Good tutorial or down and dirty on stone starter set

[duderubble]

This probably exists and I'm just not finding it but I'm looking for some help on stepping up my sharpening game. I have a Lansky style system for my pocket knives and I've used it on my kitchen knives (zwilling pro set and a tojiro nakii). But I'd ike to try stones. I'm thinking the Shapton pro stones but don't know what to get. I was thinking the 320, 1000 & 2000. Beyond that I'm not sure. Should I add a 3000 (or more) or would a leather strop and paste suffice? Also what about a flattening stone will anything do or is there a minimum/recommended basic flattening stone?

I'd also love to see the best videos on sharpening kitchen knives with stones.

 

[stringer]

This probably exists and I'm just not finding it but I'm looking for some help on stepping up my sharpening game. I have a Lansky style system for my pocket knives and I've used it on my kitchen knives (zwilling pro set and a tojiro nakii). But I'd ike to try stones. I'm thinking the Shapton pro stones but don't know what to get. I was thinking the 320, 1000 & 2000. Beyond that I'm not sure. Should I add a 3000 (or more) or would a leather strop and paste suffice? Also what about a flattening stone will anything do or is there a minimum/recommended basic flattening stone?

I'd also love to see the best videos on sharpening kitchen knives with stones.

You can't really go wrong wrong with Shaptons in my opinion. I have several of both the Pro and Glass and like them all. Personally, if I was starting out I would get a Shapton Glass 220 and 500 and a Shapton Pro 2k. With that setup I can do anything from hardcore thinning to a very nice hair splitting kitchen edge. And I wouldn't mess with the strops. But there is a lot of different opinions. I did use them for several years but I haven't used them for several years. Except for straight razors. Atoma 140 is standard for a flattening stone. Loose SiC grit on a granite/marble/slate/glass tile works quicker and is cheaper. Throw a sheet of heavy duty sandpaper down to inhibit tile dishing and speed cleanup.

The best beginner videos are from John Broida of Japanese Knife Imports and Peter Nowlan's Knife Planet series. I think you should be able to find them on Google or YouTube.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

What @stringer said.

Get a universal stone holder in a flavor you like. If you really want to try stropping you can put some car or wheel polish or whatever on some cardboard. Nothing wrong with using a strop when learning but the goal should be to ween off of them and try to do it all on the stones. And if you don't make that, that's okay too as long as you like your edges. So no need to divert funds to one.

Think about where you're going to work and how you're going to deal with the water and slurry.

Also agree with the video recommendations and would add my personal mantra of just say no to Burrfection.

 

[Rangen]

All good stuff on the thread so far, and I yield to no one in my regard for Shapton stones, but...if you're just getting serious, sure, why not try out the strops?

I acknowledge that true mastery would probably involve only stones, but I still take out my strops from time to time. Especially the ones I got from a member here who doesn't seem to be selling them any more.

So...strops. No need to pay a bunch of money. Do not use a hanging strop like the razor types do -- you'll round the edge for sure. Stick with strops on a hard substrate. Personally I would not add paste to leather. Leather has a bit of abrasiveness, just use it as it is to get its virtues. If you want paste:

Buy some ~3x12x1 basswood blanks at hobby lobby or equivalent, and put some 1, 2, 4, or even 8 micron diamond paste on them. You can get it in syringes from Amazon, brand TechDIamondTools, for not much money.

If you have some old jeans, cut a rectangle and glue it to one of those blanks. Optional: Add some Flitz.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

All good stuff on the thread so far, and I yield to no one in my regard for Shapton stones, but...if you're just getting serious, sure, why not try out the strops?

I acknowledge that true mastery would probably involve only stones, but I still take out my strops from time to time. Especially the ones I got from a member here who doesn't seem to be selling them any more.

So...strops. No need to pay a bunch of money. Do not use a hanging strop like the razor types do -- you'll round the edge for sure. Stick with strops on a hard substrate. Personally I would not add paste to leather. Leather has a bit of abrasiveness, just use it as it is to get its virtues. If you want paste:

Buy some ~3x12x1 basswood blanks at hobby lobby or equivalent, and put some 1, 2, 4, or even 8 micron diamond paste on them. You can get it in syringes from Amazon, brand TechDIamondTools, for not much money.

If you have some old jeans, cut a rectangle and glue it to one of those blanks. Optional: Add some Flitz.

I cut a section of leg out of an old pair of jeans and would slip a 10"ish piece of 2x4 inside the "tube" and wrap the denim around it. That was my main strop for a number of years,

 

[duderubble]

Thank you all for the help so far. Exactly what I'm looking for.

 

[daveb]

Can't argue with any of above. But I will add my own spin to the discussion.

The Shaptons are a great choice to jump in. They will serve you as a beginner and not require "upgrade" as you become more proficient. I encourage those new to the game to start with the SG500 and add SP1000 and SP2000. A SG4000 can replace the Pro's in this lineup and is my go to for friends Shun and Shun Lite blades. Either of these set ups will allow you to start by focusing on sharpening the edge. The lower than 500 options are best suited (IMHO) for thinning and I regard that as a second skill set to be practiced after you've become sufficiently proficient with sharpening.

Like others I've played with any number of stops over the years. While I don't dislike them and will occasionally break one out they are not an integral part of my routine. I encourage newbies to get their stone game down first and not let the strop become a crutch.

A Gesshin flattening plate has been in my arsenal forever and I use them often on soaking stones. With the Shaptons you will not have an immediate need for flattening and it can be a deffered purchase.

 

[esoo]

It may be a skill thing but I like the Sharpton Glass 3000 more that the 4000. I find the 3K tooth more to my liking. I suspect the 2K would be just as nicely toothy.

Again, it may be my skill, but I like using a strop. I have a leather strop loaded with 1u diamond paste. When cutting printer paper, I can hear the difference after a light stropping so it does improve my edges.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

A SG500 and 2k will take you a looooong way.

 

[Choppin]

A SG500 and 2k will take you a looooong way.

this! I agree with the other comments here but this sums it up and it’s probably where you want to start.

plenty of good 2k options but a SP or SG will form a very practical and portable S&G set capable of getting nearly anything very sharp

 

[duderubble]

I thought I'd report back on where I'm at. I have in my possession the SP 350 and 2000. I used the 2000 on my Zwilling Pro Santoku and 5 inch prep knives with good results. On my 8" slicer with mediocre results (waiting on the 1000 for another go at it).

On the way from Japan (best price by $20) is the SP 1000. On the way from the US is a SG 500 and a double sided leather strop.

Also on the way from Japan is one of those sets of 5 "damaged" vintage knives (4 santoku and 1 nakiri) to practice on. I have no illusions they're great knives but it should be fun and good practice on abused blades.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I thought I'd report back on where I'm at. I have in my possession the SP 350 and 2000. I used the 2000 on my Zwilling Pro Santoku and 5 inch prep knives with good results. On my 8" slicer with mediocre results (waiting on the 1000 for another go at it).

On the way from Japan (best price by $20) is the SP 1000. On the way from the US is a SG 500 and a double sided leather strop.

Also on the way from Japan is one of those sets of 5 "damaged" vintage knives (4 santoku and 1 nakiri) to practice on. I have no illusions they're great knives but it should be fun and good practice on abused blades.

Why do you think you got poorer results on your slicer and why do you think the 1k will help?

Genuine questions.

What is the slicer?

 

[duderubble]

Th

Why do you think you got poorer results on your slicer and why do you think the 1k will help?

Genuine questions.

What is the slicer?

The slicer is a Zwilling Professional S. I think it needs the edge reprofiled and I'm worried about using the 350 on it. I imagine I could get there with the 2000 but I'll just wait. I'm only getting a burr on one side. It slices a roast or turkey just fine with a few strokes on the steel (and always has), but it doesn't slice magazine pages as cleanly as the other two after this sharpenning attempt.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Like this one?

https://www.amazon.com/Zwilling-31020-201-0-Professional-Slicing-Silver/dp/B0000ACOUQ?th=1
Why are you worried about dropping down to the 320? What does only getting a burr on one side indicate to you?

 

[coxhaus]

Like this one?

https://www.amazon.com/Zwilling-31020-201-0-Professional-Slicing-Silver/dp/B0000ACOUQ?th=1
Why are you worried about dropping down to the 320? What does only getting a burr on one side indicate to you?

Your Amazon is showing different model knives. I tend to like those knives with more black squares on them.
I think of the first image as a slicing knife and the second one as a chefs knife. The slicing one has no black squares colored in.

 

[duderubble]

I

Like this one?

https://www.amazon.com/Zwilling-31020-201-0-Professional-Slicing-Silver/dp/B0000ACOUQ?th=1
Why are you worried about dropping down to the 320? What does only getting a burr on one side indicate to you?

It's the knife below. I assume the apex isn't centered and on one side I'm working behind the edge trying to get down to where the angles I'm cutting will meet in the middle. I would just prefer to wait to use a very coarse stone on what is to me is not an inexpensive knife.
https://www.zwilling.com/us/zwillin...5v6nHPGkaLxhaZPG8eZAWLfBGJ0O_gOcaAsY9EALw_wcB

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

If the grind is indeed uneven, you'll need to grind in new bevels. The 320 is better suited for the task,

 

[ModRQC]

A single SP1K can lead you a long way. A very unexpensive stone to get, in bulks just about anywhere they sell stones, and it does kitchen knives from real raw to real sharp alright.

I mean, you said down and dirty. But it won't be dirty. You don't even have to mind about environment so much - slap an old damped towel down a counter corner, put the rock on, splash and go. You can alternatively sit down on a stool to use the dining table instead, if you prefer.

I started using a serious strop after two years. I don't use it often either. Jeans does it if you need it. I find wearing them is their best substrate but that's just me learning a bit down and dirty.

 

[ModRQC]

I

It's the knife below. I assume the apex isn't centered and on one side I'm working behind the edge trying to get down to where the angles I'm cutting will meet in the middle. I would just prefer to wait to use a very coarse stone on what is to me is not an inexpensive knife.
https://www.zwilling.com/us/zwillin...5v6nHPGkaLxhaZPG8eZAWLfBGJ0O_gOcaAsY9EALw_wcB

The grind is thicker/microbevel more obtuse on one side and your angle is too shallow could be a good bet.

If it really is warped in anyway, there's no harm getting that angle up quite a bit and see if you get a consistent burr on all the edge.

If it's your "bad" side, there could be a bit of getting more practice in with it.

 

[coxhaus]

I

It's the knife below. I assume the apex isn't centered and on one side I'm working behind the edge trying to get down to where the angles I'm cutting will meet in the middle. I would just prefer to wait to use a very coarse stone on what is to me is not an inexpensive knife.
https://www.zwilling.com/us/zwillin...5v6nHPGkaLxhaZPG8eZAWLfBGJ0O_gOcaAsY9EALw_wcB

It reads like it is the flexible version. They make a flexible version and a non-flexible version.

 

[ModRQC]

It reads like it is the flexible version. They make a flexible version and a non-flexible version.

An also quite congruent, excellent point. Especially if it happens on your bad side. Flex is something that needs a bit more care and all that less forgiving.

 

[duderubble]

Gave it another go using the SP 350 then the SP 2000. Not bad. Did the Zwilling Pro 8" chef and paring knife the same way with equally satisfactory results. Thanks again for your help. I have a Tojiro Nakiri arriving today that will be next up.