PLEASE HELP ME! 30 Gyuto Choices & 24 Bunka/Nakiri

[Matthew Knox]

I really need help narrowing down my options of each knife to a Top 3 picks of each style. If you have the time, I’d really appreciate input and knowledgeable advice.

Here’s what I’m looking for:
•Top Quality Knife
•Double Bevel
•Prefer lighter knives for the longer ones-so it can feel like an extension of my arm and not a barbell
•Aesthetically Beautiful(Love custom handles, nashiji, kurouchi{don’t love that it only last around 5-10yrs})
•From a reputable brand/blacksmith
•Not Known to be “chippy”
•Something I could pass down as an heirloom maybe
•I don’t care if the Gyuto & Bunka/Nakiri match-however, I want them to be complimentary to one another....”what one isn’t great for, the other knife is” kind of complimentary


So here are the lists

GYUTO


• Hattori Forums Custom Limited Edition Year 2018, FH Series Gyuto 210mm

• Hinoura Hyakuren Gyuto 210mm Hammered KU White 2

• Kaneshige TB Blue #2 Gyuto

• Kochi 240mm Kurouchi Stainless Clad Carbon Wa-Gyuto

• Konosuke Keiai T1 Gyuto

• Konosuke MB White #2 Gyuto

• Makoto White #2 Gyuto Custom

• Masakage Koishi Gyuto

• Matsubara Nashiji Blue #2 Gyuto Custom

• Moritaka AS Custom Gyuto

• Seisuke AUS-10 45 Layer Damascus Japanese Gyuto Chef Knife

• Shinko Seilan Gyuto KU Aogami Super by Shiro Kama

• Sukenari ZDP189 3 Layer Gyuto

• Syousin Chiku KU Gyuto 240mm Aogami Super, Stainless Cladding by Kurosaki

• Syousin Suminagashi R2 Damascus Gyuto 240mm By Shiro Kamo

• Takeda NAS 240mm Gyuto with Custom Handle

• Tanaka Blue 2 Kurouchi Gyuto 240mm with custom octagonal Ebony handle

• Tanaka Blue #2 Nashiji Gyuto 240mm Custom

• Tanaka Blue 2 Nashiji Gyuto 240mm Stainless Clad

• Tanaka Ginsan Nashiji Gyuto 240mm K&S special

• Tanaka Ginsan Nashiji Gyuto 210mm - Lite

• Wakui Gyuto 240mm White 2 Stainless Clad

• Watanabe Kintaro-Ame Gyuto Custom

• Watanabe Kurouchi Gyuto 240mm

• Yahiko White #2 Hammered Gyuto 240mm Custom

• Yoshimi Kato Aogami Super Clad Kurouchi AC Chef Knife(Gyuto) 240mm with Black Cherry Octagonal Handle

• Yoshimi Kato Aogami Super Clad Nashiji AC Chef Knife(Gyuto) 240mm with Black Cherry Octagonal Handle

• Yoshimune White #1 Custom Gyuto 240mm

• Yu Kurosaki SG2 Hammered SHIZUKU WA RS8P Chef Knife(Gyuto) 240mm with White-Ring Octagonal Handle




BUNKA/NAKIRI

• Anryu Kurouchi Damascus Bunka 165mm

• Ebuchi White #2 Bunka 170mm

• Fujiwara Teruyasu Nashiji Nakiri 170mm

• Goko White #1 Bunka 170mm

• Hinoura Limited, MHSP-18 White Steel No.1 Kurouchi Series Na kiri 165mm

• Kikuichi NWD Nickel Warikomi Damascus 45 layers Rose-wood Series

• Kikuichi Swedish Warikomi Nakiri 175mm

• Kochi 180mm Kurouchi Nakiri

• Kochi 180mm Kurouchi Stainless Clad Carbon Kiritsuke Shaped Wa Gyuto

• Kohetsu Blue #2 Nashiji Nakiri 165mm

• Kurosaki AS Bunka 165mm

• Kurosaki Megumi Nakiri 165mm

• Yu Kurosaki SG2 Hammered SHIZUKU WA RSBP Nakiri 165mm with White-Ring Octagonal Handle

• Masakage Kiri VG-10 Bunka 170mm

• Masakage Koishi Bunka 170mm

• Masakage Koishi Ko Bunka 130mm

• Mizuno Tanrenjo Akitada Hontanren Series White Steel No.2 Nakiri 165mm

• Shinko Kurokumo R2 Damascus Nakiri 180mm by Shiro Kamo

• Wakui 165mm Nakiri Shirogami #2 Ho Handle

• Watanabe Kurouchi Nakkiri knife 180mm

• Watanabe Kurouchi Nakiri 165mm

• Yoshimi Kato 63 Layer VG-10 Black Damascus RS Nakiri 165mm with Round Handle

• Yoshimi Kato Aogami Super Clad Kurouchi AC Bunka Knife 170mm with Black Cherry Octagonal Handle

• Yoshimune White #1 Nakiri 165mm Custom

 

[rickg17]

You need to decide whether you want full carbon, clad or stainless. That alone will narrow things down. And decide on a finish you like. That's something you kind of need to pick for yourself.

Next, consider whether you want a thin, light blade or a thicker more workhorse blade.

Finally, I'd think about limiting price.

 

[panda]

this look like

 

[lemeneid]

Here’s what I’m looking for:
•Top Quality Knife
•Double Bevel
•Prefer lighter knives for the longer ones-so it can feel like an extension of my arm and not a barbell
•Aesthetically Beautiful(Love custom handles, nashiji, kurouchi{don’t love that it only last around 5-10yrs})
•From a reputable brand/blacksmith
•Not Known to be “chippy”
•Something I could pass down as an heirloom maybe
•I don’t care if the Gyuto & Bunka/Nakiri match-however, I want them to be complimentary to one another....”what one isn’t great for, the other knife is” kind of complimentary

Get a custom, tell the knifemaker what you want so you don't need to trawl down the list of our recommendations which will not live up to your expectations.

 

[Jville]

What's your budget?

 

[Mute-on]

Looks like you are trying to buy everything at once. Don’t. If you think you will buy three knives and walk away happy you are kidding yourself. Don’t ask me how I know ...

Buy ONE knife. Gyuto, Nakiri, Bunka. Doesn’t really matter which. Personally I would go for a mid weight, mid height, San-Mai 210 Gyuto with a carbon core steel, and iron or stainless clad. Kurouchi if you want. Forget Damascus. It’s cosmetic and contributes to price, but not performance.

Better yet, stop surfing the net and just call Jon Broida at JKI and buy what he recommends.

Good luck!

J

 

[Matthew Knox]

I can’t believe I left off my budget! I’m looking to spend around $600.00 in total. Splitting the budget between the two knives. As far as the carbon, clad, or stainless question, I am experienced at taking care of higher end knives and ones that are quite reactive. Personally, I’m a fan of the patina, however, I also do love not having to worry haha. So that one is a bit of a toss up. I already have a custom knife made by a strikingly talented American bladesmith, so I was really looking for an either very established/renowned Japanese knife designer or one who is quickly moving up the ranks in becoming one (I.e. Yu Kurosaki). I touched on it in my “wants”, but I DO prefer a lighter blade. I have a German “beater” workhorse to handle to touch jobs that would injure my gyuto.

 

[Grunt173]

If I couldn't make up my mind with all the knives that are listed and I was pondering over any one of them,I would just leave it to fate and write them all down on a piece of paper and put them all in a hat and draw.

 

[Matthew Knox]

Looks like you are trying to buy everything at once. Don’t. If you think you will buy three knives and walk away happy you are kidding yourself. Don’t ask me how I know ...

Buy ONE knife. Gyuto, Nakiri, Bunka. Doesn’t really matter which. Personally I would go for a mid weight, mid height, San-Mai 210 Gyuto with a carbon core steel, and iron or stainless clad. Kurouchi if you want. Forget Damascus. It’s cosmetic and contributes to price, but not performance.

Better yet, stop surfing the net and just call Jon Broida at JKI and buy what he recommends.

Good luck!

J

I was writing a response as you wrote your post. Thank you Mute-On. I know my appetite is a bit vast. My grandfather lived in Komatsu, Japan a little north of Fukui and had a collection of BEAUTIFUL knives some even over 200 yrs old. After his recent passing, they were all stolen from his home before my father and my uncle were able to get them. So, I guess I am just being over zealous in starting back up his legacy of knife collecting.

I believe you are right in getting a clad. It kind of splits the difference. If my hands were tied and I was FORCED to get both a gyuto and a bunka/nakiri, lol, what would your recommendation be for the two? What should I consider in each knife? I know that they are pretty similar in their uses, but should I be looking for something in particular in a gyuto and not a nakiri or vice versa?

I will call Jon Broida from jki as well. Thank you for the contact.

 

[Grunt173]

+1 ....calling Jon is a great idea.

 

[Jville]

I'll throw the kurasaki r2 hammered out there paired with a watanabe 180 nakiri. I've tried kurasakis but not the thinner r2 version (not the shizuku that you mentioned). This would give you athinner laserish gyuto from a reputable Smith that you are interested in. I've used toyamas and have a 210 nakiri. The Watanabe are supposedly quite similar, so I would expect the 180 wat to balance out the lighter gyuto with some power. Also very reputable, that particular knife also has a great rep from what I've heard. Two other gyutos to consider is the pure laser shibata. His lasers are the epitome of a laser I'm, fantastic performers, or you could go the makato AS which seems extremely similiar to the kurasaki laser that I owned, which was fantastic! These are just a couple of suggestions. Obviously you could go in a multitude if directions. But I do think these could be some good ones to get you going. The gyutos I recommended we're basically lasers, because you said you wanted a lighter knife.

 

[Panamapeet]

Honestly (and I don't want to be a party pooper) if you can't eliminate some knives from all the ones you have listed you have definitely not done any research. Also, your requirements and budget don't match (Watanabe dammy + a bunka for 600 usd; two top quality knives for 600 usd, etc.).

 

[Matthew Knox]

Honestly (and I don't want to be a party pooper) if you can't eliminate some knives from all the ones you have listed you have definitely not done any research. Also, your requirements and budget don't match (Watanabe dammy + a bunka for 600 usd; two top quality knives for 600 usd, etc.).

I can assure you, I have put in very extensive research. This was simply to ask others for their opinion on my list. You’re not a party pooper. However, if you can’t offer beneficial advice and are just leaving belittling comments, please abstain from writing. There are at least 20 different options in my list that include a Wanatabe knife + another brand that equal $600 or less.

 

[HRC_64]

I can assure you, I have put in very extensive research. This was simply to ask others for their opinion on my list.

You're list looks like a chineese takout menu,
I think you should order the #104 extra spicey.

 

[daveb]

Lets back the truck up.

We're happy that you've come here looking for knife advice. It's what we live for.

But.

You've asked for advice choosing between all variants of steel, cladding, price points, type without narrowing anything down to your preferences. This is a subjective game - you gotta know a bit about what you like.

And.

You've linked 143 different knives, none of which appear to (albeit a quick look) come from any of our sponsoring vendors. We like our sponsors. They make this site possible. Most (though not all) of my knives come from our sponsoring vendors. They are the ones I know the most about.

And.

If you can't find a couple knives to choose from, from EE, JKI, JNS, K&S, Korin (hope I didn't forget anyone) then you're not looking.

No TV until you've done your homework

 

[Mute-on]

I can’t give you one suggestion for each. I have too many knives I like for different reasons. Many others here will be in a similar position. That’s why I suggested you start with one knife, and use it for a while to learn at least one combination of steel, weight, grind and profile.

If you are serious about putting a decent collection of knives together that you will use, buy another 20 knives, one at a time, and each different from the last. Then you might know what works for you.

For now, just call Jon. Seriously.

 

[Mute-on]

However ...

The Watanabe 180 Ku Nakiri is a pretty popular choice around here.

I don’t have one, though, so can’t comment from experience.

 

[Panamapeet]

I can assure you, I have put in very extensive research. This was simply to ask others for their opinion on my list. You’re not a party pooper. However, if you can’t offer beneficial advice and are just leaving belittling comments, please abstain from writing. There are at least 20 different options in my list that include a Wanatabe knife + another brand that equal $600 or less.

Standard 240 Watanabe Kintaro Ame is 76000 yen (680 USD)

Sorry if I came on too strong, but the list is just too long

Watanabe 180 is a great knife by the way

 

[Xenif]

This has got to be one of the most discombobulated lists of all time ...
Imho, the profile of the knife and the way it matches the motions of your cuts is more important, and then you look for the maker that makes a similar profile in the steel you would like.
Thats why the questionnaire exists, it help people give proper suggestions based on your preferences

I can assure you, Matthew, that most people are here to help. People hear breath knives, and would like nothing more than to give PROPER advice.

 

[esoo]

Just to add something that isn't on your list:

Shibata Kotetsu 180 Bunka.

Defines Laser - super light and nimble with great steel. Ghosts through things like onions and carrots. But it is *thin* so you need decent technique. I've heard the edge on mine ping a few times with bad technique but it hasn't chipped yet.

 

[daveb]

However ...

The Watanabe 180 Ku Nakiri is a pretty popular choice around here.

I don’t have one, though, so can’t comment from experience.

I do. I went off the reservation for this one and I like it. Newcomers / home cooks may be better suited with the 165mm though.

 

[Jkts]

I agree with mute-on- pick one good knife at a time- you have years to build a collection. Use each purchase to help guide you on the next.

The Watanabe is a good choice- if you want a family heirloom , go with a polished custom nakiri on the professional line with an upgraded handle like keyaki. Although you have a decent budget, it will probably not get you a kintaro ame, so I would suggest polished.

Shinichi Watanabe is one of the Japanese master smiths with whom you can communicate directly. His professional line is made by him start to finish.

A nakiri will cut different than a chefs knife or gyuto which you can pick later when you have a little more hands on experience with Japanese knives. It will give you a sense of what different knives can do rather than buying many variations of one knife type.

 

[Matthew Knox]

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to come off as snarky. Maybe to some who are as knowledgable as most on here are, it may not seem like I have done research. However, I've spent hours upon hours over the past few months looking at knives, reading up on basic anatomy of knives, western vs. japanese, steel(construction, alloys added, how it was forged), terminology, etc. So, coming from zero knowledge other than my grandfather owning thousands of dollars worth to now. I have done research.

The reason why the list might be a bit all over the place(discombobulated) is because to me, they all see viable. I am still learning and is the entire reason I am on here showing what I have narrowed down for myself out of 100's of 1000's of knives out there. I left the list as large as I did, hoping that one of them would be an obvious choice.

If I had narrowed down more I would have said narrowed it at least down to brand - Kurosaki, Takeda, Tanaka, & Watanabe. I didn't cut it down as much for fear of possibly missing out on a greater knife in the more extended list.

Spipet- I am aware of the price for Kintaro Ame. Yes, you are right that by purchasing that knife I would then be over budget. I was referring to the Watanabe Kurouchi Gyuto 240mm($310), Kurouchi Nakiri 165mm($255) and 180mm(22,000jpy=$198.56). At which, I could purchase another knife and still be within $600.

There are about 15 of them from one of the sponsors. There might be more but my screenshots just happened to come from a alternate site.
Hinoura Hyakuren, Shinko Seilan, Syousin Suminagashi, Tanaka, Wakui, Shinko Kurokumo by Shiro Kamo-K&S
Kochi-JKI

 

[Matthew Knox]

Thank you guys very much for your advice though. I will just continue to do more research. Could you point me in the direction to do that? What sites you have found to be the most helpful?

 

[Jkts]

Perhaps it is the way the question is asked-usually people say what characteristics and uses they are looking for, and they receive suggestions that meet those parameters.

You’ve already laid dozens of knife choices. It is like naming 50 cars and asking which one should I buy?

Your decision is based on personal preferences that you have to make- do you want stainless or carbon, western or Japanese handle, what kind of finish, thickness, ease of sharpening, etc. That will narrow the field.

The number of choices these days is overwhelming. Most people here will have experience in only a handful of those brands- and if they say pick this, does it matter if the suggestion is based on their preferences rather than yours?

For beginners, you can probably pick any knife and it’s an upgrade.

Maybe rather than asking do I want this particular knife, the first question is what kind of knife do I want?

 

[Barmoley]

Why don't you fill out the questioner like someone above suggested https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/the-which-knife-should-i-buy-questionnaire-v2.12791/

Concentrate on getting just one knife, I would suggest a gyuto. Fill out the questioner just for that one knife, you will get a lot more useful responses this way. Once you get that knife and use it for a bit, you will know a lot more about what works for you and which direction you want to continue. Your list is too large for anyone to be able to give you reasonable advice, you might as well just randomly pick one knife out of it. Another great suggestion that was also mentioned is to contact Jon at https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/ and explain to him what you are looking for, without the list, he will suggest a good choice for you. This forum is one of the best places to do research, but you have to follow advice the members are giving you.

 

[rickg17]

As I and others have said, you can narrow this list down via your preferences. For example, if you really want a carbon knife (solely or san mai), then that eliminates the stainless ones. If you love the look of a kurouchi finish, boom, eliminate the nashiji and Damascus ones. If you don't do a lot of veggie prep, you can wait on the nakiri. So that example would get you to the gyuto which are carbon with a ku finish. THEN people here can tell you a little about the handful of knives that are left over.

Even if you'd like to eventually have a selection of different finished gyutos... pick one or two to start with. I know you're trying to rebuild a collection (and I feel for you that your grandfather's was stolen) but a good collection is a reflection of the collector, not just an assemblage of the things and is put together over time as you learn what you like, what you don't like and what you love.

What speaks to YOU?

PS: If you're building a collection, there are at least 2 different criteria, too. One is what you will use in the kitchen. Another is what you want mostly or solely for the aesthetics. Maybe you LOVE the look of a ku finished Hinoura but when you use them, you prefer a Tanaka or a Watanabe.

 

[McMan]

I will just continue to do more research. Could you point me in the direction to do that? What sites you have found to be the most helpful?

This site is a trove of knowledge! Just use the search feature.

Your decision is based on personal preferences that you have to make- do you want stainless or carbon, western or Japanese handle, what kind of finish, thickness, ease of sharpening, etc. That will narrow the field.

Exactly. More time with the search feature here
Making some preliminary choices will help whittle down the candidates and help people offer advice about what would suit you best within your parameters. For example, a few good places to start would be weight and steel--do you want a laser, a mid-weight, or a workhorse? Stainless or Carbon or stainless-clad or KU, etc.?
For example, "I'd like some feedback about options for a stainless-clad carbon midweight 240mm gyuto" is a question that'll get great input from folks. Or, "What carbon KU workhorse in 240mm would you recommend?"... adding variables means making some choices about what you want and making those choices might mean more research (and/or reflection on how you use knives and plan to maintain them).

Now, I'll take the bait... Get a Watanabe Nakiri (polished) and a Hinoura 210 gyuto. Done.

 

[Panamapeet]

This site is a trove of knowledge! Just use the search feature.


Exactly. More time with the search feature here
Making some preliminary choices will help whittle down the candidates and help people offer advice about what would suit you best within your parameters. For example, a few good places to start would be weight and steel--do you want a laser, a mid-weight, or a workhorse? Stainless or Carbon or stainless-clad or KU, etc.?
For example, "I'd like some feedback about options for a stainless-clad carbon midweight 240mm gyuto" is a question that'll get great input from folks. Or, "What carbon KU workhorse in 240mm would you recommend?"... adding variables means making some choices about what you want and making those choices might mean more research (and/or reflection on how you use knives and plan to maintain them).

Now, I'll take the bait... Get a Watanabe Nakiri (polished) and a Hinoura 210 gyuto. Done.

Watanabe pro nakiri and hinoura ajikataya 240, now that is a killer idea!

 

[Matthew Knox]

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/knife-questionnaire_revisited.37709/