to great artisan makers that are attainable and provide great quality with artistry e.g Simon, Kipp, HSC, birgesson, uhh I’m sure there’s way more

800+ (but really I’m thinking like 1k) more artisan stuff. More hand made. More skill etc. you are paying for those small small details. Takes a lot more skill, knowledge and time to appreciate what is being put out here.

2k plus. Don’t know what to say shout it never owned anything here… probably more small stuff than the previous category. And I’m treated more as works of art than functional improvement.

I think where you fall In that region is entirely up to how much you want to leave in the hobby as you “exit”. I think most people would fall in the 500 range. You get a lot for your money before you really see fall off in that second to last bracket. (One could even anrgue 200 to 300 bracket lotta good makers here) Everyone will of course have sentimental pieces that break the “norm” but I’d bet most ex-hobbiests would fall. here.
 

HumbleHomeCook

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So contributing something meaningful, finally. I’m just starting the knife hobby but I’ve exited the pen one and hit my cap on watches. So drawing parallels here (pens are probably better since they fall in closer in price range than watches because there is basically no ceiling on that for 99.9%)

I like to think of it in terms of brackets of value. I think every hobby has clear cut offs in terms of value (each incremental money bracket = greater diminishing returns) so from, from my experience thus far. I think the brackets are (and feel free to correct me I’m still new)

Note brackets are flexible depending on what the item is so makers aren’t strictly in one category or another

( sub 100) - general mass market crap.
200 to 300 - artisan stuff probably most of the Japanese knives that are more mass produced (volume) I think most “normal” people would be just happy here if that can accept the price

500+ - this is where I think most of us knife people sit. We get access to great artisan makers that are attainable and provide great quality with artistry e.g Simon, Kipp, HSC, birgesson, uhh I’m sure there’s way more

800+ (but really I’m thinking like 1k) more artisan stuff. More hand made. More skill etc. you are paying for those small small details. Takes a lot more skill, knowledge and time to appreciate what is being put out here.

2k plus. Don’t know what to say shout it never owned anything here… probably more small stuff than the previous category. And I’m treated more as works of art than functional improvement.

I think where you fall In that region is entirely up to how much you want to leave in the hobby as you “exit”. I think most people would fall in the 500 range. You get a lot for your money before you really see fall off in that second to last bracket. (One could even anrgue 200 to 300 bracket lotta good makers here) Everyone will of course have sentimental pieces that break the “norm” but I’d bet most ex-hobbiests would fall. here.
I would just say that I have multiple sub-$100 knives from low-volume, "traditional" Japanese smiths. They actually have very cool stories and some are quite remote, living in the forests. :)

My most expensive knife is a beautiful custom under $500.
 
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Sigh. Fine. Point conceded. Japan always breaks the curve lol. They give way too much value to everything… cars, watches, fountain pens, stationary. Everything…. Anyways

what I don’t understand is how to can produce higher quality but provide at such a low price (relative)
 
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Do you have a favorite maker? It’s kinda hard to tell
Harbeer's work is outstanding. I haven't owned all of the different premier makers but I have had the privilege of using/trying/handling most of them. Hard to beat the value proposition if you are looking for something custom.
 
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Harbeer's work is outstanding. I haven't owned all of the different premier makers but I have had the privilege of using/trying/handling most of them. Hard to beat the value proposition if you are looking for something custom.
Sorry, I’m was being cheeky. Lol. I actually have a custom already set with him now. After captaincaeds review I had to know.
 
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I would just say that I have multiple sub-$100 knives from low-volume, "traditional" Japanese smiths. They actually have very cool stories and some are quite remote, living in the forests. :)

My most expensive knife is a beautiful custom under $500.
Did you have to put any significant work Into getting them (sub 100) to perform? Or were they good to roll out the box? (Not counting any touch up sharpening or anything).
 
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Came to knives through sharpening … which I’ve done as a pastime for over 60 years. As a home cook I was perfectly happy with my German steel blades. Never had a dull knife. One day I was asked to hand sharpen a japanese steel blade. That opened up a new world for me and I went through a collecting phase of Japanese knives. Still have quite a few of them. Discovered KKF and IG which opened up a collecting phase from western makers. I have quite a few of them and am currently occupied with MS makers. Here’s a pic of some of my favourites …

IMG_9471.jpeg


Looking at it, the picture needs a bit of updating. Some of the knives are gone, a few more added. In addition to these I have pretty deep individual collections from Shiraki, Takeda, Newham, Carter and Alex Horn. One offs or a few from other makers.

For daily users in my kitchen I tend to reach for knives from Carter, Birgersson, Kurosaki, Takeda, TF, Kramer (Zwilling), Horn, and of course my German favourites from long ago. Most of my MS blades are reserved for fondling although I’m not reluctant to use them if the mood strikes me.

Where is my collection headed? I’ll probably stick with blades from the MS makers for a while yet. They have the designation for a reason. They’re driven and their work expresses their philosophies and personalities. There are others, however … amazing makers that deserve attention mostly in the form of one offs or a pair of knives.
 
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Came to knives through sharpening … which I’ve done as a pastime for over 60 years. As a home cook I was perfectly happy with my German steel blades. Never had a dull knife. One day I was asked to hand sharpen a japanese steel blade. That opened up a new world for me and I went through a collecting phase of Japanese knives. Still have quite a few of them. Discovered KKF and IG which opened up a collecting phase from western makers. I have quite a few of them and am currently occupied with MS makers. Here’s a pic of some of my favourites …

View attachment 271281

Looking at it, the picture needs a bit of updating. Some of the knives are gone, a few more added. In addition to these I have pretty deep individual collections from Shiraki, Takeda, Newham, Carter and Alex Horn. One offs or a few from other makers.

For daily users in my kitchen I tend to reach for knives from Carter, Birgersson, Kurosaki, Takeda, TF, Kramer (Zwilling), Horn, and of course my German favourites from long ago. Most of my MS blades are reserved for fondling although I’m not reluctant to use them if the mood strikes me.

Where is my collection headed? I’ll probably stick with blades from the MS makers for a while yet. They have the designation for a reason. They’re driven and their work expresses their philosophies and personalities. There are others, however … amazing makers that deserve attention mostly in the form of one offs or a pair of knives.
true end game stuff here
 

Qapla'

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Came to knives through sharpening … which I’ve done as a pastime for over 60 years. As a home cook I was perfectly happy with my German steel blades. Never had a dull knife. One day I was asked to hand sharpen a japanese steel blade. That opened up a new world for me and I went through a collecting phase of Japanese knives. Still have quite a few of them. Discovered KKF and IG which opened up a collecting phase from western makers. I have quite a few of them and am currently occupied with MS makers. Here’s a pic of some of my favourites …
What are MS makers?
 
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Makers with Master Smith accreditations.

 
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Did a pretty standard trajectory of needing a job and staging under the table of a French restaurant due to needing quick cash. That got me a Tojiro 240 DP after being recommended. Still have the knife and will be the knife that goes with me to the grave due to sentimentality

Upgraded to a Kramer 8” in 52100, thought I had my unicorn knife. Got better on a king 1000/6000 combo but had no idea about thinning, just making a sharp edge

From there, I’ve probably bought and sold 30-40 knives. In regards to workhorse profiles, I’m close to the endgame with Wakui Kasumi, HVB, Shihan, Evan antz, Kippington, Jiro

I’ll be selling others soon to help fund some endgame knives on the lighter end of things. I’ve got two FM’s that I really enjoy and TxK but may head towards Xerxes

Also have a few true customs on the way by the end of the year that hit the boxes of true craftsmanship honyaki / wrought.

The end comes faster than you think. One day your so happy you got a TxK, the next day you realize it may be your lowest tiered knife. You claw, scratch and beg your way to grail knives and then people start privately offering them to you.

It’s a really fun and enjoyable ride, the conversations and relationships are way better than the knives though, as many others have mentioned
 

HumbleHomeCook

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Did you have to put any significant work Into getting them (sub 100) to perform? Or were they good to roll out the box? (Not counting any touch up sharpening or anything).

No, not usually. Now, for sure there is stuff out there that does need a lot of work in this price range but the same could be said of knives in the $300+ range. I've had a couple duds and stubborn ones in the $80-150 range but the majority have been very good. Now, fit, finish and handle materials is where a lot of the "sacrifice" comes in. I've never had one that was wonky or poorly done, just rough and cheap materials like ho and plastic. But I'm function forward so that stuff doesn't bother me. I can smooth a spine and choil in under a half hour, usually under ten minutes. And I dabble in handle making and while nowhere near as good as many others, they make me happy. But the truth is, I don't mind the ho/plastic handles. The plastic I don't love but they are very light and work well with the knives I buy.

If aesthetics are important to you, which is completely valid, then this category of knives will leave you wanting. But they suit me right down to the ground. I love some of the stories around the smiths, especially when I learn more during the transactions. I've never been one to chase a hype train of any sort and prefer the quiet, less assuming paths.

I also have some factory made knives that are very good. They are more in the sub-$200ish range (new) but are excellent performers. Check out an Akifusa or Ashi Ginga. Hard to beat.

I'm sure @refcast could fill pages with all the outstanding "cheap" knives he's experienced. I have a mystery santoku I picked up from him and it is a wicked blade. In terms of pure cutting performance, it may be the best in my collection right now. The wood handles have shrunk and there's some surface scarring on the blade but nothing that impacts the feel or function. He charged me $40!

And my Homi Kajiya nakiri and santoku are right behind that knife and out perform knives I've owned that were 2-3x the price.

Now, there is zero wrong with spending all the money one wants on a blade. In no way do I judge that! Like I said, I'm even sometimes envious of what I see others grab or lust after offerings I see go up (I'm looking at you Merion Forge nakiri) but it's just not my general preference. He doesn't post a lot but @knspiracy has beautiful, sought after, Japanese knives that make my tongue wag. I just know they aren't for me. :)

I think monetary application in blades often, and pretty quickly, transcends performance. Materials, styles, customization, rarity, romance, and so much more can go into it and it's all cool and completely legitimate for the individual.

For me, Knife Japan is my True North for knives. It's typically my first stop now. Not always as I sometimes want things I know Michael won't have but I spend a near unhealthy amount of time perusing that website! 😁

But of course I do splurge once in a while too.

Life is short. Do what makes you happy. :)
 
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It took about 30 knives over 3-4 years but I've pretty much dialed in what I like day to day. Luckily for my wallet, my tastes lean rustic. Having a bit of a workhorse renaissance at the moment but I think a ShiHan and maybe Okubo are the only things I really feel the need to hunt down anymore.

Mazaki, Unshu Yukimitsu, Kyohei Shindo, and Munetoshi have firmly cemented themselves in my lineup. Relatively pedestrian compared to many above but I'm content. I agree with others that the custom process is the most appealing going forward; I get quite a bit of joy using a knife made for me.
 
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You claw, scratch and beg your way to grail knives and then people start privately offering them to you.

Amen. And at first you relish the prospect of that happening, but I’m personally moving towards the stage where I really don’t mind if it slips through the net and value a quality conversation with a knowledgable member more.

The prospect of having some of the grail knives I’ve now acquired for life has also made me realise I need to develop skills to maintain them properly if they are going to keep performing for their entire lifespan.

That’s a more rewarding journey than the pure acquisition side of the hobby for me.
 

shobudonnie

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Gyutos:
-myojin ground denka
-gesshin heiji carbon
-blue 1 kagekiyo

Yanagi:
-ikeda/tosa blue 1
-nakagawa/morihiro blue 1
-Shigefusa kasumi

Workhorse gyuto:
-shihan 52100

Deba:
-Jin mioroshi

Synthetic stones:
-600 synthetic aoto
-king 1000
-arashiyama 1000
-masahiro 3000
-morihei 4000
-gesshin synthetic natural

Natural stones:
-Maruoyama shirosuita
-ohira renge suita
-Shoubudani renge suita
-narutaki suita
-nakayama maruka tomae

Yup. That’s my endgame collection right there.
 

spaceconvoy

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You have my attention, and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
unfortunately they're still packed away since moving, but so far I have (from finest to coarsest): tsushima, cretan, aizu, aoto, numata, ikarashi, other ikarashi, and a binsui. Had a belgian blue but didn't like it. I would get a tajima or natsuya but they're so damn ugly. Next is exploring more oil stones but trawling fleabay is not my favorite so I keep hoping to find something in bst
 

Yoshi

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Gyutos:
-myojin ground denka
-gesshin heiji carbon
-blue 1 kagekiyo

Yanagi:
-ikeda/tosa blue 1
-nakagawa/morihiro blue 1
-Shigefusa kasumi

Workhorse gyuto:
-shihan 52100

Deba:
-Jin mioroshi

Synthetic stones:
-600 synthetic aoto
-king 1000
-arashiyama 1000
-masahiro 3000
-morihei 4000
-gesshin synthetic natural

Natural stones:
-Maruoyama shirosuita
-ohira renge suita
-Shoubudani renge suita
-narutaki suita
-nakayama maruka tomae

Yup. That’s my endgame collection right there.
Omg you've got the myojin denka?!
 

NotAddictedYet

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To be perfectly honest, performance wise I have reached the end of the game long ago. At the very beginning of my knife journey, I bought a Makoto Sakura SG2 gyuto. It's a nice knife but nothing special in terms of looks, f&f or prestige. Many knives later, I still have it and I think it goes toe to toe with much more expensive knives in terms of smiles per cut, don't think I will ever let it go.

I got my hands on Kamon and Heldqvist at the end of last year. That's when I feel I've achieved my little slice of the pinnacle of knife craftsmanship/artistry. I also blew my budget majorly to get these two and had a serious reckoning regarding financial responsibility.

This year I've done decently (for me) on slowing down the purchases. Still have a few makers on my list, but prices has also increased a lot so it's harder to justify. I am totally ok if I won't ever get to try, don't think I've felt this way until this year. Edit: maybe inflation also helped haha

I will say in hindsight, buying knives just to try different steels didn't seem like a worthy exercise. Supersteels is kinda meh in terms of fun value since sharpening & polishing carbon stuff is much more fun imho.
 
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captaincaed

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unfortunately they're still packed away since moving, but so far I have (from finest to coarsest): tsushima, cretan, aizu, aoto, numata, ikarashi, other ikarashi, and a binsui. Had a belgian blue but didn't like it. I would get a tajima or natsuya but they're so damn ugly. Next is exploring more oil stones but trawling fleabay is not my favorite so I keep hoping to find something in bst

How're you feeling about the tsuchima and cretan? I was able to get one if the finer, darker cretan from a member, in around the 5k range. He said he.was a bigger fan of the lighter grey version, a bit coarser.

If you'd like, let me know when you get settled, would gladly send a loaner oilstone your way to try.

Also, wait. Ugly natsuya?
 
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@captaincaed

Uh mid grits. Yeah. ~15 aoto from soft to hard. 2 ikarashi. Orange and white Thai binsui. Khao men. Tsushima. Numata. 2 natsuya. 2 Yamagata kazuma. Ueno. Another numata. Sukegawa aoto. Amakusa. Binsui. 3 aizu. Belgian blue. Washita. 2 Saeki.

Uhhhh. Ikarashi is best for shallow scratches and good enough speed. Softer aoto is best for absolute speed and blending and dark kasumi. Also most aggressive edge. Yamagata kazuma stone is creamiest natural stone I've ever used. Hard to find on the Japanese web.

Kitchen knife wise... Uh, I don't have many I keep. I just try a lot of stuff.
 
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It's been a fun ride. Idk that I'm altogether out, but it is looking like so. I don't know what to say... it's somewhat sad but mostly it's liberating as well. There’s a mature point into this. Then it’s like what we say about more expensive knives: there’s diminishing returns in trying more/too many. It tends to cloud clarity – the desire to try something new again overpowers the pleasure taken in what you have right there, and once you get something new, you might not go back there because familiarity, natural handling, ease of use, can be distorted entirely into “boring” when in that frantic frame of mind. Sometimes you latch upon it, but sometimes you miss it completely.

Yet the process has some importance: there’s too many better things for you out there not to discover at least some of them. The other side of the coin being obviously that you could probably just adapt to what better knife you buy first, if you choose something better indeed. You made it work with worse all of your life! Buuuut... something’s out there that “better” doesn’t even come close to. I’d say the process is even crucial when you come to the often natural point of such a spree: having a custom made for you. If it’s gonna be worth it, you gotta know, really know, what you like. If anything it helps spotting WHO you’d like to deal with most.

What else... Yeah, I can now totally safely browse all my favorite vendors, as well as BST. I don't "attach" myself to what I'm seeing there anymore. I still browse, enough to keep in the loop, so to speak. I do still like the browsing itself, but when there's no drive attached, it's really not the same...

Anecdotally, somewhere in July I seemed to have elected buying a Bunka with a deal on SKS. Looked like fun, but I still didn't feel much of anything. Two weeks later it was like my bank account checking back on me: "We seem to have some extra money set aside there, buddy, what are we gonna do with that?". Well, “we” bought about 12 books and there was still some extra left aside. There are upsides.

Another upside is a “truer” connection – and before anyone gets pissed, I’ll be describing one type of it, but for you it can be something else like collecting many specific units/families, or types, or whatever... but it became “truer”: you were no more purchasing out of the rush of it, but patiently curating them.

Yet reading the other comments here, I realized that amidst a population of folks coming to something like an endgame, there is a decisive tendency to cut down the collection below 10 knives or so because it’s otherwise... aaaah... “inconvenient to manage” if you’ll allow that expression to try and sum it all. I guess I can allow professional cooks with a “home below 10” and a “work below 10” making it 20 but essentially the same.

However, and even more interesting, there is also a definitive correlation of folks buying “cheapest good” because they’re onto something else, which tends to be either making one’s own knives, either major customizations to knives purchased, or both, and all combinations/derivations thereof. The “falling down hobby” transfers onto something healthier, that is at once more difficult, more creative, and at least feeling like being a more productive process to an even better reward.

I tend to be one of the many (I’d say most) that is a bit of all of that. Right now I have 7 and they all get fairly well used. Even those that perhaps were not love at first try - those that would typically go BST within 1-3 months not so long ago - I got familiar with, and they've dug a place by my side. But few have any real hold onto me. The ones that have the most being the ones I’ve done some decisive thinning work on, altering geometry in a no-going-back manner. One of these guys was also rehandled by a close friend of mine – and it’s my cheapest J-blade, and it ain’t going anywhere...

But most if not all I still feel ain’t “ultimate” or “essential”. “Endgame Collection” is not an appropriate wording to me, although I subscribe to the “Endgame” part entirely: that IS exactly the right word for it. The Endgame isn’t a collection however. It is a frame of mind entirely that also encompasses that any of these things ain’t really forever. Not through use and wear certainly, neither by design or need even, yet mostly because the eye of the beholder is just ethereal and temporary after all. The Endgame is seeing that there is NO way to ensure your crown jewel K$ knife won’t be the rusty piece of apparent trash someone on KKF will recognize as potential greatness of the past and make of it his pet project to post about – in 100 years. And by the way, all of what I just described ALSO applies to Chess, if you have a modicum of lateral thinking and knowledge of the game and its evolution.

So this is Endgame for sure where I am concerned - that new reality. I'm celebrating a full six months of "sobriety" as we speak (that's never-seen-before kinda sh!t since I tumbled down in there - meaning I didn't buy any knife since then), and I don’t think I will really buy that Bunka or anything anytime so soon. Not to add up. I might buy and sell - trade "up". I might just sell as well. I figure, most probably. Downsizing, no hyphens, just obvious to do.

So that’s what I wanted to say that may tap into some more collective insight. I’ll post about the knives and a few personal thoughts later on. Strictly personal afterthought, it will be indeed.

Just to make sure this is interpreted to the best of the scope I was having into it: for sure the very lowly priced knives/project knives have no real reselling value. They often need some work, and where you’d be at when selling them, the general crowd might sniff upon. It’d would not only take an understanding buyer to hit some low level scale of a tangible resale value, it would take one that basically is fully on with your work and doesn’t feel like he can do the same or better just buying the damn knife new. Tough crowd to meet on KKF,

But if you’re about to cry and make a stand on grounds of reflective hypocrisy, think twice: the endgame KKF’er has known long before the Endgame that cheap “project” knives, or cheap any knife at all, are a one-for-all move: they never have realistic resale value. They at best add nicely upwards of a proposed bundle, or you’re a KKF-certified grinding/sharpening voodoo that can push it single to satisfactory value. I’m in Endgame never having been any near that much. That’s just how it likely goes.
 
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Strictly speaking for me my obsession / focus has always been on stainless material systems (aerospace grade) given my background combined with a love of cooking and sharpening ... cheap stainless is horrible to sharpen and worse to maintain (but I tried to do it for a long time and then found a Devin).

After a short period I was lucky enough to find Mr. Jon Broida/JKI and that was an epiphany … love that guy & his wonderful family … can’t say enough at so many levels.

My only thoughts are that along this journey you start to look at esthetics whether that is in the overall construct, handle, saya, etc. or are just looking for a unique blade style (for butchering/slicing/etc.) and that took me in many different directions. At some point I then focused on how cool it would be to invest in some of these folks trying to make a living at what I consider an extremely difficult enterprise (knife making). So I reached out and contacted them after all I had some money and they are very cool people ... FWIW - it made a lot of sense for me and it has been very rewarding to be a small "part" of that growth in their business & lives (I do the same things locally trying to help those folks trying to get a footing in what they do if they are good people).

Certainly been a lot of fun … mostly just being a part of a great group of folks … I really hope someday to put together a PNWG but not sure if I could pull that off on the peninsula … TBD

Knives/sharpening/KKF will (hopefully) be a part of my enjoyment for a long time to come … Do I need to get off my a$$ to actually get to Wild Boars ECG … life & work have a tendency to get in the way … but YES is the answer to that ...

Knife wise - not exactly sure how many I have ... sad but true as I have been having to travel too much and not spend enough time cooking ... trying to fix that
 

spaceconvoy

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How're you feeling about the tsuchima and cretan? I was able to get one if the finer, darker cretan from a member, in around the 5k range. He said he.was a bigger fan of the lighter grey version, a bit coarser.

If you'd like, let me know when you get settled, would gladly send a loaner oilstone your way to try.

Also, wait. Ugly natsuya?
I haven't used the cretan with oil so I shouldn't complain but it's not very fast with just water. I like the edge it gives though, really nice for my ginsan.

I don't like the tsushima, I think it's probably too uniform in grit or something but it doesn't give my the bitey edges I'm looking for. I have no interest in polishing btw

And yeah natsuya are pretty in their own way but I don't like the color. Clashes with all my beautiful blue stones
 
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