KKF's Favorite Stainless Steels?

[bradmacmt]

So I'm looking for a Stainless 165mm Santoku for my wife. She's not precious with knives (ie, a nice way to say she's a barbarian who isn't allowed to touch my knives). She currently has Shun VG10's, but I sort of despise that steel and would like to get her something else.

What Stainless Steel's should I consider? I assume Ginsan would be at the top of the heap? Other's? Powdered Steels?

Thanks...

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

In that scenario, if she's that hard on knives, I think the big German brands are viable. AUS-8 would be another candidate. You're looking for softer steel that can take abuse not harder steel that is likely to chip.

I know sharpening softer stainless sucks, as can VG-10, but how sharp do these need to be? My wife likes the Pro M knives:

https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll...JZB-tfbLGsiNNXgUNg577Q-_6iNUyRxih1GvEGuIRrM78

She isn't terrible on knives but this makes a nice general use knife for her. Not terrible to sharpen up to around 500-600.

Of course, these are much different than my favorite stainless steels. Answering more for the specific scenario presented.

 

[deltaplex]

I like SG2/R2 better than Ginsan, personally

 

[deltaplex]

Even something like Mashiro's MV would work really well for what you outlined

 

[Just a DK]

I mean based on what makers use its gotta be AEB-L.

Buy the knife not steel!

 

[deltaplex]

AEB-L and Ginsan are essentially the same, iirc

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

AEB-L and Ginsan are essentially the same, iirc

Yep.

https://zknives.com/knives/steels/steelgraph.php?nm=AEB-L,Ginsan&ni=878,5008

 

[Just a DK]

AEB-L and Ginsan are essentially the same, iirc

Yep - Aeb-L, Ginsan, 14c28n (maybe lil diff, but marginal differences here)... Especially if the person using it is not precious with knives and you want to possibly avoid chipping the knife, I'd stick with these...

Something bit thicker too, like the K sab 200 series, I think complaint is f&f varies and its gotten thicker, but for someone who uses knives carelessly, a bit thicker bte 14c28n (with its little extra corrosion resistance) could be good.

 

[SwampDonkey]

I like both AEB-L, ginsan and lot. Softer ginsan doesn't hold an edge particularly long but on the harder side I've really enjoyed it. R2/SG2 isn't bad but definitely takes more time to properly deburr. VG7 from Makoto was surprisingly pleasant too, quite tough.

@Barmoley lent me an S35VN gyuto to try and I really liked that too. Easy to sharpen on standard synthetic stones (Chosera), noticeably more so than S30V.

 

[aporigine]

AEB-L and Ginsan are essentially the same, iirc

Aeb-l can be taken harder (edit: not so sure after seeing the composition graph above) and is a bit finer-grained, but can easily lose its temper on a hot belt. Ginsan is a bit more forgiving under the sort of use described.

However Just a DK is right. The knife, not the steel.

Anyone know a less-expensive maker whose Ginsan is good?

 

[Barmoley]

AEB-L and Ginsan are essentially the same, iirc

Technically AEB-H and ginsan are essentially the same, AEB-L is different enough that I wouldn’t say they are the same.

 

[SwampDonkey]

Aeb-l can be taken harder (edit: not so sure after seeing the composition graph above) and is a bit finer-grained, but can easily lose its temper on a hot belt. Ginsan is a bit more forgiving under the sort of use described.

However Just a DK is right. The knife, not the steel.

Anyone know a less-expensive maker whose Ginsan is good?

I absolutely love Shigeki Tanaka's ginsan. That sweet spot of hard enough for nice edge retention but not chippy. Great bang for buck

 

[daveb]

Sounds like a job for a MAC Pro. Don't know (don't care) the steel. Bulletproof knife.

https://www.amazon.com/Mac-Knife-MS...se&keywords=mac+santoku&qid=1727454330&sr=8-1

 

[Blumbo]

technically semi-stainless, but unless you're abusing the hell out of them, SLD and SKD I find are typically taken a little harder than ginsan, feel better on stones, takes toothier edges and have slightly better retention. Anything from yoshikane or the folks that left to go out on their own have been great in my experience.

 

[jaydee]

Sharpening angle plays quite the role here too. Steels are overrated.
That said VG10 can be quite brittle.
Usually not a steel you want to put too acute an edge on.

I have a Kanehide Bessaku which steel I really like (semi stainless). It's thin but I often use it as a beater without problems. They do western handles as well and stainless. Lot of knife for the money.
I would suggest nothing too hard for a beater knife.

My gf uses a SK mono steel gyuto. The patina is kinda lemon proof now.

 

[fortheloveofmoar]

Cruwear for me. HSC makes a mean cruwear. Edge life for ever. Takes a keen edge. And is tough. Not cheap but well worth it. HSC is a great maker producing some premium stuff. Harbeer (the maker) is also a super nice guy, easy to work with and responsive.

 

[gentiscid]

Get her a Victorinox. Cheap and will take sink abuse.

 

[mockit]

AEB-L. Magnacut. CruWear (semi-stainless). SKD (semi-stainless). Easy.

 

[jedy617]

magnacut for something tough and very stainless

 

[JustAnotherJoe]

I really don't understand the Mac Pro recommendations, not that I've ever held one. For that price (118 USD) there are a plethora of options that lack the visual blight of colored logos and gimmicky scallops. Does it have some exceptional geometry or just the pedigree of being beaten to death?

For example the kanehide ps60 (basically ABE-L) santoku sure looks like a nice knife that would fit OP's needs. I've also been stocking abusive knife users with Tojiro's offerings and have yet to see any major damage.

 

[jaydee]

A little surprised about all the suggestions here. Would you guys really buy your partner a 500$+ knife when you know she treats it like shxt and probably doesn't appreciate it all that much?

 

[jaydee]

I really don't understand the Mac Pro recommendations,

I do. Bulletproof,easy to sharpen, gets plenty sharp, amazing balance, nimble and best western handle off the shelf.they can do stuff your japanese blade would not survive and you actually don't miss anything using them. They are fun too. Simply really well designed imho.

 

[jacobwilder5]

I do. Bulletproof,easy to sharpen, gets plenty sharp, amazing balance, nimble and best western handle off the shelf.they can do stuff your japanese blade would not survive and you actually don't miss anything using them. They are fun too. Simply really well designed imho.

Agreed. On paper Mac may not seem the best bang for buck, but in use it’s proved it’s worth time and again.

 

[aporigine]

There’s a Tsunehisa ginsan santoku 165 at cktg for like $130.

 

[pitted_soul]

I absolutely love Shigeki Tanaka's ginsan. That sweet spot of hard enough for nice edge retention but not chippy. Great bang for buck

This was going to be my recommendation. He doesn't make them too thin either and has good grinds. His work has been creeping back into my drawer. His SG2 is also excellent. KNS carries his ginsan from time to time for a very good price, I wish I didn't sell mine.

@fortheloveofmoar I did not know Harbeer did cruwear. I don't think I knew anybody did cruwear. I have a cruwear Spyderco that has been fantastic and I always wondered how it would translate to a kitchen knife. I don't know if anything is going to beat Yoshida Hamono's Hap40 though. I think that's my favorite "super steel" that has set the bar for me.

Victorinox or Mac. For the non-afficionados out there, these seem to be proven as a good value and good performers, depending on your tastes/style.

 

[NotAddictedYet]

Cruwear for me. HSC makes a mean cruwear. Edge life for ever. Takes a keen edge. And is tough. Not cheap but well worth it. HSC is a great maker producing some premium stuff. Harbeer (the maker) is also a super nice guy, easy to work with and responsive.

HSC Cruwear has been on my want list for a while but doesn't sounds like OP would feel comfortable giving it to his wife to cook with.

He would hoard it all to himself for sure.

 

[fortheloveofmoar]

I say get her a wustof my wife doesn’t care about the knives so we just have a fat beefy wustof that never chips and can take an okay edge. Not worth going crazy trying to research steels and brands. Just something functional and just know you’ll have to sharpen it a bit more frequently or at least hone it

 

[xsmx13]

IMO, AEB-L at ~61-61.5hrc. There are of course more factors in the heat treatment than just the hardness, but in this range you can get a nice balance of toughness, retention and nice sharpening experience. Softer is not as fun to sharpen.

There are some Hokiyama srs-13 that are often sold under various brand names that can be a solid value, but I have to agree that the MAC option is good for someone who is gonna abuse knives. I know some chefs who swear by them being indestructible, yet easy to touch up to bring the edge back to life.

 

[aporigine]

I say get her a wustof my wife doesn’t care about the knives so we just have a fat beefy wustof that never chips and can take an okay edge. Not worth going crazy trying to research steels and brands. Just something functional and just know you’ll have to sharpen it a bit more frequently or at least hone it

Imo Vic is as functional and for a lower price. Also, the premium Wüsties have that annoying bolster.

Shopping for the spouse, it’s useful to avoid the trap of “let me buy her something I’d really like.” It’s for her after all.

The one small loophole here is that it probably will be you sharpening it. A certain amount of enlightened self-interest applies here. I find Vics to be a bit better on the stones than the German stainless bubblegum.

A great fit here might be yo-(western)handled Takayuki Grand Chef. The N685 steel is noticeably nicer on the board and on the stones than the usual European fare.

 

[daveb]

I really don't understand the Mac Pro recommendations

The MAC is a very usable knife by anyone with any level of skill. It will offer fine utility for Mrs. OP and should OP need to use it he won't find it lacking. Comfortable (and indestructible) handle, decent profile/geometry/steel. If OP maintains (sharpens and thins) the knife, she'
ll love it. If not it will still be a serviceable cutter with some minimal honing time.

A little surprised about all the suggestions here. Would you guys really buy your partner a 500$+ knife when you know she treats it like shxt and probably doesn't appreciate it all that much?

This. The initial question about favorite stainless is very different than best stainless for this application. Love some AEBL, SKD, INOX (Suisin's proprietary blend) as well as some steel that doesn't stain like HSC Z-Wear. But that wasn't the question being asked.

MAC is a good option. Suisin Western Stainless and JKI's Stainless are a couple more for a more skilled non-knife person. There are a host of others. But a short custom gyuto made out of unobtanium is not the right answer.