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noj

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Thanks for the information and replies. I had already located information on Zwilling, Williams Sonoma, Wüsthof, and others. Most say they take 10" knives. The design makes me think the critical distance is from handle to tip, at least for Wa handle. Obviously, that can be significantly longer than cutting edge length. I would be interested in any measurements from the handle-stop on the knife holder to the back end of the knife holder. I ask because I have a few 240 mm blades, which is not only close to whatever is meant by "10" knives" (plus variances based on knife maker and type).
 
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Thanks for the information and replies. I had already located information on Zwilling, Williams Sonoma, Wüsthof, and others. Most say they take 10" knives. The design makes me think the critical distance is from handle to tip, at least for Wa handle. Obviously, that can be significantly longer than cutting edge length. I would be interested in any measurements from the handle-stop on the knife holder to the back end of the knife holder. I ask because I have a few 240 mm blades, which is not only close to whatever is meant by "10" knives" (plus variances based on knife maker and type).

Mine fits my 14" butcher knife butb the tip bumps the back of the drawer. There's also a 12" chef knife in there that fits comfortably. But I can't tell you the exact brand. It does have a Culinary Institute of America insignia on it and it's made of bamboo if that helps.
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mpier

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The one I showed you on Amazon fits my 16” slicer with 2”of handle space to spare
 
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noj

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Many thanks again. If anyone had data (see previous post for query) for Zwilling, Williams Sonoma, Wüsthof brands, I'd be interested.

PS"
@stringer : I am pretty sure yours was sold by Bed, Bath, and Beyond, but not available now (and couldn't find on ebay or amazon either).

@mpier : Looks quite usable, but I would have to cut it for length and width, and I don't access to have a table saw.
 

coxhaus

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Thanks for the information and replies. I had already located information on Zwilling, Williams Sonoma, Wüsthof, and others. Most say they take 10" knives. The design makes me think the critical distance is from handle to tip, at least for Wa handle. Obviously, that can be significantly longer than cutting edge length. I would be interested in any measurements from the handle-stop on the knife holder to the back end of the knife holder. I ask because I have a few 240 mm blades, which is not only close to whatever is meant by "10" knives" (plus variances based on knife maker and type).
My Wusthof and Henckels knife blocks take 12-inch knives in the top part of the block. I have a picture in this thread above.
Here is another picture.
IMG_0546.jpg
 

Bobby2shots

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I use the Victorinox organizers. What I like about that specific model is, the slats are adjustable to accomodate different blade widths/honing rods, etc. Other brands I've looked at do not have this flexibility because the slats are glued in a fixed position. I use two of these side-by-side in a single drawer; the 7 knife model and the 15 knife model. The short-knife section accomodates knives with 6" blades, and the long-knife section handles 10+" blades (10-11"). The blades are very well protected, with quick and easy high visibility access to any knife. Very affordable too.

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I have these three that I keep in my wardrobe (cos my kitchen ran out of space). I also have a block in the kitchen for knives that are currently in rotation.

The block that you see on the right can also hold cleavers on either side, which I find very helpful because most knife holders cannot hold cleavers. The one at the back holds all my sujis.

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ian

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Mine fits my 14" butcher knife butb the tip bumps the back of the drawer. There's also a 12" chef knife in there that fits comfortably. But I can't tell you the exact brand. It does have a Culinary Institute of America insignia on it and it's made of bamboo if that helps.
View attachment 158715

View attachment 158716

I love the wood in the HSC handle so much.
 

noj

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I just got a pair of Zwilling in-drawer ones. For what it's worth, the stops are so low, a gyuto isn't blocked from sliding forward. That aspect works if you store the blades edge up, though I wouldn't reach for a knife without a pause and careful look first. Trying edge down, the sound of the edge on that hardwood makes me cringe, maybe it will improve with use. One of my 240mm knives pokes out the top with bolster touching the stop (upside down). The small knife slots are only functional for an under 150mm petty, and pretty much useless if mixed with large blades stored edge-up. The handles are annoyingly close together. If I store blades edge down (so the stop is useless), I guess I could stagger the handles for easier access.
 

Bobby2shots

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I just got a pair of Zwilling in-drawer ones. For what it's worth, the stops are so low, a gyuto isn't blocked from sliding forward. That aspect works if you store the blades edge up, though I wouldn't reach for a knife without a pause and careful look first. Trying edge down, the sound of the edge on that hardwood makes me cringe, maybe it will improve with use. One of my 240mm knives pokes out the top with bolster touching the stop (upside down). The small knife slots are only functional for an under 150mm petty, and pretty much useless if mixed with large blades stored edge-up. The handles are annoyingly close together. If I store blades edge down (so the stop is useless), I guess I could stagger the handles for easier access.

That sounds terrible,,, and dangerous. The Zwilling, as well as many brands who use this same design under a different brand-name, are simply building a poorly thought out design. The Victorinox version is so simple, flexible, and effective. Zero "blade drag", and, the middle slats can be slid individually to provide wider/narrower spacing as required. With the knives properly inserted, you see no blade-edge anywhere, just the spines. Even my old full bolster Zwilling Pro S 10.5" knives do not protrude. The only wood that touches the blade-edge, are the two dowels that hold the rack together.

This picture shows a single 14-knife rack,,,, look at the wide slot in the center, and you can see one of the wood dowels. Any one of those middle slats can slide left or right to create wider slots, or narrower slots. (for example, for a steel or honing rod); only the two outside slats are glued in a fixed position.

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noj

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That sounds terrible,,, and dangerous. The Zwilling, as well as many brands who use this same design under a different brand-name, are simply building a poorly thought out design. The Victorinox version is so simple, flexible, and effective. Zero "blade drag", and, the middle slats can be slid individually to provide wider/narrower spacing as required. With the knives properly inserted, you see no blade-edge anywhere, just the spines. Even my old full bolster Zwilling Pro S 10.5" knives do not protrude. The only wood that touches the blade-edge, are the two dowels that hold the rack together.

This picture shows a single 14-knife rack,,,, look at the wide slot in the center, and you can see one of the wood dowels. Any one of those middle slats can slide left or right to create wider slots, or narrower slots. (for example, for a steel or honing rod); only the two outside slats are glued in a fixed position.

Victorinox either doesn't make this anymore, or is out of stock. There's one left on ebay, none on amazon. It's hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the Victorinox gives more room under the heel because the dowel fits right behind it.

Here's how the Zwilling fits one of mine. Notice the handle above the holder "stop", and the blade tip pokes out above the holder!

Anyone got a solution that's still available, and known to work with a knives like this?
 

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Bobby2shots

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Victorinox either doesn't make this anymore, or is out of stock. There's one left on ebay, none on amazon. It's hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the Victorinox gives more room under the heel because the dowel fits right behind it.

Here's how the Zwilling fits one of mine. Notice the handle above the holder "stop", and the blade tip pokes out above the holder!

Anyone got a solution that's still available, and known to work with a knives like this?

The Victorinox knife rack that I linked to above, is still available, but you'll have to look around to find it. I found a bunch of them at Cookstore.ca and a few other places, but they weren't easy to find. There are also other Victorinox versions that I really do not like. I'll take a look around, and if I find one I'll post the link here.

Here's Cookstore.ca link. They have the 14 knife and the 7 knife racks. This is Canadian dollar pricing, and by far the best price I've found for those racks. Unfortunately, they're on back-order at the moment,,,


Here's another;

 
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noj

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Thank you for the links. One thing that may help me understand how the product is working with your knives is a measurement 'h' depicted in the attached diagram. For additional clarity, the measurement is from the blade's heel to the near side of the handle.

In my Zwilling, I had one knife with h = 26 mm that sort of worked, but my Gyuto(s) have h = 30 mm and larger. The larger (30 mm) distance h caused the handle to miss the stop on the holder.

If you could measure 'h' on a couple of your larger knives, that would help me understand how well it may work with mine.

Another helpful piece is the number of dowel(s) that touch the blade edge when inserted. I can't tell from your picture or product information in the links.

Thanks in advance.
ks.jpg
 

Bobby2shots

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Hi noj,

Measuring "h" was not a simple matter. The knives vary widely from one model to another; for example; my 10" bread knives measure "zero", while my tallest knife is an old 10" Zwilling Pro S chef knife with full bolster, and that knife measures roughly 1" at "h",,, but, because of the western-handle grip contours, it varies quite a bit. That said, none of that should matter, and here's why;

As it turns out, there are three dowels that hold the knife-rack's slats together. No.1 dowel is roughly an inch from the front of the rack,,, No2 is located in the middle, about an inch behind the riser for the second tier of the rack, and, No3 is at an inch or so from the very back of the rack. So what does that mean??? well, it means that the long knives' edges only contact a single dowel at the tip of the knife (No3),,, and the back of the knife, specifically the bottom of the handle, rests directly on the top surface of the rack. The choil of those longer knives sits in front of the middle dowel (No2). Using your diagram as a reference, the middle dowel (No2) is located where your drawing shows the letter "h". When your longer knives are inserted, the knife is basically hanging in thin air between those two points of suspension (handle and tip). When you consider that the dowels are round, the tip contact point is virtually non-existant. If your knife's balance point is behind the choil (handle-heavy bias),,, the tip of the blade probably doesn't even touch a dowel because the knife's handle will rest flat on the top surface of the rack, supporting the full weight of the knife. It's a simple, yet genius design.
 
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DitmasPork

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In my little Brooklyn kitchen—the knife block is home to Wustofs and Sabs; no usable wall area for a rack, I just stuff favored knives into a drawer with a cup of water for humidity—not storing works of art so this works fine, I just make sure edges are well protected. Unused knives kept in the bedroom. I really prefer not to keep knives out in the open on display, less chance for them to be used by someone else.
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noj

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Thank you for taking the time to write up all that information. I suspected the dowels were placed like that. It does leave me wondering what measurement (on the knife and/or holder) will determine whether the heel pokes out the bottom of the holder. Almost none of my knives have handle-heavy bias.
 

Bobby2shots

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Thank you for taking the time to write up all that information. I suspected the dowels were placed like that. It does leave me wondering what measurement (on the knife and/or holder) will determine whether the heel pokes out the bottom of the holder. Almost none of my knives have handle-heavy bias.

Worst case scenario, a very tall knife would end up with the heel touching the drawer bottom. A lot will depend on your knife-handle design. If we're talking Wa handles, chances are that the blade heel will touch if the height ("H" in your diagram) exceeds 1". I just measured it behind the middle dowel. In front of the dowel, the height matters less because there's a curve/slope that raises the ferule contact point at the front of the support-slat. The farther ahead you push the knife, the higher that ferule climbs the slope. (and, simultaneously raises the heel)

There's a bit more to it than that because you have to take into account blade curvature, tip location relative to the handle centerline, bolsters, etc., so it'll will vary with different knife designs, but for the most part, this rack is very flexible.

With very tall knives, such as a wa-handled Santoku or Nakiri, Usuba,, or a cleaver, I simply leave a space between the side of the rack and the side of the drawer, and slip a blade-protection sleeve on the knife.

If that still doesn't work, and a blade touches bottom, put a cork or cardboard sheet under the rack. Even a narrow strip accross the front and back will raise the rack "just enough" for your needs.

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Thanks to this thread I ended up adding another rack to the drawer and it is one of the best knife related purchases I have made in a while. Before I just had the Wusthof rack (beech rack on the right) with my beaters in it and boxes which I would grab knives from. This just ended up with me using the same couple knives over and over again until I rotated the order of the boxes. Also started to feel very cluttered.

IMG_3524.JPG


I live in the UK so bought this rack from John Lewis (oak rack on the left): John Lewis & Partners Oak Wood In-Drawer Empty Knife Block, Natural. Ended up seeming very well made and felt much more substantial than the Wusthof. Main reason I went for this over others was a much higher height of the curvatures and also longer so can fit full sized 240s. The only knives that are too tall and where handles sit a significant distance away from the backmost curvature are the Yanick (57mm at heel) and the Dalman HSS1 (58mm at heel). They both still don't seem to move though when moving the drawer. They're both very thin behind the edge and it feels like they're gripping the little slats at the bottom.

With very tall knives, such as a wa-handled Santoku or Nakiri, Usuba,, or a cleaver, I simply leave a space between the side of the rack and the side of the drawer, and slip a blade-protection sleeve on the knife.

For a different reason this is what I do with my suji because it is slightly too long for either of my racks.
 

Bobby2shots

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Thanks to this thread I ended up adding another rack to the drawer and it is one of the best knife related purchases I have made in a while. Before I just had the Wusthof rack (beech rack on the right) with my beaters in it and boxes which I would grab knives from. This just ended up with me using the same couple knives over and over again until I rotated the order of the boxes. Also started to feel very cluttered.

View attachment 160871

I live in the UK so bought this rack from John Lewis (oak rack on the left): John Lewis & Partners Oak Wood In-Drawer Empty Knife Block, Natural. Ended up seeming very well made and felt much more substantial than the Wusthof. Main reason I went for this over others was a much higher height of the curvatures and also longer so can fit full sized 240s. The only knives that are too tall and where handles sit a significant distance away from the backmost curvature are the Yanick (57mm at heel) and the Dalman HSS1 (58mm at heel). They both still don't seem to move though when moving the drawer. They're both very thin behind the edge and it feels like they're gripping the little slats at the bottom.



For a different reason this is what I do with my suji because it is slightly too long for either of my racks.
Very nice. Everything is well protected and quickly accessible. FWIW, you also have a potential space between the two racks.

Another thing you can do with this type of rack is using them on a counter-top, by placing them parallel to the back-splash. That works well with the narrower version, and takes up very little counter space, plus the most frequently used knives are right there in front of you. The smaller 7-knife rack is just over 4" wide, and can hold 3 long knives and four 6" (or less) knives. More than enough for the average home user. (10" bread, 8" chef, 10" slicer/carver,,,plus a 6" petty, 6" boning, 6" chef, and various paring knives on the short-knife portion of the rack.
 
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I have the original 360 Knife block. While I like it a lot, it has a couple of issues. The storage faces of the block are 9" tall, so 240s and above are right out. The sides can really only store one non-paring/petty knife on each face, and the magnets on each side are arranged in a way that makes storing multiple smaller knives challenging. Here's a diagram of the design:

360kb.png


Because the magnets are arranged in a "T" with a row of three on the top and three down the middle, short knives like paring knives are attracted to the middle column where the extra magnets are. Here's a video of mine, and you can see the issue when I spin it super hard and the two petties kind of attack each other. Apologies that it's in portrait mode; I'm a monster.



The original model is also quite expensive, and the value proposition of a $320 knife block that can only hold six or seven knives isn't great. But the 360KB folks recently came out with an XL version called the 360KB MAX that fixes these issues and consequently can store many more knives (since putting multiple knives per side is actually feasible). They also added a few slots on the top, including one that's wide enough to house a CCK cleaver. The MAX is also slightly cheaper than the original because it has simpler construction. So the value proposition is significantly higher, though the block is still kind of spendy. Here's a diagram of the MAX.

360KBMaxBlueprint_480x480.jpg


The magnet placement on this model makes more sense, and the storage faces on the block are slightly wider, so you should be able to store multiple knives per face, like a petty and a bunka for example. Because it's taller you might have issues fitting it under a counter, but mine lives on a butcher block so that's not really a concern for me. Here's a quick video showing both of them in action:



I wish I could snap my fingers and turn my original 360 block into the MAX, but I can't. These things are built like freaking tanks, so they're somewhat awkward to ship, so selling mine to finance an upgrade isn't an easy option. But I like the product an awful lot. They're made by hand by a small company with super customer service. I highly recommend them. And though you can find them on Amazon, just buy direct.
 
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In my little Brooklyn kitchen—the knife block is home to Wustofs and Sabs; no usable wall area for a rack, I just stuff favored knives into a drawer with a cup of water for humidity—not storing works of art so this works fine, I just make sure edges are well protected. Unused knives kept in the bedroom. I really prefer not to keep knives out in the open on display, less chance for them to be used by someone else.
View attachment 160724

“A cup of water for humidity” -

You would never want to have any more humidity than we see here in Florida. I would think the steel would not like the humidity; but perhaps the handles.
 

DitmasPork

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“A cup of water for humidity” -

You would never want to have any more humidity than we see here in Florida. I would think the steel would not like the humidity; but perhaps the handles.

NYC winter's are brutal with the dry air—I've had an ebony handle crack from just one winter—the little cup of water evaporates quickly. Whereas, when I'm in Hawaii visiting family, my knives will sometimes rust after a half hour sitting on the kitchen counter.
 
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