Should I return this?

[ile74]

Hi KKF members, I would like to ask your opinion about my recent purchase, 300 mm hamokiri from quite well known Japanese seller. Price was around same as Masamoto KS 300 mm Hamokiri with 40% extra for lefty. Knife was marketed as mirror finished, but as I got it there was quite severe scratches along the Shinogi, largest and most visible near the heel. Otherwise knife is good, blade is straight, profile and geometry are fine. I cleaned protective coating with acetone and cotton wool and it got definitely better (last picture) but there is still deep scratches and I am quite irritated as they pop up from mirror finish.

Scratches are quite deep and doesn't seem like polishing scratches from stone or sandpaper. Seems to me more like fail in masking and coating. Is it possible that mirror finish is done by chromoium coating/plating? Mirror polishing lines are straight and doesn't go exactly along shinogi. In the middle shinogi has little belly and mirror coating doesn't fully go to shinogi and in the tip mirror coating goes over the shinogi line. So if I try to polish those scratches it will reveal wavy shinogi or I have to straighten the whole shinogi. I wouldn't like to make this expensive project knife right out of the box.

So what is your recommendations? Should I try to fix this? is there easy fix, I wouldn't like to make this project knife right out of the box and put lot of hours fixing it? Or should I return this? Or stop being so picky?

Edit: Communication with seller is very good. They apologized and offered return and full refund of repair fully with their expense. Jus wondering is it worth all the hassle, returning from EU back to Japan, costly shipping, customs etc.

 

[Heckel7302]

Looks like it has lacquer on it. I would take some acetone to that spot to make sure that what look like scratches aren't just in the lacquer.

 

[Benuser]

I would contact your local customs administration.

 

[ile74]

Looks like it has lacquer on it. I would take some acetone to that spot to make sure that what look like scratches aren't just in the lacquer.

Done that over ten times and poured almost ½ liter of acetone to it. Last picture is from thorough removal of protective coating.

 

[Heckel7302]

Done that over ten times and poured almost ½ liter of acetone to it. Last picture is from thorough removal of protective coating.

Yeah, re-read the post and realized that after I commented. I can't see the scratches by the heel in the last pic. Honestly, cosmetic stuff, whether or not it's worth it to return it is totally about how much it bothers you. That said, it's a mirror finished blade. It's going to be scratched up in no time if you use it. Mirror finished are pretty to look at, but you've got to accept that the mirror is fleeting.

 

[McMan]

Can you post a pic with the lacquer removed? The first two pics still have the lacquer (hence the rainbow). It's hard to see the scratches due to the lighting on the last pic.

 

[bsfsu]

Mirror finish is quite easy to damage in transit.

 

[jedy617]

Unfortunately I haven't gotten a mirror polish even new from a maker that didn't have plenty of scratches

 

[ile74]

Can you post a pic with the lacquer removed? The first two pics still have the lacquer (hence the rainbow). It's hard to see the scratches due to the lighting on the last pic.

Sorry about bad description. Not actually scratches but quite deep spots as seen on last picture near the Shinogi line (white spots).

 

[ptolemy]

I don't think anyone can give you advice you seek... it will depend on whether you're a perfectionist (not sure on the price you paid, but I imagine 4 figures), how much will you use it, or baby it (less than once a week actual use but more than daily stare), and in the end, what do you want...

1. can you replace it? seems unlikely
2. how much to fix to your satisfaction (will seller cover it fully)
3. partial refund (since it arrived in condition other than described) - i assume seller had actual pictures of the knife and condition is different now
4. something else to make you happy, since you dropped 4 figured on it.

 

[Mute-on]

It’s fine. Keep it.

These are items made by hand from start to finish. If the blade is well ground, straight, has no other issues, and most of the marks came off with cleaning, you would be nuts to return it. It’s probably over 95% perfect. The last 5% is not worth the time and cost it would take to access … IMHO.

 

[ile74]

It’s fine. Keep it.

These are items made by hand from start to finish. If the blade is well ground, straight, has no other issues, and most of the marks came off with cleaning, you would be nuts to return it. It’s probably over 95% perfect. The last 5% is not worth the time and cost it would take to access … IMHO.

That's what I am thinking now. My gripe is that this is not a matter of work put in finishing or handling or shipping issue but purely fail in manufacturing. Secondary gripe is that mirror finish seem to be coated and not polished so it's not so handmade, artisanal or tradiotional.

But I am considering to keep it. It won't be perfect after first use and otherwise knife is good.

 

[Lurkernomore]

That's what I am thinking now. My gripe is that this is not a matter of work put in finishing or handling or shipping issue but purely fail in manufacturing. Secondary gripe is that mirror finish seem to be coated and not polished so it's not so handmade, artisanal or tradiotional.

But I am considering to keep it. It won't be perfect after first use and otherwise knife is good.

What’s a coated mirror finish supposed to be? There’s no such thing, it’s polished on buffing wheels by hand for **** pay, the old school way.

Just use it.

 

[Steampunk]

I respect that you paid a lot for this customized knife, and wanted it to be perfect...

However, it's usual for much more major 'defects' to exist in Japanese knives at most price points (When you go to sharpen it, you will probably realize that the grind isn't perfectly level, and the wobbles were well hidden. This is the case with nearly all - even the best - single/wide bevel knives.).

Furthermore, the blade was probably protected with a sort of lacquer... Which can be annoyed, but not fully removed with Acetone/nail-polish remover. You need 'Lacquer Thinner' (Which is typically toluene based. A little bit nasty, and possibly regulated in some parts of Europe.), to strip the stuff fully. There's probably still a bit of this hanging on. Lacquer thinner typically works much more effectively at removing Japanese rust protective coatings.

Next, in terms of defects in the mirror polish, and what it would take to repair them... The knife was undoubtedly machine buffed, which is what softened the shinogi a little bit. The stray scratches were from some little bits of grit that could have been introduced at any point in time... Generally, the polish job looks like it was a little rushed, but I've definitely seen worse,. To get a better polish job, you would probably have had to pay a skilled sword polisher to step in and finish it... And then, not used it, as it's bloody difficult to keep a blade at that level of perfection during use.

You've got a really awesome knife. My advice, is to enjoy it... If you're not happy with the finish, learn how to make the finish you want, because if you use it, you're going to need to know how to replicate it anyway.

I say this with some sympathy, and honesty. I've never encountered a knife that I haven't needed to 'Tune' to perfection. At any price level I've had in my hands to date.

I hope this helps...

P.S. It definitely isn't an electroplated finish. You at least don't have to worry about this.

 

[ile74]

I respect that you paid a lot for this customized knife, and wanted it to be perfect...

However, it's usual for much more major 'defects' to exist in Japanese knives at most price points (When you go to sharpen it, you will probably realize that the grind isn't perfectly level, and the wobbles were well hidden. This is the case with nearly all - even the best - single/wide bevel knives.).

Thank you for thorough answer.

Furthermore, the blade was probably protected with a sort of lacquer... Which can be annoyed, but not fully removed with Acetone/nail-polish remover. You need 'Lacquer Thinner' (Which is typically toluene based. A little bit nasty, and possibly regulated in some parts of Europe.), to strip the stuff fully. There's probably still a bit of this hanging on. Lacquer thinner typically works much more effectively at removing Japanese rust protective coatings.

I was thinking this because surface got better and scratches smaller after repeated wiping with cotton and acetone. I was also looking for stronger thinner/lacquer remover, but that's not worth it, let the rest of the lacquer come off naturally.

Next, in terms of defects in the mirror polish, and what it would take to repair them... The knife was undoubtedly machine buffed, which is what softened the shinogi a little bit. The stray scratches were from some little bits of grit that could have been introduced at any point in time... Generally, the polish job looks like it was a little rushed, but I've definitely seen worse,. To get a better polish job, you would probably have had to pay a skilled sword polisher to step in and finish it... And then, not used it, as it's bloody difficult to keep a blade at that level of perfection during use.

P.S. It definitely isn't an electroplated finish. You at least don't have to worry about this.

Thank you for that, this answer exactly for my question and relieve worries about the polishing.

 

[SirCutAlot]

Not a helpfull response, but i also like Hamokiri knives. Do you use it for it`s original usage ? or maybe something else ?

SirCutALot

 

[ile74]

Not a helpfull response, but i also like Hamokiri knives. Do you use it for it`s original usage ? or maybe something else ?

SirCutALot

I was expecting this

No, I don't need hamokiri, but I already have some single bevels and hamokiri looks really badass knife so I had to get this . I don't expect to get fresh pike conger eel from Finland but seriously looking and trying to find substitutes for it. Fish with lot of thin bones and can be cooked skin on.