Norton India.. what am I doing?

[Pie]

More specifically, how can I optimize performance?

Can I get it wet with water? Do I keep adding oil when it gets dry?

I used a bit of oil and then made a royal mess by adding water. I’m not sure exactly what it’s doing because there’s no slurry, and it appears there’s not much swarf either, but it looks like it’s cutting faster than I think. Like, faster than SG220. But it can’t be, can it? Where’s all the metal going?

Got some heirloom type stuff to restore, I thought it’d be cool to do it on something period correct.

 

[Legion74]

That's an oil stone and a very hard one. You put oil on it and away you go. You dont add water, and it will not really slurry.

 

[BillHanna]

@stringer

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Yep, it is already impregnated with oil. Some folks like to boil it out and make them more of a water stone. I keep them as oil stones. For coarse work, plain mineral oil will get you through. You don't need a ton. As in it does not need to be running off the stone. The entire surface just needs to soak up some oil to suspend the swarf. When you're done using the stone, pour some more oil on it and rub it all around with your finger. You'll start lifting that swarf out. I wash mine with dish soap and water.

You can also use water, especially if you've used oil a couple times and the surface is fairly impregnated. But don't mix oil and water at the same time.

I prefer using oil just to keep the stone from clogging cuz they suck to work on.

Don't get oil anywhere near your water stones. I keep my oil stones in a totally separate place and thoroughly wash my hands and knife before transitioning to water stones.

Crystolon's and India's work fast. India's are touch slower but neither creates a slurry or sheds much grit. Obviously the coarser they are the more grit they'll shed, especially under heavy work, but still nothing like what you are probably used to. They're great stones that I believe are often underappreciated.

 

[stringer]

I always liked India stones better for edge work. Crystolons for thinning//hogging/dealing with larger surface area. Oil works best. They respond well to some pressure.

 

[captaincaed]

Hey you got my stone!
It’s an oil stone, I’d keep it as oil.

The Norton tri-hone uses the same stone types, and is a constantly submerged oil bath. While potentially messy, it’s quite effective at pulling swarf out of the pores. (I cleaned out my grandfathers tri hone after 20 years of neglect - stones were clean but the basin was a nightmare).

So you can stay ahead of it with oil application during use, wipe down after. Maybe a little extra oil to float the swarf off at the end. While it’s nice to keep things in the box, a dedicated Tupperware might make life easier. Maybe keep a little oil in the bottom to passively clean the surface between uses (last used side down). Clean it out periodically. If you wanted a “system”.

I also used windex with partial success when I didn’t want to bother with oil. But it’s an oilstone at heart. Best experience when you lean into it.

I passed that stone on because I’m using the larger 11x3 stones I salvaged from the tri hone, not because I don’t like that type of stone.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Hey you got my stone!
It’s an oil stone, I’d keep it as oil.

The Norton tri-hone uses the same stone types, and is a constantly submerged oil bath. While potentially messy, it’s quite effective at pulling swarf out of the pores. (I cleaned out my grandfathers tri hone after 20 years of neglect - stones were clean but the basin was a nightmare).

So you can stay ahead of it with oil application during use, wipe down after. Maybe a little extra oil to float the swarf off at the end. I also used windex with partial success when I didn’t want to bother with oil. But it’s an oilstone at heart. Best experience when you lean into it.

I passed that stone on because I’m not using the larger 11x3 stones I salvaged from the tri hone, not because I don’t like that type of stone.

When I saw the Hardwicks sticker I knew it came from you.

 

[M1k3]

They definitely keep working better long term with oil. You can use water with a little soap also.

Where is the swarf going? Into the pores of the stone.

Spray WD-40 with the little straw attachment works great to get swarf out of surface.

 

[Pie]

Awesome. Thanks guys! I was working at it with the shapton and hd a hard time believing stuff was even coming off on the India.

I appreciate the true nature of the stone and won’t try to degrease it. Having a dedicated container for it also is a great idea.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Awesome. Thanks guys! I was working at it with the shapton and hd a hard time believing stuff was even coming off on the India.

I appreciate the true nature of the stone and won’t try to degrease it. Having a dedicated container for it also is a great idea.

Get a Crystolon. I recommend a coarse but your choice.

 

[mike59]

Isn't this the stone once referred to as "The Greatest Sharpening Stone in the World" by @cotedupy ?

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/the-greatest-sharpening-stone-in-the-world.57999/

 

[Pie]

Get a Crystolon. I recommend a coarse but your choice.

This thing’s a monster. Does it not dish??

 

[Legion74]

This thing’s a monster. Does it not dish??View attachment 243462

Eventually, but it takes a lot. I have ~100yo Pike India stones that are still flat enough to be fine for knives. If I ever manage to dish them more I'll bang them out of their wooden box, turn them over and start again.

 

[M1k3]

This thing’s a monster. Does it not dish??View attachment 243462

Not really. It'll probably clog up before dishing. But either way, use SiC when when needed.

 

[Pie]

Not really. It'll probably clog up before dishing. But either way, use SiC when when needed.

Eventually, but it takes a lot. I have ~100yo Pike India stones that are still flat enough to be fine for knives. If I ever manage to dish them more I'll bang them out of their wooden box, turn them over and start again.

Awesome. I had no idea such a stone existed.

The other thing I noticed is the blade gets *hot* when grinding. No water to cool it down I suppose, and maybe I’m still underestimating just how fast it is.

 

[M1k3]

Awesome. I had no idea such a stone existed.

The other thing I noticed is the blade gets *hot* when grinding. No water to cool it down I suppose, and maybe I’m still underestimating just how fast it is.

Use more lubrication or ease up on the pressure.

 

[BillHanna]

Use more lubrication or ease up on the pressure.

That’s what she said




(Got ‘em)

 

[Desert Rat]

The stone does look a little dry, I use more oil and put a rag under the stone.

 

[captaincaed]

Yeah coarser stones benefit from liberal oil, maybe more viscous than you'd suspect. Honing razors on black Arks just needs a couple drops of thinner sewing machine oil, just to help things slide (@BillHanna). Coarse metal removal on a porous stone like yours seems to work better with thicker, more liberal oil to "float" swarf out of the pores. Storing it "business side down" in some oil seems to also help clean things out. (Maybe on a couple toothpicks so it doesn't sit right in the swarf)

My own limited experience - ymmv!

 

[deltaplex]

You can dish them with some effort, otherwise just use pressure and clean them off when they feel like they're getting clogged up. I like using either another stone to "clean" the surface, a wire brush and WD-40, or just WD-40 depending on what I'm doing and how much crap I've got on top of the stone at the time.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I agree that on that last picture that it could use more oil.

As I said, for the coarser stones I use plain mineral oil. For my Arks I tend to like honing oil which is just a highly refined (and thin) mineral oil.

 

[Pie]

Thanks for the further instructions guys. As you can see this is new territory for me, but im really liking how it behaves!

Big thanks @captaincaed for the stone!

 

[Ruso]

I got IB8 and its a PITA to flatten (eventually everything dishes) and refresh the surface. Its fast though, but due to the above it barely sees any use.

 

[Desert Rat]

I got along for years refreshing the surface with the three stone method, usually with a crystolon or two thrown in, now I prefer a diamond plate, one I don't care about. It also helps keep the surface flat.
I would rather buy a new India than try and flatten one.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I got along for years refreshing the surface with the three stone method, usually with a crystolon or two thrown in, now I prefer a diamond plate, one I don't care about. It also helps keep the surface flat.
I would rather buy a new India than try and flatten one.

Yeah, I don't think I'd bother flattening one either. But then, I don't think I've ever really needed to. I have a coarse Crystolon that is showing some wear but it' just heavy work stone so I'm not concerned about it. I typically buy the 1/2" anyway.

Do you have a diamond grin you prefer for refreshing?

 

[Legion74]

Awesome. I had no idea such a stone existed.

They are most likely the biggest selling man made stone in history, and for good reason.

With mine, when I've finished honing I wipe off the swarf with a rag or paper towel, apply some clean oil and rub the surface vigorously with my finger tips to release the embedded swarf and wipe that off too. Same procedure for a washita or soft Ark. That will prevent it clogging up for a good long while. If you ever get to a point where it needs more than that give it a scrub with kerosene.

 

[deltaplex]

I like to use the random SiCs I've ended up with oil, sprinkled with some loose SiC once they start clogging, then I keep that slurry cutting by adding WD-40 as needed. I'll scrub it up with a brush and soap and water once the slurry has broken down to a point that it has noticeably slowed down and start all over again.

 

[Desert Rat]

Yeah, I don't think I'd bother flattening one either. But then, I don't think I've ever really needed to. I have a coarse Crystolon that is showing some wear but it' just heavy work stone so I'm not concerned about it. I typically buy the 1/2" anyway.

Do you have a diamond grin you prefer for refreshing?

I tried to flatten one I got stuck with and I kind of did on sic powder, but the juice just wasn't worth the squeeze.

I will use any old diamond plate I have laying around to freshen the surface.

I'm thinking of doing what Joe does here and just get a cheap diamond plate from Harbor Freight. They didn't have them last I checked though.