New Knife Advice - New Member - Questionnaire Completed......

[V12Stu]

LOCATION
What country are you in? United Kingdom

KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)? Gyuto or Santoku

Are you right or left handed? Right handed

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle? Japanese

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)? 165 to 210 mm

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no) No

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife? £150 (ish) delivered

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment? Amateur home chef

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

Cooking home meals for 1 to 4 adults. Mainly onions, garlic, ginger, chilli, mushrooms, spring onions, bok choy, raw and cooked chicken and beef (slicing and cubing – not boning), tomatoes, coriander (cilantro), courgette, bell pepper, green beans, root veg eg potatoes, carrot, etc.

What knife, if any, are you replacing? A generic chef’s knife – Inox stainless steel, western handle, 200 mm blade length, 1.75 mm blade width (I like the narrow width – I haven’t liked wider blade widths in the past). Of all the knives we have, this is the only knife I use…..

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.). Pinch grip

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.) Push cut and walking. That said, I know that walking may not go well with [brittle] carbon steel [due to twisting the blade on the block to rotate the walking motion] so happy to adapt cutting styles to knife.

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

Better aesthetics Yes.

Comfort N/A

Ease of Use and Care No – I’d like to be able to devote time to this and learn as a distraction from the stress and strain of professional corporate life and to learn new skills

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)? No – see above

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? Wood

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.) Yes – and this is an area/skill I want to develop and perfect (in so far as I can in the coming years as an amateur……)

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives?

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.). Yes – currently planning on buying Naniwa Chocera 400/800/3000 whetstones, Naniwa 220 flattening stone, [not sure of brand] ceramic sharpening steel and Naniwa leather strop.

I figure that buying good sharpening equipment at the beginning, it will last me a while as my knowledge, skills and knife choices develop. I also like having nice stuff…..

That said, happy to be re-directed here – I know nothing other than what I’ve read on this topic.

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I prefer the aesthetics of a “silver” coloured blade as opposed to a partially black blade – please forgive me, I don’t yet know the right terms to describe the different finishes.

After a bit of research, I have the following knives on my list as options for buying something (hopefully) reasonable but relatively inexpensive with which to learn. I know I shouldn’t post web links with so few posts so hopefully you’ll be able to find what I’m looking at below:

• Shiro Kamo White 2 Damascus Gyuto 210 mm – chefs-edge [dot co dot uk] website - £129 + £25 delivery = £154.
• MUNEISHI AOGAMI STAINLESS CLAD DAMASCUS SANTOKU – cuttingedgeknives [dot co dot uk] website – £150 delivered (out of stock so would have to wait – but I’m happy to wait to get the right knife)
• Sasaoka Hasami Funayuki-bocho 150mm – knifejapan website – maybe a little short but happy to try – roughly £100 delivered.

Very grateful to anyone/everyone for any comments on the above choices and any recommendations, advice and guidance……. Many thanks in advance,

Stuart

 

[Hz_zzzzzz]

Do you pay VAT for this one? There’s a 15% off right now so it might fit your budget.

https://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/munetoshi-kurouchi-gyuto-210mm/

Munetoshi offers the best cutting performance in that price range IMHO. It’s sharp, solid, well balanced and easy to sharpen. Heat treat is great. It has a wide bevel so you can learning both sharpening and thinning/polishing with it.

 

[daveb]

Welcome. I'm not familiar with the Euro vendors - except for Cleancut (Sweden) and Japanese Natural Stones (Denmark).. I've had good experiences with both.

Cleancut has some Shiro Kama gyuto that seem to tick your boxes. Couple of Hinoura that are near the top of your range are very well thought of.

JNS has some nice knives and a "holiday" sale going right now.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Welcome and good for you to want to get into sharpening! That's the best possible approach. Learning the fundamentals of sharpening opens up and entire world of options to you.

The all silver with no pattern finish is called migaki while the black finish is called kurouchi aka KU. Nashiji and tsuchime are also common and there are various combinations of all of them.

I have a Sasoaka nakiri from KJ. It is indeed thin, a little too thin for my personal tastes but only really an issue during longer prep sessions. The cladding on my example has been quite robust. It has concave bevels so there won't be any real flattering going on. Overall a nice starter knife and would be good for learning on. I like shorter knives but 150 is getting down there so as a main knife, you might consider something longer. I mean, I do just fine most of the time with a 165 but 180 is my sweet spot.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Also, Tsunehisa is a viable brand. While there is some handwork, these are more factory than small smith type knives. But the upside there is consistency. I've had three (still have one) and while a tad thicker than my other knives, still a good step up from the standard German and German-style fare. The execution and performance of all mine have been solid. Their ginsan line, while stainless, will be very similar to simple carbons in sharpening.

Akifusa comes out of the same house but is a step up and little thinner overall.

 

[VincenteFox]

One of the first j-knives I bought was a Harukaze Aogami Super 210mm gyuto from ChefKnives ToGo. I think it's probably more factory/collective made, but I've had it for years and still like it a lot. It cuts well, it's comfortable in hand, and it sharpens up really nicely--I love Super Blue. It's more of a laser, so might fit what you're looking for, OP, and it's all shiny silver (plus a pretty dark rosewood handle rather than dumb old ho wood). It's 155 USD before shipping, so should fit your budget pretty well, but there's a slightly cheaper/smaller 180mm version as well, if you'd prefer (as well as a 240mm version). It's pretty light, though, and you quickly get used to longer knives, so I'd recommend the 210 if you're a grown man.

 

[VincenteFox]

Do you pay VAT for this one? There’s a 15% off right now so it might fit your budget.

https://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/munetoshi-kurouchi-gyuto-210mm/

Munetoshi offers the best cutting performance in that price range IMHO. It’s sharp, solid, well balanced and easy to sharpen. Heat treat is great. It has a wide bevel so you can learning both sharpening and thinning/polishing with it.

I get the desire to suggest the "best" knife to someone that fits their budget, but Munetoshis are also famous for having bad F&F and he likely won't have the skills or knowledge necessary to fix that yet, and it's got a KU finish which is not what he requested. So, while it's a good purchase in general (I was just looking at one!), I'm not sure it's the best fit for his goals right now. I know when I was new (hell, maybe still), I was more likely to appreciate something that fit what I wanted rather than something else that was better in a way I may not be able to fully appreciate.

 

[Hz_zzzzzz]

I get the desire to suggest the "best" knife to someone that fits their budget, but Munetoshis are also famous for having bad F&F and he likely won't have the skills or knowledge necessary to fix that yet, and it's got a KU finish which is not what he requested. So, while it's a good purchase in general (I was just looking at one!), I'm not sure it's the best fit for his goals right now. I know when I was new (hell, maybe still), I was more likely to appreciate something that fit what I wanted rather than something else that was better in a way I may not be able to fully appreciate.

Good point. I recommend Munetoshi mostly because I thought the MUNEISHI he lists is a kurochi knife and he’s open to it. Now I realize the cuttingedgeknives version is actually migaki so it’s not what I thought.

If “silver” looking is a hard requirement, probably in that price range stamped knives with western handles are more common with good fit and finish. Like Takamura chromax, JCK kagayaki, or a Misono swedish carbon. I’m not a fan of stamp knives with Japanese handles (aka lasers) as they feel light in hand.

Since op wants to learn sharpening and buy all those chosera stones, I think any kurochi (partially black) knife can be converted to a migaki (silverline) knife with some learning and practicing.

Here’s an example, I converted the knife in the picture below from left condition to right condition with stones and sandpapers. It can take some time but if you are open to learning polishing, you can basically convert any knife to silver looking.

 

[VincenteFox]

Takamuras are a good shout, too. They're a lot of knife for the money. I'd also put forth their SG2/R2

 

[V12Stu]

Do you pay VAT for this one? There’s a 15% off right now so it might fit your budget.

https://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/munetoshi-kurouchi-gyuto-210mm/

Munetoshi offers the best cutting performance in that price range IMHO. It’s sharp, solid, well balanced and easy to sharpen. Heat treat is great. It has a wide bevel so you can learning both sharpening and thinning/polishing with it.

Thanks for the recommendation - really helpful. Regrettably, the taxes applied on import would push the cost quite a bit higher and beyond budget...... The search continues!

 

[V12Stu]

Welcome. I'm not familiar with the Euro vendors - except for Cleancut (Sweden) and Japanese Natural Stones (Denmark).. I've had good experiences with both.

Cleancut has some Shiro Kama gyuto that seem to tick your boxes. Couple of Hinoura that are near the top of your range are very well thought of.

JNS has some nice knives and a "holiday" sale going right now.

Thanks @daveb - interesting that you suggest Shiro Kamo which was one of the makers on my shortlist so far - I had read good things about them generally. I'll delve a little deeper on those and also have a look at Hinoura - just need to watch the import taxes which push the cost up quite a bit. Why ever did we leave the EU??

 

[V12Stu]

Welcome and good for you to want to get into sharpening! That's the best possible approach. Learning the fundamentals of sharpening opens up and entire world of options to you.

The all silver with no pattern finish is called migaki while the black finish is called kurouchi aka KU. Nashiji and tsuchime are also common and there are various combinations of all of them.

I have a Sasoaka nakiri from KJ. It is indeed thin, a little too thin for my personal tastes but only really an issue during longer prep sessions. The cladding on my example has been quite robust. It has concave bevels so there won't be any real flattering going on. Overall a nice starter knife and would be good for learning on. I like shorter knives but 150 is getting down there so as a main knife, you might consider something longer. I mean, I do just fine most of the time with a 165 but 180 is my sweet spot.

Thanks @HumbleHomeCook - I really appreciate the education and encouragement! On reflection, I think the Sasaoka may be too much on the short side but really interesting to read your comments - I won't discount it for now. Thanks also for the suggestions of Tsunehisa and Akifusa - I'll also take a look at those as well.

 

[V12Stu]

One of the first j-knives I bought was a Harukaze Aogami Super 210mm gyuto from ChefKnives ToGo. I think it's probably more factory/collective made, but I've had it for years and still like it a lot. It cuts well, it's comfortable in hand, and it sharpens up really nicely--I love Super Blue. It's more of a laser, so might fit what you're looking for, OP, and it's all shiny silver (plus a pretty dark rosewood handle rather than dumb old ho wood). It's 155 USD before shipping, so should fit your budget pretty well, but there's a slightly cheaper/smaller 180mm version as well, if you'd prefer (as well as a 240mm version). It's pretty light, though, and you quickly get used to longer knives, so I'd recommend the 210 if you're a grown man.

Thanks @VincenteFox - I'll also take a look at your suggestion. Yep - grown man - nearly 55 and thoroughly OCD so your comments about Munetoshi F&F in your next post are particularly relevant - thank you. I think I'm converging on the 180 to 210 mm blade length.....

 

[V12Stu]

Just to let everyone know what I went with in the end, I've just ordered a Shiro Kamo Tora Gyuto 210 mm Aogami #2 with iron cladding from cleancut in Sweden - thanks to @daveb for pointing this company out.

As it's my first knife, I also wanted to try a fully reactive blade to see how I get on with it - part of the OCD in me thinks not, but I love some of the patinas that I've seen on the relevant thread on this forum. So, I've thrown caution/OCD to the wind and will give it a try!

It's going to be a birthday present so I won't use it until about a month's time - but I'll post some thoughts as I use it in case anyone's interested.

Thanks again to everyone that posted their help above - I really do appreciate it.