I want badass nakiri 180 mm +

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Perzua

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Hi folks,

What do you think ? Toyama 210 Nakiri from Maksim or Wat 180 pro (direct buy from Japan extra fees/dutes) or something else ?

I have 165 nakiri and I feel its too short but i like this length and want something longer like 210 mm, im not sure about 180 mm, It will change something ? Mini cleaver/tall nakiri idea is my next goal in my collection.

Now i have:

Nakiri 165 mm HAP40 from sharpedge - nice very thin knife but lots of issues cutting big sweet potatoes
Sukenari Gyuto 210 mm HAP40 and Jiro 270 mm (also need 240 mm)
Suji 240 mm Sukenari HAP40
Petty 165 mm Sukenari HAP40

Knife will be use with harder veggs like carrots, sweet potatoes, root celery, beetroot, parsley root. I now how to sharpen and maintenance carbon steel knifes. Cutting boards are Hasegawa and Asahi. Cash to spend is not a issue I can earn something but i have 600 $ to spend.

Best,
Perzua

Sorry for my english, Im still learning. Have a good day friends.
 
Nice.

Lots of folks including myself are happy with the Wat Pro 180mm. Others are happy with their Toyama 210mm nakiris.

I don't own both so I can't add too much info here, but I wish you the best with your search :)
 
I really like my 210 Toyama. It will be really good on root veg. I’ve heard people also gush about their Wat 180s also.
 
210 Toyama +1

Consensus seems to say Wat Pro 180 is the gold standard - but as the (significantly more experienced) previous posters have mentioned, it's probs going to be a judgment call and what you like in hand.

For me, the root veggie scenario you mentioned with your 165 and the giant cabbages we go through pushed me to the longer length. I'm now obsessed with my 210. That said, I was also 'making up' for missing out on a Dalman cleaver so I could be biased :)
 
I have a Kamo R2 165 and a 180 Toyama, they are both great and both very different. its a pity there is not much discussion here on the differences between Nakiri's - I feel they all get put in the same bucket @nakiriknaifuwaifu thoughts?

The Kamo is small thin and nimble, its great for small ingredients - I mainly use it for making KKF style hassle back potato's with over 50 cuts per potato
The Toyama is the big boy and blows through root vegetables [and everything else] in its way - i think there is a trade off for nimbleness if you go bigger than this

here they are in all of their sharp rectangle glory

20220219_164336.jpg
 
S-Word said:
210 Toyama +1

Consensus seems to say Wat Pro 180 is the gold standard - but as the (significantly more experienced) previous posters have mentioned, it's probs going to be a judgment call and what you like in hand.

For me, the root veggie scenario you mentioned with your 165 and the giant cabbages we go through pushed me to the longer length. I'm now obsessed with my 210. That said, I was also 'making up' for missing out on a Dalman cleaver so I could be biased :)
Click to expand...

So, something better than Wat exist ? Dont like dama etc
 
I'm gonna get borderline heretical and say the Wat 180 is not that great a knife. Had one, it cut fine and was fun to try out but the grind was not nearly as high/convex as my Toyama gyuto and consequentially didn't cut nearly as smooth through tall/dense product. Not a bad knife at current prices but once prices go up I'd have a hard time recommending it.

I have never had the chance to try a Toyama nakiri but have heard anecdotally that the grind is different than Wat Pro and more like the gyuto... If that's the case that would be my preference by a long shot.

Also... if you want a nakiri verging on small cleaver, why not just get a small cleaver?
 
You mentioned something cleaver esque or nakiri/cleaver, so I would go with the 210 Toyama. I didn’t want to take a hard stance since I haven’t used the 180 wat. But the 210 toyama has a different feel than other 180 nakiris that I’ve used. It does start to blur the lines a bit, but it’s still a nakiri. It’s not tall enough to be a cleaver. But it does give you some power kind of like a cleaver but still nimble and lighter than most cleavers. The 210 nakiri was easily my favorite Toyama. Its the only Toyama that I kept, eventhough I did like the gyutos. I do agree with the below statement that you could go right into a minicleaver like a 180 togashi or something. But if I only had a few knives I could use my 210 Toyama nakiri as a daily driver. You will love it through dense veg. Also might be my favorite knive to roll cut bulk peppers. Food release isn’t its strong point but it’s a really, really pure cutter.
timebard said:
I'm gonna get borderline heretical and say the Wat 180 is not that great a knife. Had one, it cut fine and was fun to try out but the grind was not nearly as high/convex as my Toyama gyuto and consequentially didn't cut nearly as smooth through tall/dense product. Not a bad knife at current prices but once prices go up I'd have a hard time recommending it.

I have never had the chance to try a Toyama nakiri but have heard anecdotally that the grind is different than Wat Pro and more like the gyuto... If that's the case that would be my preference by a long shot.

Also... if you want a nakiri verging on small cleaver, why not just get a small cleaver?
Click to expand...
 
Given your tasks, the kind of nakiri I'd get is a Chinese cleaver. Something like the Sugimoto #6 would do those jobs better, at least in my hands.

I admit I'm a cleaver guy, and therefore highly biased, but to my eye, your post screamed "I really need a Chinese cleaver."

Watanabe also has a couple of cleavers on his site (look under "Special.") These are great cleavers; I have three in different sizes/weights. Rumor is that they are made by Toyama. Only drawback is that of the two that remain, one has orange scales, and the other has pink scales.
 
I tried a Toyama 210 and didn't really like it at all. Too big for a nakiri and too small for a Chinese cleaver type knife. I'm sticking with my 180 Wat and a 170 model from knifejapan.com. Not sure who the maker is but its a small shop the owner of knifejapan works with. As for my Toyama, another member of this forum has it now.
 
I had a Wat 180, sold it. Now using Toyama 210 and the best one in my opinion the Beasty, but still fine cutting Kaeru WH Nakiri 180.

SirCutALot
 
I'd try to figure out if you wanted a Japanese made cleaver (chuka bocho) or a chinese one and then grab whatever looks best to you. Chinese Chef's Knives are quite varied in weight/thickness/grinds so I'd probably start by grabbing a few different sizes of chinese made ones and if the general profile appeals to you, then hop over to see if you appreciate the charms of a chuka. This is as good a place to start as any to do some reading:

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/been-a-while-since-we-had-a-cleaver-chat.49526/
 
Perzua said:
Wat pro 180 mm ordered. Next knife Gyuto 240 mm and cleaver. Any suggestion ?
Click to expand...

For the gyuto Black Lotus, Xerxes, Kamon, or Shigefusa.

Just kidding - your question is so wide open you’ll just get a random list of people’s personal favorites ranging from $200 to $2000. You might want to start a new thread with the questionnaire filled out to narrow it down.
 
I'd have to agree with the cleaver guys, unless you're willing to try an extra height nakiri like a Shiro Kamo 65mm AS Nakiri...but it's still 165 length. I bought a Hinokuni 210 for less than a hundred and sent to a friend in Canada and asked him to go to town on it.
20220310_092449.jpg
 
Philip Yu said:
I'd have to agree with the cleaver guys, unless you're willing to try an extra height nakiri like a Shiro Kamo 65mm AS Nakiri...but it's still 165 length. I bought a Hinokuni 210 for less than a hundred and sent to a friend in Canada and asked him to go to town on it.
View attachment 169349
Click to expand...

I kinda suspect that handle alone is worth more than $100.

....and if it's not where can I get one? ;)
 
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