In your opinion which blacksmiths heat treatments stand out to you?

Discussion in 'The Kitchen Knife' started by Daizone, Apr 24, 2019.

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  1. Apr 24, 2019 #1

    Daizone

    Daizone

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    I know this has probably been posted before and is a very subjective question but I was just wondering in your opinion which blacksmiths have stood out to you for a particular heat treatment of any particular steel? Anything from W1, W2, B1, B2, AS, any of the semi stainless, etc. I am mainly talking about heat treatment of the steel and not the grind etc if the final blade which plays a large part in the final overall performance of the knife.
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2019
  2. Apr 24, 2019 #2

    chinacats

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    For blue 2 i like Watanabe @ ~65 and Tanaka @~62
     
  3. Apr 24, 2019 #3

    JBroida

    JBroida

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    for me, semi-stainless steel from heiji has always been something special... there are of course many others that i like, but this is a special one even within that group for me
     
  4. Apr 24, 2019 #4

    panda

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    i'll piggy back on this and say BOTH of the steels heiji works with are special. the other being iwasaki which as far as i know only one other maker works with (shigefusa)
     
  5. Apr 24, 2019 #5

    hititlong

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    This is a much needed thread - surprised one hasn't been made yet
    The ones I've come to understand purely based on reading threads and trying out friends knives are as follows:

    Hitachi White #1: Carter/Muteki - tried using and sharpening a friend's neck knife, it was AMAZING
    Hitachi White#2: ???
    Hitachi Blue Super (AS): ???
    Hitachi Blue #2: Watanabe?
    52100: Marko? Burke (don't know if he has widely used chef knives out there)?
    1095: Kippington?
    AEB-L: DT, Dalman?

    Would love it if everyone can chime in and add to the list. Obviously, this will be very subjective and ultimately no comprehensive judgment on the skills of the mentioned bladesmiths.
     
  6. Apr 24, 2019 #6
    I also really like the HT Carter puts on his white#1 kitchen knives. I totally love the HT from Bryan on 145SC - really hard, but still feels great on stones.
     
  7. Apr 24, 2019 #7

    lemeneid

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    I love TF’s White#1 and AS heat treats. As far as Blue#2 goes, you can’t beat Wat/Toyama.

    Haven’t really tried out that many knives but I’m definitely interested in trying out Heiji’s carbon. Also maybe a Tsukasa Hinoura.
     
  8. Apr 24, 2019 #8

    Migraine

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    Catcheside 1.2442.
     
  9. Apr 24, 2019 #9

    Corradobrit1

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    My 2p:
    TF: W#1, AS (proprietory formulations, not off the shelf)
    William Catcheside
    Trey Richbourg (Comet)
    Bryan Raquin
    Xerxes (not Primus line)
     
  10. Apr 24, 2019 #10

    minibatataman

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    For white #2 I'd say munetoshi is pretty special, even at such a lower price point
     
  11. Apr 24, 2019 #11

    Xenif

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    Heiji Semi Stainless has my vote for one of the best for sure. Of the whites Ive tried, Hinoura W1, honourable mention to Munetoshi HT of it, if you like it hard. I also like Tanaka B2, but only after i found a good combo of stones for it.
    Which goes back to why I love HeijiSS, it seems to take any stone
     
  12. Apr 24, 2019 #12

    panda

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    mizuno shirogami 2 honyaki heat treat is primo:)
     
  13. Apr 24, 2019 #13

    valgard

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    Of the Japanese stuff I have tried Toyama/Watanabe and Togashi's blue steel. I think slight edge for Watanabe/Toyama.

    I don't have as much experience with western makers but 1.2519 from Halcyonforge is one of my overall favorite steels. SC145 from Bryan Raquin (very very hard), and W2 and 52100 from Comet are top stuff too.
    Definitely have Heiji high in my list of must try, only have had brief encounters with a couple of their cleavers so far.
     
  14. Apr 24, 2019 #14

    labor of love

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    For those that might be interested in Heiji...look under the sale section at JKI. Jon has some Heijis 20% off.
     
  15. Apr 24, 2019 #15

    Daizone

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    Hmmm may have to check out this Heiji semi stainless sometime. I’ll try to accumulate a list together and update the first post in a tldr for people when I can get some time to spare.
     
  16. Apr 25, 2019 #16

    refcast

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    I recommend both Heiji steels as my favorite carbon and non-carbon. Over both TF. Same general category though. Watanabe steel in a different (horizontal, mostly) category.

    Heiji semistainles steel is like if you conglomerated a whole bunch of (Japanese blacksmith-oriented) steel properties together and compromised them into one performance steel and heat treat. So it's kinda stainless and kinda carbon and kinda highly alloyed and kinda not. Kinda PM-like in edge retention, but kinda carbon like in edge taking. Heiji carbon is like that, just more stereotypical carbon properties. Of course, its on the harder side with not toughness-first qualities (not that those are always exclusive). I like the carbon better though, cause I like the carbon properties more.

    I'm also pretty interested in Joe Carlton's steel right now. Eventually want to get something by him.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2019
  17. Apr 25, 2019 #17

    slickmamba

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    Munetoshi W#2 takes and holds an edge incredibly
     
  18. Apr 25, 2019 #18

    hititlong

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    Any opinions on AEB-L and powdered metals?
     
  19. Apr 25, 2019 #19

    labor of love

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    In the last couple of monthes I’ve been using takamura hsps pro and blazen, both of which are great examples of R2. Both knives are too new to me to really give a comprehensive overview but they aren’t hard to sharpen at all and have really really good edge retention.
     
  20. Apr 25, 2019 #20

    Stonetherapy

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    I have a small nakiri, vegetable gyuto/petty?, and a paring knife, all in 1095 by Joe Calton. I am astounded at the edge-taking ability and retention of all of them.
    Was just thinking recently that his HT must be exceptional.

    Is this who you are referring to?
     
  21. Apr 25, 2019 #21

    F-Flash

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    Why not primus? I think its amazing.
     
  22. Apr 25, 2019 #22

    Tanalasta

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    For the uninitiated, how does one tell the quality of the heat treat from the end user viewpoint?
     
  23. Apr 25, 2019 #23

    lemeneid

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    The knife becomes easy to sharpen even at high HRC, doesn’t chip easily, and has amazing edge retention.
     
  24. Apr 25, 2019 #24

    Corradobrit1

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    Sums it up for me succinctly, although I'd add grind/profile will also have a role.
     
  25. Apr 25, 2019 #25

    refcast

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    Yeah, Joe Calton, I misspelled. Could you describe how the steel is like compared to some Japanese ht/steel? Based on what I'm reading and seeing, it might be in the Heiji/TF category but tougher and maybe slightly harder.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2019
  26. Apr 25, 2019 #26

    Nemo

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    I'd also add that it affects the feel or feedback that you get while sharpening.
     
  27. Apr 25, 2019 #27

    Migraine

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    Yeah, it just feels nice.
     
  28. Apr 25, 2019 #28

    labor of love

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    The akebono line from K&S has a wonderful heat treat. From Sakai jikko and forged by shiraki. Blue 2 but miles apart from watanabe or Toyama, sharpened up almost like wh2. Still had the kinda of edge retention you would expect from a blue 2 gyuto.
     
  29. Apr 26, 2019 #29

    Nemo

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    This.

    Very creamy sharpening feel. Good edge retention. A tremendously under-rated knife. It's the only knife that I have 2 examples of.
     
  30. Apr 26, 2019 #30

    labor of love

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