Like a naughty schoolboy

Discussion in 'The Kitchen Knife' started by captaincaed, Dec 12, 2019.

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  1. Dec 12, 2019 #1

    captaincaed

    captaincaed

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    This is going to be a recommend me a knife thread like you've never seen. I'm not filling out the questionnaire because I only care about one thing.

    Will it sit quietly in the corner?

    When I cut that food, I want it to sit there quietly. Every time. No drama, no fuss, no onion tears, just well behaved potato slices and French fries. Not asking for the world. Doesn't need to be a great cutter, doesn't need an amazing tip or profile. But when it cuts food, the food should sit there like a child in time out. Like a naughty school boy.

    Taking recommendations, also see related BST thread if you have anything you'd like to trade and are willing to take a short vid to show off how cool your knife is.

    I have several great cutters and all rounders, but sometimes I need a special tool, like a honesuki or a cleaver. I want my pommes Anna, Andy Capp Hot Fries potato slaying knife for tater night.

    Peace, and thanks in advance.
     
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  2. Dec 12, 2019 #2

    Oui Chef

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    I still remember the first time I cut potatoes at work with an S grind Marko 4 years ago
    And I can't remember who I was sleeping with then, so there you go
     
  3. Dec 12, 2019 #3

    rob

    rob

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    Kippington hook grind.
     
  4. Dec 13, 2019 #4

    captaincaed

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    I keep hearing about this Kippington fellow. Both his honyaki and hook grind seem to have a lot of attention poured into them.
     
  5. Dec 13, 2019 #5

    ian

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  6. Dec 13, 2019 #6

    ethompson

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    I really love my Takeda nakiri for this. Nothing can fine dice or julienne an onion like it. Also have had great results with on potatoes - steak frites is one of my favorite meals.
     
  7. Dec 13, 2019 #7

    Nemo

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    A somewhat cryptic OP but I guess that you are asking about knives with very good food release?

    Best 5 I have tried are Mert Tansu Workhorse, Watanabe Pro, Kippington Hook Grind, Yoshikane Hammered, Wakui Hammered and Toyama. Probably in that order. The Kippington is by far the thinnest of these.
     
  8. Dec 13, 2019 #8

    labor of love

    labor of love

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    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
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  9. Dec 13, 2019 #9

    captaincaed

    captaincaed

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    Yes, probably too cryptic. I was hoping click bait would draw people in, I may have miscalculated.

    I had a Marko s-grind that worked quite well, but it was a weird HSS that was a bear (for me) to sharpen so I passed it on.

    I've heard the Kippington name often around these parts, and I really like the technical attention he pays to grinds.

    On the other hand, I'm going to go to JKI (for the first time ever!) in a couple days, so maybe I'll slap eyes on a Heiji and fall in love.

    @Nemo, I heard the HVB was a food-release beast - you'd give Mert two thumbs up?

    @labor of love , I almost went for one the last time. Why suji over gyuto? I hear the lower weight of the suji hampers cutting on denser foods.
     
  10. Dec 13, 2019 #10

    labor of love

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    I slice/pull cut potatoes. You could use any gyuto with tremendous distal taper or very thin tip to achieve similar cuts to a suji with regards to potatoes. But for consecutive pull cuts I like a suji, more narrow blade means less drag or chances for the product to stick to the blade.

    I understand potatoes are used in videos to demonstrate food release or pure cutting ability with push cut motion. But for the most consistent cuts (like brabants) pull cuts are the way to go IMO.

    So a Heiji suji offers good food release grind+plus less drag because of narrow blade.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
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  11. Dec 13, 2019 #11

    captaincaed

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    I hear that. I have some ergonomic issues left from a decade in lab work (wrists and elbows) so draw cuts can tweak a nerve for me. Push cutting feels much better, so I keep hunting around for knives for each job that let me keep working comfortably.
     
  12. Dec 13, 2019 #12

    Nemo

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    Mert was a full time chef then became a knifemaker in his spare time, then became a full time knifemaker. He has a very good appreciation of what works well in the kitchen and what doesn't.

    Edit: I should add that Mert is not the only knifemaker to have this perspective but I think that it can be a useful perspective for a knifemaker to have.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
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  13. Dec 13, 2019 #13

    captaincaed

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    I'm with you there. Having the end users perspective can be important. I think Kippington had that similar perspective. It seems like he takes the grind seriously and knows how to execute the design.

    Sounds like Hunter valley, Kippington and Heiji are all top contenders.

    I've heard the watanabe is very good, but I'm avoiding iron clad if possible....
     
  14. Dec 13, 2019 #14

    ian

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    Watanabe is stainless clad nowadays, I think.
     
  15. Dec 13, 2019 #15

    Barmoley

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    Marko weird HSS would be cool to have I was hunting for one for a while, never found anyone wanting to sell.

    HVB that I have has very good food release, it is from the first batch of 52100 he made. Mert’s knives are excellent in general.

    @labor of love makes excellent points though, technique matters and suji or less tall gyuto works better for potatoes.
     
  16. Dec 13, 2019 #16
  17. Dec 13, 2019 #17
  18. Dec 13, 2019 #18

    captaincaed

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    I’m not sure I can go through the heartbreak of trying to find a good copy. I hear they can be amazing though
     
  19. Dec 13, 2019 #19

    captaincaed

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  20. Dec 13, 2019 #20

    Brian Weekley

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    Captain C ...

    Seems that I have a bit of a collection of Takeda AS series. I’ll drag them out with some potatoes and give them a try.
     
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  21. Dec 13, 2019 #21

    ThinMan

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    Unless you are very unlucky, Jon at JKI would be able to correct any OOTB deficiencies.

    I have a 240 AS gyuto of 2018 vintage that is great.
     
  22. Dec 13, 2019 #22

    captaincaed

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    OK, I'm listening. I think I remember someone recently saying it was the only knife that would leave mirpoixe onions sitting on the board. Am I remembering right?
    Any idea of the sasanoha version performs as well? I prefer that size, but in this case I'm asking for a specific job so I'm open to new ideas.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
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  23. Dec 13, 2019 #23

    labor of love

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    Yeah I’d like to hear from NAS owners too. The one I tried seem to cut a little differently than reg takeda.
     
  24. Dec 14, 2019 #24

    Brian Weekley

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    I wrapped up the tests this afternoon. I’ll go through the pics and have my report tomorrow. I went through a 150 petty, 240 Gyuto, 300 Gyuto, 240 Sasanoha and lge cleaver. I might do a 270 Suji if I can find it. Very interesting results. Here’s a teaser pic ... B5360986-A79C-4D6D-8F81-D93A4897F912.jpeg
     
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  25. Dec 14, 2019 #25

    labor of love

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    @Brian Weekley that reminds me of a video someone already made demonstrating potato food release.


    Well, what do you know? The OP made this video haha
     
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  26. Dec 14, 2019 #26

    Brian Weekley

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    Interesting ... for my sixth potato I used a Carter International Pro funayuki. I did all my cuts for French fries. From looking at the video I might pick up some more potatoes and try the scalloped potato/potato chip cut. What do you do with the results of a six potato cutting test? One of my favourite recipes ... Tuscan sausage and potato soup. Here’s a pic ...

    93D51FDC-DFA0-4CBB-82CE-757175A7131E.jpeg
     
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  27. Dec 14, 2019 #27

    captaincaed

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    Why you gotta do me like that bro?
    Yeah I've been chasing this dragon for a while. Perhaps a bit obsessed. I liked the Kochi but it's just too light and a bit inconsistent. some days it shows up and some days it stays in bed.

    Also hell yes for the test! Love the teaser shot. Looks better than my potato shots
     
  28. Dec 14, 2019 #28

    labor of love

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    :)
    This was a great video. I think you did a very good job.
    Next time pull cut :)
     
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  29. Dec 14, 2019 #29

    captaincaed

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    Hah! Ok
     
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  30. Dec 15, 2019 #30

    Brian Weekley

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    Ok .... here we go ... the big Takeda Potato shootout!

    First m collection of Takeda AS series knives ...

    27F04BFD-1CAE-47D3-9CC4-B26DEAA23E2F.jpeg

    From left to right ...

    80mm kogatana
    150 petty
    165 bunka
    220 mioroshi
    240 Sasanoha
    240 Yanigaba (sujihiki)
    240 Gyuto
    300 Gyuto
    240 large Chinese cleaver

    and for the sake of comparison a 240 Xerxes.

    I touched up only the bunka by stropping. All the rest of the knives were taken from my kitchen without touching up. All were kitchen sharp, some like the cleaver, and 300 Gyuto had actually been used quite a bit. I went out and bought some russet potatoes ... 10 in total ... and peeled them all. The first test was to split the potato, then slice into large French fries then cube. In all cases I held the knife in one hand ... the result speak for themselves. Based on the results of these tests I took the front runners and did a scalloped potato/potato chip cut. I held the potato and did the slice with one hand. The slices fell where they fell in the pictures. No touching. All cuts were push cuts.

    Results ... The kogatana and mioroshi were really not suitable for the tests. They were too small and too thick. The 150 petty worked fine on small potatoes but the blade was too short to handle the large potatoes in a single push cut.

    All of the other Takeda’s handled the potatoes just fine and for the most part all the potatoes behaved liked naughty school boys. There was no wedging in any of the blades. There was very little sticking. A bit with some of the blades on the lighter outside pieces of the French fries cut. The Takeda Yanigaba (sujihiki) was the stand out best at slicing potatoes. The 240 Sasanoha was a very close second. The 240 Gyuto was third and virtually matched by the large Chinese cleaver in cutting performance. I added my Xerxes 240 Gyuto into the test and found that it matched the Takeda Sasanoha.

    Conclusions. ... in my opinion the naughty schoolboy winner was the 240 Sasanoha. Second was the 240 Xerxes Gyuto. Third was the Takeda 240 Gyuto in a dead heat with the large Takeda cleaver.

    To avoid making this post too long I’ll include the performance pics and rationale in the next post.

    Brian
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2019
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