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spyken

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what's a good non-stick professional 10" fry pan that can go into the oven as well? I have my non-coated pans but honestly sometimes the ease of the non-stick is just so convenient.
 

Michi

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Ikea 365. Dirt cheap, durable, and all-metal construction. I'm sold on those. Even if I damage one at some point, they are so cheap that I can just replace them.
 

spyken

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I find IKEA a little heavy. and I don't like to buy and replace too often. it adds to waste. I saw some by Misen but the shipping they were asking was too much (I'm on the other side of the planet).
 

Michi

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I find IKEA a little heavy.
I'm surprised by that. My 28 cm (11") 365+ weighs 918 g, which is almost exactly two pounds. That's light for a pan that size.

I guess something in aluminium would be lighter. But, personally, I'm not keen on aluminium cookware (coated or not).
 

spyken

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I was hoping for something along the same weight as my De Buyer carbon steel pan haha
 

Michi

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I was hoping for something along the same weight as my De Buyer carbon steel pan haha
Hmmm… The DeBuyer 28 cm carbon steel pan weighs 2,125 g. That's more than double the weight of the Ikea 365+.
 
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madelinez

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Heaviest is bestest :)

I cook nearly everything in a cast iron 10kg 1" thick beast, it holds the heat on my gas stove. I don't love cleaning it though haha.
 

Michi

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Heaviest is bestest :)
I like cooking in my Lodge skillet and my Le Creuset dutch oven, and the heavy Fissler and Tefal frying pans I own. The high heat capacity of these is really nice for even cooking.

On the other hand, for things that cook quickly and are sensitive to overheating, I prefer something with low heat capacity. For example, if I cook eggs, or finish a sauce, or boil milk, or caramelise sugar, and I notice that things are getting a bit warm, I can just move the pan or pot off the heat, and it will start to cool down pretty much immediately. Similar, if I want a quick blast of high heat straight away, I can do that with a thin pan.

With something like cast iron, that just doesn't work. By the time the vessel cools down enough, things likely will have gone too far, and it's simply impossible to heat them up quickly (as I can do with a wok, for example).

So, I don't think there is any one true answer here. Instead, it's more about matching the cookware to the job.
 

spyken

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I don't have weighing scales but I shall get one soon and weigh my de buyer and the 365 at the store. I know I held the 365 and knew that I couldn't flip it as easily as my de buyer.
 

vicv

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It's funny how things go. Field looks like a good pan but I have an old no. 8 from a Canadian company named smart which is an entire pound lighter than a field. As is my no. 10 Wagner. And those are both polished smooth. So not knocking field but what are they offering besides a smooth surface you can recreate in 10 minutes with a DA on a Lodge?
I agree with others about the love of steel pans (good thick ones) but their french design makes them inefficient to use. With the generous slope to the sides they offer much less cooking surface than the same sized skillet and the long angled handle makes going to the oven difficult as well
 

Michi

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I would have loved to buy a DeBuyer carbon steel fry pan. They are really, really nice. Except that my wife vetoed it because she really struggles with a pan that weighs more than 2 kg as opposed to one that weighs just under 1 kg. Hence the Ikea 365+, which was the next-best thing I could find in terms of weight and price.

We've had that pan for probably two years or little more now, and it still looks and performs like when it was new. It is remarkably robust. The pan gets used literally every single day. (We are reasonably careful with coated pans and don't use metal utensils in them, but we don't treat the pan with kid's gloves either.) Given the handful of dollars I paid for the pan, this has to be one of the best deals out there in terms of value for money. I can see why students and other people on low incomes go apeshit over this Ikea stuff. Prestige: 0, functionality: 5, value for money: 10.

The long handle on the carbon steel pans is annoying, at least to me. I have a 60 cm wide Miele oven. A De Buyer would fit into it, but only just, with essentially zero room to spare. (If there is one thing that I would change about my kitchen, it would be to have an 80 cm oven instead. But, back when I designed it more than 20 years ago, I hardly ever used the oven, except for the occasional roast, and 60 cm was plenty big enough, or so I thought back then…)

I believe the reason for the extra-long handle is so it stays cooler towards the end. Even so, I'm not sure that this design makes a lot of sense. If the pan is properly hot, I have to use mitts or a towel when touching the handle anyway. And, the longer the handle, the harder it gets to move the pan around because of the longer lever arm.
 

vicv

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Good to know about the +365 pan. I've eyed that as I have all the sauce pans and 10qt stock pot in that line and love all of them but we simply stopped using or having non stick. Not for any health or political reasons but because they offer no advantages and eventually wear out
 

Michi

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we simply stopped using or having non stick. Not for any health or political reasons but because they offer no advantages
No advantages? I would argue with that :)

There are times where a non-stick pan is just absolute bliss, as far as I am concerned. I can just drop something in, without any fat, and be sure that it won't stick. Yes, I can still burn it if I'm not careful. But, even when burnt, it still won't stick :)

So, the main advantage to me is that I can toss something in, fry it up, and—if it is something fragile, such as egg–be pretty sure that it's not going to disintegrate on me when I try to remove it from the pan.
 

vicv

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That's fair. I meant for me. The seasoning I have built up and my cooking methods are such that I don't get any sticking in my iron pans. Even if I do a quick deglaze with water cleans them right up
 

Michi

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That's fair. I meant for me. The seasoning I have built up and my cooking methods are such that I don't get any sticking in my iron pans. Even if I do a quick deglaze with water cleans them right up
Right. My Lodge is almost (but not quite) as non-stick as my coated pans. That's good enough for almost everything. Except when I'm in a hurry. I have to heat up the Lodge gradually, to avoid the bottom from warping up or down. With the dirt-cheap Ikea pan, I don't have to worry about anything. I just turn the hot plate to full bore and, when I think that things are hot enough, I'm good to go. In a fraction of the time, and without having to worry about damaging the pan.
 

Luftmensch

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I have to heat up the Lodge gradually, to avoid the bottom from warping up or down.
Have you experienced warping? I have only read about it.... With a sturdy lodge, I cant imagine it being as large a problem as the older, thinner stuff
 
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Michi

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Have you experienced warping? I have only read about it.... With a sturdy lodge, I cant imagine it being as large a problem as the older, thinner stuff
Yes, I have a tiny bit of warping on my 12" Lodge. It's warped up a tiny bit in the centre. It's minimal, so it doesn't really affect they way I use the pan. But it definitely happened some time after I bought it.
 

madelinez

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Interesting, maybe I should be more careful with my solidteknics then. I heat it up on max, I even clean it in cold water while it's still hot. No doubt I'll regret it when it cracks one day :D
 

Michi

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Interesting, maybe I should be more careful with my solidteknics then. I heat it up on max, I even clean it in cold water while it's still hot. No doubt I'll regret it when it cracks one day :D
I sit mine on the hotplate for a few minutes on medium-low heat, to let it warm through, before I crank it up. The idea is to get some heat into the sides of the pan, so the pan can expand along its circumference. If heat is applied too quickly, the bottom of the pan expands against the still-cold sides and can only go up or down.
 

madelinez

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Haha I just remember the Miele Oven ;)

Well that's even more interesting because Ceramic has always been quite slow for me, maybe it's because the gas burners are actually passing a lot of heat directly onto the sides of the pan versus the base.
 

Michi

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Haha I just remember the Miele Oven ;)

Well that's even more interesting because Ceramic has always been quite slow for me, maybe it's because the gas burners are actually passing a lot of heat directly onto the sides of the pan versus the base.
Those burners are no slouch. Miele advertise that they go from 0-100 in four seconds. Given that cast iron isn't a great heat conductor, I can see how you can end up with a bottom that is a lot hotter than the sides.

It's easy to check: just put the pan on medium heat and then feel or measure the temperature in the middle and the sides. There is a big difference until the whole thing reaches equilibrium.
 
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Luftmensch

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Yes, I have a tiny bit of warping on my 12" Lodge. It's warped up a tiny bit in the centre. It's minimal, so it doesn't really affect they way I use the pan. But it definitely happened some time after I bought it.
I am sorry to hear that!

I have not checked my skillet. I am aware of heating them slowly but I am impatient and have been on gas for the last several stoves. Oh the hubris! Oh the shame! I am sure if I looked it would be a bit warped. Doh! Modern induction/ceramic are far more demanding surfaces than the old gas trivets!
 

Michi

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The one thing I would change in my kitchen, if I could do it all again, is to have a gas cooktop. There are no gas lines in the street I live in, so the only way to get gas would have been to get a big bottle or two installed outside somewhere, and have those swapped out once or twice a year.

I got seduced by the super-clean look of the ceramic cooktops. No corners and edges where stuff gets stuck, one clean neat surface, touch sensor controls, all very slick. In theory. The reality is that, one, ceramic cooktops are good, but not as good as gas. And, two, that the ceramic cooktop has a tendency to scratch and look not so good after a few short years. And while a ceramic cooktop heats up fast, it's not as fast to cool down as a gas burner, meaning that, if I want to reduce heat quickly, I have to move the pot or pan. (Not a big deal, except when I have four pots and pans on the stove already, and there really is nowhere for the pan that is getting too hot to go to…)

Overall, gas is the better option. Let me correct that: it's the best option.
 

Luftmensch

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There are no gas lines in the street I live in
Thats a bummer.... My memory is hazy... I have some distant memory of the Government incentivising gas hot water during the Krud years? I wonder if that helped spread the network....

Overall, gas is the better option. Let me correct that: it's the best option.
Interesting! Where does induction rank in your opinion?
 

Michi

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Interesting! Where does induction rank in your opinion?
I have only limited experience. I've used an induction cooktop exactly once, for about 30 minutes. It was fine. It took two or three minutes for me to figure out which setting corresponded to the heat I wanted, and then I was good to go and comfortable.

Getting the induction cooktop to go really hot really fast worked well. But getting it to cool down was a bit like my ceramic hot plate cooktop. The cooking surface stores a fair bit of heat so, if I really want something off the heat "right now", I think a gas burner still wins. Once the gas is off, there is very little residual heat to go into the pot.
 

WPerry

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We got an induction range about 6 months ago. I'd like to say that I love it... but that wouldn't be quite accurate.

The performance is awesome - it can heat up scary fast, the simmer side of things is excellently nuanced, and clean-up is far, far and away the I've best ever experienced (I've never had to resort to anything more than a water-dampened paper towel).

All that said, it's just so magically alien that it doesn't tug on my heartstrings the way open flames do. I really like it, but I don't love it. The big question: given the choice, would I make the same decision and buy it again? Yup, I would, romance be damned.
 

WPerry

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Oh, on the cast iron front - I saw a Finex in real life yesterday. Yeah, I'm over that yearning.

On the interior, the bottom is really nicely finished, but the sides are still rather rough. More off-putting is the abruptness of the transition between the two; simply put, there is no transition - it's a hard line. A very hard line. For being one of the more expensive options on the market, that was a total turn-off for me.
 

parbaked

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Getting the induction cooktop to go really hot really fast worked well. But getting it to cool down was a bit like my ceramic hot plate cooktop. The cooking surface stores a fair bit of heat.
No...an induction cooktop surface doesn't generate or store any heat.
The residual heat you experienced was stored in the pan, not the cooktop.

 
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