How important are pre polishers?

[KenjiF]

Does the pre-polish stones matter when doing a Kasumi finish? Is the aim to keep refining a Kasumi with the last few stones or is it really only the last stone that you want to focus the Kasumi on?

I was working under that assumption and focusing on getting a clean 6-8k finish (chosera or Kitayama) then moving to Jnat finishing stone. Randomly testing new stones I was not taking the bevel back to the uniform mirror between Jnat stones and I was noticing Kasumi getting better (mostly on cladding and line). Not sure what to attribute that to so I thought I’d reach out…

Is it worth investing in some mid grid nakato stones for my progression? Should my mentality be refining a Kasumi over multiple stones or just keep focusing on getting as clean a ‘canvas’ as I can on the stones before my finishing stone then aim for the Kasumi?

I plan on doing some tests this week but as I only have synthetics in that mid grit range (that will produce a good base Kasumi) it will be a bit limited…

Thanks!

 

[mengwong]

It's crazy how fast polishing is when you set yourself up with a good base.

I spent all this damn money on Jnats only to have the final polish take 15 minutes if I did synth work right smh

 

[ethompson]

I'll stand by what I said there but elaborate a bit. I think the first and foremost important thing is getting a good clean base polish. Learning what that really, really good base polish looks like takes a lot of practice.

You probably noticed the finish improving because your base polish was getting better and better. If you'd spent the same amount of time working with just the one stone you'd probably see similar improvements in finish.

 

[KenjiF]

I'll stand by what I said there but elaborate a bit. I think the first and foremost important thing is getting a good clean base polish. Learning what that really, really good base polish looks like takes a lot of practice.

You probably noticed the finish improving because your base polish was getting better and better. If you'd spent the same amount of time working with just the one stone you'd probably see similar improvements in finish.

Thanks! That’s a great answer…and what I feared.

 

[user 16756]

well personally I actually prefer two use two naturals in a progression but it's hardly a need.

also my general advice at all stages is that when you think youre done, youre 80% of the way there. I have never regretted spending a bit more time on my current step.

 

[Rangen]

I'll stand by what I said there but elaborate a bit. I think the first and foremost important thing is getting a good clean base polish. Learning what that really, really good base polish looks like takes a lot of practice.

I've been turning this statement over in my mind, and I can't make sense of it, so I wanted to ask. I can see how a technique takes a lot of practice, but how can learning what something looks like take a lot of practice? Why isn't it just "look at a picture of a good example, now you know what it looks like?"

 

[ethompson]

I've been turning this statement over in my mind, and I can't make sense of it, so I wanted to ask. I can see how a technique takes a lot of practice, but how can learning what something looks like take a lot of practice? Why isn't it just "look at a picture of a good example, now you know what it looks like?"

Learning to discern between a 6k finish with a a few remaining 3-4k scratches and one that is very uniform and 6k takes a practiced eye - at least in my personal experience. Especially if you aren't switching between perpendicular and parallel scratch patterns, using hard stones, and examining closely under harsh light it's easy to leave coarser scratches in a base polish. These will show up much more clearly as you transition to a natural.

Its hard to describe and harder to photograph. I've recently started not only alternating scratch patterns between stones but also doing it on the same stone for the first and last stone.

 

[KasumiJLA]

Speaking from my experience but a pre finisher can be interesting in term on finish and how it can be done. Here's an example:

If you polish your kireha on synthetic, let's say Naniwa 6k, you will have a nice mirror base. When going on your final natural it's gonna be kind of "hard" to achieve the results the stone can give you. The surface is too slick and I found that abrasive have difficulty to cut cleanly with reflective surface. It's kinda slip on the bevel if it make sense. This can also been observed with finger stone when working on a mirror surface; it burnish but doesn't cut that much.

If I use a pre polisher like my Tsushima I have two benefits:

1- The hagane can have a beautiful reflection but with some hazy effect, which I do really like. A well-prepared hagane is more likely to have a better result with the final stone.

2- The surface isn't that slick so when I'm working on the final natural it's much quicker and homogeneous. It's like blending two natural stone together and the finish is more ... natural in term of polishing. It is important not to compare natural stones with synthetic ones. A Tsushima is described as a 6k but it's light years away from that! We just have to forget this gradation for naturals and think differently and especially with hardness and grain fineness.

I do agree that the last stone will dictate the finish, but from what I tried, a good pre polisher can do some little magic. The process is more fun and easier than going from a synthetic to natural for finishing a project. That's it's just my 2 cents and with my personal observation.

 

[KenjiF]

Speaking from my experience but a pre finisher can be interesting in term on finish and how it can be done. Here's an example:

If you polish your kireha on synthetic, let's say Naniwa 6k, you will have a nice mirror base. When going on your final natural it's gonna be kind of "hard" to achieve the results the stone can give you. The surface is too slick and I found that abrasive have difficulty to cut cleanly with reflective surface. It's kinda slip on the bevel if it make sense. This can also been observed with finger stone when working on a mirror surface; it burnish but doesn't cut that much.

If I use a pre polisher like my Tsushima I have two benefits:

1- The hagane can have a beautiful reflection but with some hazy effect, which I do really like. A well-prepared hagane is more likely to have a better result with the final stone.

2- The surface isn't that slick so when I'm working on the final natural it's much quicker and homogeneous. It's like blending two natural stone together and the finish is more ... natural in term of polishing. It is important not to compare natural stones with synthetic ones. A Tsushima is described as a 6k but it's light years away from that! We just have to forget this gradation for naturals and think differently and especially with hardness and grain fineness.

I do agree that the last stone will dictate the finish, but from what I tried, a good pre polisher can do some little magic. The process is more fun and easier than going from a synthetic to natural for finishing a project. That's it's just my 2 cents and with my personal observation.

That is exactly what I was experiencing last week. I was taking my synthetics to 6k naniwa chosera and then jumping to asawedo Jnat. Well looks like I’ll need to try some mid grit jnats!

 

[KasumiJLA]

That is exactly what I was experiencing last week. I was taking my synthetics to 6k naniwa chosera and then jumping to asawedo Jnat. Well looks like I’ll need to try some mid grit jnats!

This is exactly the right thing to do, try things out and draw conclusions! Honestly my opinion often changes because I'm still learning and it's part of the process. What is cool with this passion is that there can be 4 different paths to arrive more or less at the same destination.

Also "pre finisher" can be your finishing stone. It's a matter of taste and it's not mandatory to finish a project on a hard Nakayama. An uchigumori is a midgrit stone but can do amazing results with a lot of contrast with a tight scratch pattern. Anyway, I think you got the point here