Sharpener for non-sharpener

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Michi

Michi

I dislike attempts to rewrite history
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A friend of mine has a Kaeru gyuto with Hitachi SLD blade. Not a knife enthusiast, just passionate cook. He is not interested in learning how to sharpen on bench stones.

I'm looking for alternatives that don't suck completely. Under consideration:
What would people here recommend in this case? I suggested a soft Arkansas initially for touch ups and maintenance. They used to be available here for about $5, but now can't be found for less than $30.

I'm inclined to instead recommend a diamond or ceramic honing rod, around 10" long, with a proper handle. What would be the best brand/model/grit in this case?

Thanks in advance for your help!
 
ACHiPo said:
Ceramic honing rod and a recommendation for a professional he can send it to periodically.
Click to expand...
That person would be me, and I have made that offer already. But he needs something for touch-ups, so he doesn't show up at my place every month or two :)
 
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Michi said:
That person would be me, and I have made that offer already. But he needs something for touch-ups, so he doesn't show up at my place every month or two :)
Click to expand...
You say that like it is frequently. If he is a "passionate cook" I don't think touch-ups are enough for a month or two of service unless he has a wall of knives to choose from.

Defining touch-up as e.g. a ceramic rod. Anything more becomes a form of sharpening, with requisite finesse.
 
Mr.Wizard said:
You say that like it is frequently. If he is a "passionate cook" I don't think touch-ups are enough for a month or two of service unless he has a wall of knives to choose from.

Defining touch-up as e.g. a ceramic rod. Anything more becomes a form of sharpening, with requisite finesse.
Click to expand...
There's indeed a serious learning curve with the use of a ceramic rod. It will for sure raise a burr that has to get abraded. No big issue for who is used to work with stones, but otherwise problematic. Already feeling a burr is a serious hurdle.
 
I feel like SLD isn't really tough and might be not be the best steel to be putting on a rod? Not the authority here in any sense, but I avoid the rods on anything over 61 HRC / known to be a really tough Steel (52100 / AEB-L / A2).

I do admit its also probably a skill issue for me on the rods as well so I'd just rather not risk my hard knives to learn it well.

Maybe a nice hard kangaroo strop with diamond compound will revive a edge for a reasonable cost?
 
My recommendations for people who want to sharpen but don’t want to learn to use a whetstone, is and always will be an angled rod system. Lansky turn box is something a few family members have and it works well for their softer steel knives, the spyderco sharp maker is a more premium version of the same thing.

All you have to do is 1) pull it out of the drawer 2) stick the rods in the holes 3) hold your knife straight 4) put it away.

It’s a lot less intimidating for a new sharpener since the only angle you need to maintain is straight up and down. The only limitation is the most acute it can get is 20DPS. If he’s ready for more horsepower than that, the sharpmaker can get down to 15DPS.

Tape over the 25DPS holes on the Lansky and the diamond rods since most home users probably won’t need them to simplify the work flow.

Thinning just isn’t a thing most home users will need for awhile, and by the time they do hopefully are open to stones by that point.
 
I really struggle to see how any guided system are a better solution for someone who can't be bothered to fuss with stones. It takes up more space, more setup-time and I don't think they're all that much easier to get started with anyway.

Sounds like the Kaeru is a bit of a pealrs for swine situation. Should have gone for a Victorinox and an electric pullthrough instead... ;)
 
Jovidah said:
I really struggle to see how any guided system are a better solution for someone who can't be bothered to fuss with stones. It takes up more space, more setup-time and I don't think they're all that much easier to get started with anyway.
Click to expand...

Not sure I agree with that; maybe the permanently fixed rods yeah. But most of the modern ones like Lansky or spyderco and their derivatives the rods come out, and tuck away into the box. The entire system is typically as small or smaller than a single sharpening stone, and it doesn’t require the same storage considerations to avoid chipping. Can literally toss it into the junk drawer.

The rest of the activation energy you mentioned in terms of are significantly lower, or the same as a stone.

You still need to pull out a stone, you need to set up a towel under it to prevent slippage, you have to get some amount of water on it for swarf removal. You have to maintain a relatively unnatural angle, on a piece that is titled at a strange angle to your eyes so some folks will struggle to tell the angle. You have to clean up the water after. You have to dry the stone and put it away where it won’t be damaged.

Rods? Take it out. Insert rods in desired angle holes. Sharpen by maintaining the knife vertical which is easier than an angle of 15-20 degrees. A few times a year take the rods to the sink and scrub them with your sponge to removal swarf. Put rods back into box. Store anywhere it won’t fall. The entire set up time for one of the boxes, once you have it out of the drawer is maybe 15-20 seconds, waaaay less in my experience than a whetstone.

Simpler sharpening, simpler storage, simpler clean up. It won’t do thinning, and they aren’t great for heavy duty stuff like chip removal because the jump between the diamond rods and the ceramics is pretty huge, but for week to week jobs it’s great for keeping a knife sharp and letting a person appreciate what a joy consistently sharp knife is to use. I haven’t talked family members into using benchstones, but the rod systems have been a much easier sell when I’ve demonstrated both the edge and how easy it is to get the edge with them,
 
Benuser said:
There's indeed a serious learning curve with the use of a ceramic rod. It will for sure raise a burr that has to get abraded. No big issue for who is used to work with stones, but otherwise problematic. Already feeling a burr is a serious hurdle.
Click to expand...
I suppose you're right. My thinking was that, unlike a diamond file, the amount of damage done would be minimal assuming some restraint in force applied. What options are there besides these?
  1. Use a dull knife until it is sharpened once every couple of months
  2. Get more knives to rotate, until all are sharpened every couple of months
  3. Have the knife sharpened more often
  4. Get a guided system and learn to use it
  5. Get at least one stone and learn to use it
 
JustAnotherJoe said:
Another example of a larger fixed ceramic rod set up.
https://idahoners.com/collections/v-type-sharpeners/products/four-rod-v-sharpener-with-storage
Another option not mentioned yet, a strop. I've set up a family members up with hard leather stops loaded with 3micron diamonds and I've been quite suprised how long he can go without needing some help with stones.
Click to expand...

I watched the video and I'm curious why you wouldn’t just pull the knife through the V formed where the two rods meet? Seems like it would provide more consistency.

It does seem like a decent alternative to a pull-through electric sharpener for people who don't want to mess with whetstones or complicated sharpening jigs.

That's a good idea with the loaded strop too. I think the full-length edge-trailing stropping motion is something people find natural and approachable.
 
Last edited:
Delat said:
I watched the video and I'm curious why you would've just pull the knife through the V formed where the two rods meet? Seems like it would provide more consistency.
Click to expand...
I think you'll wear a groove in the rods at the single point of contact, and the scratches on the edge will be in the wrong direction for tooth.
 
DoYoon Kim said:
I feel like SLD isn't really tough and might be not be the best steel to be putting on a rod? Not the authority here in any sense, but I avoid the rods on anything over 61 HRC / known to be a really tough Steel (52100 / AEB-L / A2).

I do admit its also probably a skill issue for me on the rods as well so I'd just rather not risk my hard knives to learn it well.

Maybe a nice hard kangaroo strop with diamond compound will revive a edge for a reasonable cost?
Click to expand...
These fine honing rods are perfectly fine even for super hard steels. (like AS for example)

Yes, they are not ideal ideal, but they work pretty good as a quick touch up as long you use them correctly.

You have to apply very little pressure and hone each side ~3-6 times.
 
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