my old Sabatier

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Flat Rock Forge

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any idea how old this knife is?
sab1.jpg
sab2.jpg
sab3.jpg
 
A bit of work: it got a lot of steeling, so the usual things: protruding fingerguard, reverse belly, tip. Once the profile got restored it will need some good thinning as well. Well worth the time and effort. If you haven't done those things before: a lot of members here are very familiar with these kind of repairs.
 
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What is the handle material? If you rub it and it stinks like burnt hair, it’s hard rubber and likely from the 60’s. Pre-60’s they had wood handles. If it doesn’t smell then it’s more modern plastic and 1970’s or later.

Should clean up nice regardless. The profile looks pretty good. A little work to grind the bolster down flush, but not too bad.
 
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Heckel7302 said:
What is the handle material? If you rub it and it stinks like burnt hair, it’s celluloid and likely from the 60’s. Pre-60’s they had wood handles. If it doesn’t smell then it’s more modern plastic and 1970’s or later.
In
Should clean up nice regardless. The profile looks pretty good. A little work to grind the bolster down flush, but not too bad.
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You're right about the handle. I forgot it might very well be an export one, especially for the American market, in which case a pre-sixties full tang is perfectly possible. I would than expect a Canadian though, with a narrow fingerguard and no virole or integrated full bolster. In France the full tang was only common since the sixties, as the Nogent was preferred until then, and ebony from the colonies was available.
 
Heckel7302 said:
What is the handle material? If you rub it and it stinks like burnt hair, it’s celluloid and likely from the 60’s. Pre-60’s they had wood handles. If it doesn’t smell then it’s more modern plastic and 1970’s or later.

Should clean up nice regardless. The profile looks pretty good. A little work to grind the bolster down flush, but not too bad.
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Hard rubber--like old pocket combs--not celluloid. Celluloid was often tortoise shell, swirl, etc., used for pocket knife scales.
 
Benuser said:
You're right about the handle. I forgot it might very well be an export one, especially for the American market, in which case a pre-sixties full tang is perfectly possible. I would than expect a Canadian though, with a narrow fingerguard and no virole or integrated full bolster. In France the full tang was only common since the sixties, as the Nogent was preferred until then, and ebony from the colonies was available.
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Have to correct about the dating, as I learned from @cotedupy about full tang, full bolsters being sold in Paris in the mid-fifties.
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/the-sabatier-appreciation-thread.54562/#post-844657
 
Heckel7302 said:
What is the handle material? If you rub it and it stinks like burnt hair, it’s hard rubber and likely from the 60’s. Pre-60’s they had wood handles. If it doesn’t smell then it’s more modern plastic and 1970’s or later.

Should clean up nice regardless. The profile looks pretty good. A little work to grind the bolster down flush, but not too bad.
Click to expand...
Well I learned something new today! Will be checking my older knives now!
 
Been looking at Sabatier on eBay. Saw a Carbon Trumpet with the skinny nogent handle.
Seller said from 1950's.

I bought a nogent handle 6" slicer from pre war blanks, it's a nice knife. My only Sabatier bought years ago.

One looking at in very good shape no pitting or protruding finger guard looks like wasn't used much. Not cheap though. Anyone know about the nogent Sabatier Trumpet's?
 
Correction the 6" slicer I have is nogent.

The Trumpet 9.75 chef knife is three rivet thin handle.
 
Keith Sinclair said:
Been looking at Sabatier on eBay. Saw a Carbon Trumpet with the skinny nogent handle.
Seller said from 1950's.

I bought a nogent handle 6" slicer from pre war blanks, it's a nice knife. My only Sabatier bought years ago.

One looking at in very good shape no pitting or protruding finger guard looks like wasn't used much. Not cheap though. Anyone know about the nogent Sabatier Trumpet's?
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'La Trompette' was the trademark used by Auguste Sabatier, without any doubt the greatest makers of his time, end 19th century. His model, both by profile and geometry, has been adopted by makers around the world. I had the pleasure to restore one of his knives and the steel he used was certainly the best he could get, comparable to the very best Sheffields. After his death, the mark went into a lot of other hands. Later knives haven't much to do with the mark's original owner. So you pay quite a substantial premium for a Trumpet that isn't made by the same man or his descendants. In general, I wrote this about paying a lot of money for a vintage. Henckels 102-10. Vintage knife buy.
 
What about the new carbon Sabatier I've never even seen one. Forged from one piece of steel guess that means blade bolster & tang are one piece.

250mm 10" blade is only 129.00 with a olive wood handle. You can see the shaping of handle done on a sander sides are flat edges pretty sharp. Scratches on pins. I'm sure I can fix that & really make that nice olive wood pop.
 
Modern ones are likely to disappoint you. The tip is higher than with a Herder 1922. It lacks the extreme distal taper of the old ones. Much heavier. The steel is even softer. But above all: fit & finish are dramatically poor. Expect warps, bents and overgrinds.
A serious alternative were the 23cm
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/windmuehlenmesser-for-sale.47589/Or a Misono Swedish Carbon 240mm.
 
Is that Herder same type grind as one John selling on BST?

Nice protective patina on your blades. That's part of reason I like the herders. Buying vintage carbons often have little or a lot of pitting from rust. Getting a new blade with same excellence in the grind you have control to let the knife safely patina without rust.
 
Keith Sinclair said:
Is that Herder same type grind as one John selling on BST?
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I guess so. The same Herder 1922 23cm.
First thing I do with a carbon, even before sharpening, is forcing a patina with a mix of formic and phosphoric acid. It isn't necessary with those Herders though, they aren't especially reactive, thanks to the fine polishing. My first monosteel carbon was a Misono Swedish, in those times extremely reactive. And the next one was a Fujiwara Kanefusa FKH, which contained in those days some sulfur. That's how this habit was born.
 
What's your mix ratio & how do you apply it. Those dark grey patina looks similar to my carbons at work cutting anything and everything for hours a day.
 
Can't tell you. A cleaner gave me a bottle of a solvent for cleaning urinals but it doesn't mention concentrations or proportions.
 
Keith Sinclair said:
This one's logo is oval circle with single trumpet inside.
Click to expand...

My understanding was that Trumpet was a label of La Trompette, used for some export markets in the second half of the c.20th. I'm relatively sure that's the case, though may be completely wrong.

I've not seen many nogent examples of them though.
 
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