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This is in some way just part of the human psyche. I don't judge either side, and understand both. But this is why limited editions and other forms of artificial scarcity exist, why stuff is made from other stuff that has no advantage at all, but is just hard to find, and why there is always a step up to literally everything.

There is however a difference in how people deal with this. Some desire something because they strive for the best, some want to complete a collection, some enjoy the hunt, some want to share obtain and share outside of other's reach... and some just want to be envied by others.

The (IMHO) sad part is that this is slowly getting in the way of the average person's ability to be content with their average life.
Just a few generations ago the average Joe was happy being able to make an honest living and putting food on the table every day, and couldn't care less about what some other random dude on the other side of the world thought, owned and was or wasn't able to do/buy.
Nowadays it seems it's not even just the marketing departments of 'Evilcorp' who are putting us up to this, we are doing it to ourselves more and more...
 
Chopper88 said:
This is in some way just part of the human psyche. I don't judge either side, and understand both. But this is why limited editions and other forms of artificial scarcity exist, why stuff is made from other stuff that has no advantage at all, but is just hard to find, and why there is always a step up to literally everything.

There is however a difference in how people deal with this. Some desire something because they strive for the best, some want to complete a collection, some enjoy the hunt, some want to share obtain and share outside of other's reach... and some just want to be envied by others.

The (IMHO) sad part is that this is slowly getting in the way of the average person's ability to be content with their average life.
Just a few generations ago the average Joe was happy being able to make an honest living and putting food on the table every day, and couldn't care less about what some other random dude on the other side of the world thought, owned and was or wasn't able to do/buy.
Nowadays it seems it's not even just the marketing departments of 'Evilcorp' who are putting us up to this, we are doing it to ourselves more and more...
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Meh. "Keeping up with the Jones" has been a thing for pretty much ever. It may have been more local but there have always been people who cared what others think. And coveting dates to pre-Biblical times.

If "Evilcorp" does something it's only because "we" respond to it.
 
Sure I won't deny that, I just feel it's getting worse. Of course people always have liked to have the same possibilities and chances others have which they don't.

I just feel it's getting worse, the 11 year old who doesnt have the latest $1000 iPhone is already the loser of the class.
When I was 11 we just kicked a ball around on some field in the neighborhood and had a good time, and I'm now just in my early thirties.
But this is just my opinion and experience of what I hear from the generations before and after me :)
 
Chopper88 said:
This is in some way just part of the human psyche. I don't judge either side, and understand both. But this is why limited editions and other forms of artificial scarcity exist, why stuff is made from other stuff that has no advantage at all, but is just hard to find, and why there is always a step up to literally everything.

There is however a difference in how people deal with this. Some desire something because they strive for the best, some want to complete a collection, some enjoy the hunt, some want to share obtain and share outside of other's reach... and some just want to be envied by others.

The (IMHO) sad part is that this is slowly getting in the way of the average person's ability to be content with their average life.
Just a few generations ago the average Joe was happy being able to make an honest living and putting food on the table every day, and couldn't care less about what some other random dude on the other side of the world thought, owned and was or wasn't able to do/buy.
Nowadays it seems it's not even just the marketing departments of 'Evilcorp' who are putting us up to this, we are doing it to ourselves more and more...
Click to expand...
I think there's one more motivation you did not list: fear of missing out. It's certainly motivated a number of my hobby purchases.

As for contentment with an average life, I think your lifetime may not yet have spanned something that has a huge effect on that: really hard economic times. It's a real perspective changer, and we're probably coming up on times like that. Get some of that under your belt, and you're likely to wind up like me: content with not much, high motivation to rise, and very, very grateful for any fruits of prosperity that come my way.
 
Yeah I know very well what FOMO is, but didnt want to mention it specifically as I feel it's worthy of a separate discussion on its own 😶
There are way more motivations besides the ones I mentioned, they are just some examples that come to mind.

And you are right, I have never once had to worry about food or a roof over my head, and I am grateful for that alone! I am very well aware of what others have (had) to deal with and have learned to put things in perspective.
 
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Rangen said:
I think there's one more motivation you did not list: fear of missing out. It's certainly motivated a number of my hobby purchases.

As for contentment with an average life, I think your lifetime may not yet have spanned something that has a huge effect on that: really hard economic times. It's a real perspective changer, and we're probably coming up on times like that. Get some of that under your belt, and you're likely to wind up like me: content with not much, high motivation to rise, and very, very grateful for any fruits of prosperity that come my way.
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coming up on? my whole life has been in the bad times it feels like.

as far as contentment goes, I mean sure. I like toys but I could live without most of mine. that said, I dont know why most of us are supposed to be content with so little when we as a species have so much 🤷‍♂️ That one is a conundrum because my perfect life doesn't look like what I have now with even more stuff.
 
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I think everyone should have a Kato in the kitchen, keeps you on your toes
 
tcmx3 said:
ok so that's a lot of words to basically say the utility you seen in a Kato is mainly that other people cannot have one.

you say that not everyone is entitled to try one, I mean that misses the point. there is maybe some truth to that, or at least it's reflective of reality. but that's not enough, you are gaining literal joy and value out of other people not being able to.

I'm not sure what kind of judgment about that you think the rest of us are supposed to have, but for me personally, that's a big yikes.
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Not the point I'm making. I've no joy in other's misfortune, just acknowledging reality. For better or worse, we don't live in a Utopian-Socialist J-knife Universe where everyone gets allotted a Kato-Shig-Kaiju pack if they want.

In some respects—the knife market is incredibly democratic, keys to the gatekeepers requires just money, to unlock the gate; the 'gatekeepers' are equal opportunity sellers. Anyone can have a Kato or Shig if willing to pay what they're worth/valued.

Everyone who wants a Kato/Shig/Kaiju simply can't have one, the demand far exceeds the production. Makes perfect sense, and prudent business to up prices—charge as much as the market supports—which unfortunately filters out people who can't afford. This is true in any business—restaurants, cameras, whatever.

240 Katos seem to go for about $1900 usd on BST—attainable for people who either have a lot of expendable income, or who prioritize landing a Kato at any cost (that's why credit cards exist; or pay in installment schemes). Personally, I don't have kids, or a car, so J-knives probably my biggest money suck. Kato/Shig/Kaiju cost what they cost—if an individual, or vendor sells one for triple what they paid, so be it, it's a way of making a living for some.

The few, the proud, the Kato/Shig/Kaiju owners should bask in the glory of owning a rare or sought after knife—as do people who find an apartment in a cool neighborhood; or get that winning lotto ticket; down a reservation at a restaurant that normally has a months long list; etc.

Honestly, there’re more knives I've missed out on that I care to count—but the elusive ones keep me going. For myself, I see no rush in getting knives—some of the ones I want will probably never land in my kitchen. Patience is a virtue—heck I didn't try my first truffle until I was 30 something!

As with any form of collecting, the hard to find, rare pieces are the dog's bollocks and bee's knees.

FWIW, the 240 Kato was my first wa gyuto, kickstarting a passion, though didn't fully appreciate it until years later—it grew on me, great knife.

[edit] There're more critically endangered Black Rhinos roaming around, than 240 Comet gyutos. I've missed that boat.
 
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DitmasPork said:
Not the point I'm making. I've no joy in other's misfortune, just acknowledging reality.
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really because you stated multiple times you did. should I believe now you or past you?

I really dislike how you are trying to conflate the reality of the market (that not everyone can afford one of these knives) with what the actual problem is here, that you think that that's a good thing. especially going to the politics well, that's pretty cringe.

Most of what you are saying is true and fine, but you are trying to hide behind that to push a line that just isn't kosher; that you gain a lot of utility, maybe it's even the main utility you gain, from knives because other people cannot have them. and again, that's wack.
 
I really cannot believe "it would be nice if everyone could try things" is a controversial statement but I guess it explains a lot tbh about the people clicking like on that
 
tcmx3 said:
I really cannot believe "it would be nice if everyone could try things" is a controversial statement but I guess it explains a lot tbh about the people clicking like on that
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I take his point to be some version of "I like collecting rare expensive things, and I know many other people do too. It is good for us that rare expensive things exist, so we can collect them. The primary point of paying all this money for a Shig/Kato is to bask in the glow of its rarity, so it's fine if such things are inaccessible to most people, since those people are not really missing out on anything."

Compare it to stamp collecting. Do you really care that there are $2000 stamps? Does the fact that such stamps exist harm we poor people that can't afford them?

Heh I've almost talked myself into this position, even though I started out on the other side. To truly embrace it, though, I have to make myself care about Shigs and Katos as little as I care about $2000 stamps. I'm almost there, but not quite.
 
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tcmx3 said:
I really cannot believe "it would be nice if everyone could try things" is a controversial statement but I guess it explains a lot tbh about the people clicking like on that
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Maybe if we stepped down from our moral high ground for a second and acknowledged that most here are collectors, face it we are, we would realize that part of collecting is exclusivity and rarity of whatever it is you are colecting. It is ok to want to own luxury things others can't. Rarity creates its own utility and it is ok. Not a single person has been hurt by not owning a Kato, or an expensive stamp, painting, a Ferrari, etc. Would it be nice if Katos cost $200, maybe would people here lust to buy them, unlikely.

Can we stop jumping all over @DitmasPork for stating the obvious. It would also be nice to not make some far reaching conclusions about his character? Seriously, so now we are going to bash everyone who disagrees with some sort of arbitrary fairness measure? I don't care about Katos at their present price, they are fine knives, but to me the value is not there. I am wrong since most would disagree and the price reflects it. I am not hurt by not owning one, I am not upset with anyone who does own one or ten of these, I couldn't care less. I also couldn't care less if the knives I have are also owned by a million other people, but this doesn't change the fact that for many people exclusivity has value and this is all that was stated and there isn't anything wrong with it. We are talking luxury goods not necessities.
 
ian said:
I take his point to be some version of "I like collecting rare expensive things, and I know many other people do too. It is good for us that rare expensive things exist, so we can collect them. The primary point of paying all this money for a Shig/Kato is to bask in the glow of its rarity, so it's fine if such things are inaccessible to most people, since those people are not really missing out on anything."

Compare it to stamp collecting. Do you really care that there are $2000 stamps? Does the fact that such stamps exist harm we poor people that can't afford them?

Heh I've almost talked myself into this position, even though I started out on the other side. To truly embrace it, though, I have to make myself care about Shigs and Katos as little as I care about $2000 stamps. I'm almost there, but not quite.
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Ian, why go through such efforts to interpret what he's saying, when we can just read what he's saying?

Do I care that there are 2000 dollar stamps? Not particularly, no. Does their existence harm people who cannot afford them? Also no. If a collector said that their main enjoyment of stamps was because other people could not afford them would I think they need to reevaluate their lives?

Yes.

You know, I own a Shig, and I own a Kato. And I own close to 50 natural stones now, many of which are >2K USD. But I would not for a second suggest that my enjoyment of these things would be diminished because someone else could also have some of those things too, because that's, again, wack.
 
tcmx3 said:
Ian, why go through such efforts to interpret what he's saying, when we can just read what he's saying?

Do I care that there are 2000 dollar stamps? Not particularly, no. Does their existence harm people who cannot afford them? Also no. If a collector said that their main enjoyment of stamps was because other people could not afford them would I think they need to reevaluate their lives?

Yes.

You know, I own a Shig, and I own a Kato. And I own close to 50 natural stones now, many of which are >2K USD. But I would not for a second suggest that my enjoyment of these things would be diminished because someone else could also have some of those things too, because that's, again, wack.
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Lemme get that shig
 
tcmx3 said:
I really cannot believe "it would be nice if everyone could try things" is a controversial statement but I guess it explains a lot tbh about the people clicking like on that
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I tend to agree with a fair amount of the views you have shared on the forum, but I’m struggling with this one. Many of us here collect knives, and some of the rarer ones have barriers to entry that are price, supply or both. I have rare sneakers (before the age of bots) that I was so excited to own because of the story or luck in finding them, even if they are just sneakers. I don’t see the big deal to have some pleasure in having a unique item not everyone has, regardless of the reason, as long as someone is not looking down at those who don’t have them.

If he was saying he’s happy that he has shelter and a full belly, but he loathes those who don’t have those basic necessities because it’s their fault they are poor, go after him. But I think you’ve made your point and we can agree to disagree.
 
enrico l said:
Can pull out 50 rocks but not ship a knife :dancingchicken:
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unfortunately you got me.

frankly I dont want to go to the post office much these days as it's a lot more of a pain than it was when I lived in Texas.

I had to mail a guitar bridge assembly to Missouri for a build I'm having done for my birthday and just took PTO that day lmao
 
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