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big D

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Thinking of adding one for myself along with an order I may be placing.
KDS 1000 / Hyper 1000 / Hyper 1000 Soft /

Mentally I understand the difference between the Hyper normal 1000 and the KDS
How does the KDS cut on HSPS steel....very poorly/poorly/does okay?
What is the difference between the Hyper soft in comparison to the normal Hyper and the KDS in terms of cutting speed and contrast?

edited to add - Any one use the Hyper 2K? never hear anything about that one..any input?
 
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Ruso

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KDS is combination stone, is not it? I would not bother with it at all. Get a 1K and then Rika 5K (not king).

There were few posts in the past comparing Hyper soft to normal. I believe there were not that much difference but my memory might be corrupted. You can use a search or google search.
 

big D

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KDS is combination stone, is not it? I would not bother with it at all. Get a 1K and then Rika 5K (not king).

There were few posts in the past comparing Hyper soft to normal. I believe there were not that much difference but my memory might be corrupted. You can use a search or google search.
Well you may be correct. In my searching I have never found a King 1000 stamped KDS other than as a combo, however I have stumbled across several places while looking for another stone, which sold King 1000 stamped as King Deluxe Stone. I thought they would be one and the same, but perhaps not?
As far as searching, before I ever created this thread I searched on line and found little other than a comparison between Hyper normal and KDS. This why I have a mental understanding between those two stones. The hyper soft simply said it was more friable than the normal. It did not speak of any difference of finish or cutting between the two, nor a reference to the KDS. I also searched here in this forum and all forums and came up with nothing. I also recall seeing at least comments about Hyper stones, but apparently I stink at researching, hence here I am.
Thank you very much for responding and the attempt to help, It is appreciated.
D.
 

Ruso

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Kind Deluxe is falling out of fashion/favor and King hyper is the one I would buy now. Deluxe is a nice feeling and very muddy stone. It is relatively slow but provides good feedback. If you are planning to sharpen mostly simple carbon knives, Kind Deluxe is a decent cheap option. However, by the looks of it, you have more complex steels in mind, so you probably should go hyper route if King is what you are after. Get a normal one, seems to be the defacto good stone.
 

kayman67

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Why these exactly?
If I remember correctly, KD/S is short for King Deluxe with a Super Finish side.
But, as I've read this, any King 800 makes much more sense than any 1000. And than some other options as well. Obviously, for your apparent needs, I would consider Neo 800 directly.
 

M1k3

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KDS= King Deluxe Stone. Not necessarily the combo 1k/6k which comes in the KW-45 which is not the deluxe line.

If you're sharpening tool steels like R2/SG2 or SRS-15, you can get away with any of the King stones. But if you're sharpening tool steels with 4+% vanadium, I'd look at Silicon Carbide, CBN and diamond stones/plates.
 

kayman67

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That's because it's believed that they don't have the exact same structure, the "normal" 1000/6000 compared to KDS one. That's what King called it, KD/S.
SmartSelect_20200808-202735_Chrome.jpg
 

inferno

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Thinking of adding one for myself along with an order I may be placing.
KDS 1000 / Hyper 1000 / Hyper 1000 Soft /

Mentally I understand the difference between the Hyper normal 1000 and the KDS
How does the KDS cut on HSPS steel....very poorly/poorly/does okay?
What is the difference between the Hyper soft in comparison to the normal Hyper and the KDS in terms of cutting speed and contrast?

edited to add - Any one use the Hyper 2K? never hear anything about that one..any input?
i have the hyper 1k hard/normal. and its the only soaker i have saved. it cuts all steel. release a bit of mud, but not too much. its about as fast as all other quality 1k stones. makes a good-ish kasumi haze. the 2k could be very interesting but i'm unsure if i want more soakers since they take so long to dry.

it was softer than the JNS 1k (old formula) and i preferred it over the JNS. the JNS would probably last a lot longer though.

i also had the naniwa hibiki 1k, another soaker, and that one release no abrasives at all. it was also ultra hard, i liked it but gave it away. dont like soakers i guess.
 

big D

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@Ruso - Thank you for dropping back in and giving your input.

Why these exactly?
If I remember correctly, KD/S is short for King Deluxe with a Super Finish side.
But, as I've read this, any King 800 makes much more sense than any 1000. And than some other options as well. Obviously, for your apparent needs, I would consider Neo 800 directly.
Hi kayman - Well to start I have been wanting to add to my shaptons something in the 1-2 k range, either are workable for different reasons, and something above my 4k...so 5 or 6k. So that explains the grits, and I am only considering getting one for myself, to simply to raise the price to catch a sale and make free shipping from MTCKitchen while trying to get my daughter set up. As far as brand, it stems from simply trying out another brand along with an eye towards looks on the side of a blade though at this time it is not a high priority, it would be nice. From a discussion I had with someone about stones for my daughter king was recommended, and from the discussion and the search to find the specific grits, when I was at MTC and found out I had to fill the cart, I figured why not give the King a try to get a feel of what a soaker does. So I looked at the kings and here I am. While the hyper 2k is easy enough I figured I would try to see if I could get a better understanding of the choice between the other 3. If the soft or KDS doesn't do anything special, then I will probably go with the 2K for the edge.

That's because it's believed that they don't have the exact same structure, the "normal" 1000/6000 compared to KDS one. That's what King called it, KD/S.
View attachment 89745
So the normal series is the K series?

KDS= King Deluxe Stone. Not necessarily the combo 1k/6k which comes in the KW-45 which is not the deluxe line.

If you're sharpening tool steels like R2/SG2 or SRS-15, you can get away with any of the King stones. But if you're sharpening tool steels with 4+% vanadium, I'd look at Silicon Carbide, CBN and diamond stones/plates.
Hi M1k3 -Thanks for the confirmation and the heads up on steels. I am fine then as far as steel types I own.

i have the hyper 1k hard/normal. and its the only soaker i have saved. it cuts all steel. release a bit of mud, but not too much. its about as fast as all other quality 1k stones. makes a good-ish kasumi haze. the 2k could be very interesting but i'm unsure if i want more soakers since they take so long to dry.

it was softer than the JNS 1k (old formula) and i preferred it over the JNS. the JNS would probably last a lot longer though.

i also had the naniwa hibiki 1k, another soaker, and that one release no abrasives at all. it was also ultra hard, i liked it but gave it away. dont like soakers i guess.
Hi inferno- thanks for sharing your experience with the various stones. Appreciate your joining in. I don't foresee any issue's with having to soak prior to sharpening, and my stones are always open to air so that shouldn't be a problem for drying either.

Thanks to all
D
 

kayman67

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Softer King stones are great for beginners, as first step towards best possible practice. If this won't be the case, then other options are available.
 

big D

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Softer King stones are great for beginners, as first step towards best possible practice. If this won't be the case, then other options are available.
Though still playing around with things I have picked up, on an edge I am very comfortable. For scratching up the side of a blade I am a babe in the woods.
 

kayman67

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You really need to find your rhythm. That's all. Something you enjoy doing is much more important than anything else. That's why really most people like different stuff so much. If you don't like doing it, well, it gets problematic in all kinds of ways. That's why I try to consider perspectives and what might actually have the best chance of geing used in the first place. It's very easy to pile up stuff.
 

ma_sha1

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Though still playing around with things I have picked up, on an edge I am very comfortable. For scratching up the side of a blade I am a babe in the woods.
I suggest DMT angle guide, under $20, it’ll save you from scratching up blades again.
 

big D

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You really need to find your rhythm. That's all. Something you enjoy doing is much more important than anything else. That's why really most people like different stuff so much. If you don't like doing it, well, it gets problematic in all kinds of ways. That's why I try to consider perspectives and what might actually have the best chance of geing used in the first place. It's very easy to pile up stuff.
I couldn't agree more with you. I am not happy with a 800 finish on anything including very inexpensive stainless. I am also finding that I prefer an edge with more tooth than a 4000 gives me, as such in both cases I resort to trying to refine the edge with the 4k. I am also ready to start a very light thinning on one knife and an extremely light thinning/maintenance on another.

I suggest DMT angle guide, under $20, it’ll save you from scratching up blades again.
ma_sha1 - I apologize to you for my cryptic writing. My edges are crisp, clean, and precise. I do not scratch the blade from putting an edge on it. Scratching the blade is about thinning and geometry maintenance done by laying the face of the blade on the stone. I have thinned some knives prior to owning Japanese knives, but they were very inexpensive and I didn't care about anything other than making them thinner. No thought to appearance, evenness of distance from the edge, or anything else. This will be new territory for me, doing it well.

Thank you Gentlemen
D.
 
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