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Sujihiki Reccommendation

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beneficialapricot

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LOCATION
What country are you in?
Canada



KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chefs knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?
Sujihiki

Are you right or left handed?
Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?
Japanese

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?
270

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)
No, in fact carbon is preferred for this one

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?
450USD



KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?
Home

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)
Slicing raw meat, skinning fish. Won't cut cooked meats or anything with a crust - have a different knife I like for this.

What knife, if any, are you replacing?
None.

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)
Pinch

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)
Push/pull slice

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)
Something very sharp, won't get use too often so edge retention is not very important.

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?
Doesn't matter

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?
Honestly, I don't have a sujihiki yet so I do not know what I prefer. In Gyutos, I like mid-heavy weight knives.

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?
Ideally something that might not explode if it happened to touch a fish bone, but otherwise I'm pretty open.

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?
Won't get frequent use, so this isn't super important. I'd rather better peak sharpness.



KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
End grain wood, plastic for raw meat.

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
Yes

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)
NA

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)
NA



SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I’ve got a bit of experience with gyutos (currently have 12 in the collection) but I do not have a sujihiki. I don’t think I’d use one often, but I would like to have one in the collection.

I do have two current contenders, which perhaps people have opinions on (and of course I am open to other ideas!):

Wat Pro sujihiki 270/
Toyama SS clad blue sujihiki - Yes these blow the budget a bit, but I love my watanabe pro stuff, gyuto and nakiri. So if it's worth it, I'd do it for another wat. Plus JNS has sales every so often so I could wait and get the Toyama at closer to the budget.

Y Tanaka white 1 suji 270 - I kind of like the idea of white 1 for a suji, just to have something that can be so damn sharp, and since it would be used infrequently and on raw meat/fish I think this might be good. Also I think this one runs more like 260mm which might be great for me since I’m not a pro chef, that size may be perfect.

Also what are people’s opinions on weight in a sujihiki? I’m thinking heavier is better to let the knife weight do most of the work when slicing, but also want to be able to skin fish. This is an area I’m no expert in...
 

Qapla'

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captaincaed

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I've had wide bevel and laser, and for meat slicing, I ended up liking laser. Gesshin Ginga comes in carbon, stainless, wa and western. Hard to go wrong.

The WA handles are nicest, and they run about 10mm short. White steel is great to sharpen. Comes with a saya. Leaves you budget for a stone too.
 

captaincaed

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In stock too
 

josemartinlopez

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With that budget and preference, wouldn't you do well just getting the sujihiki version of your favorite gyuto? If you prefer middleweight gyutos, you'd prefer lighter sujis.
 

vlasena

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I am in a similar position as the author of the thread. I want something practical and something that I would not want to replace soon. I have Watanabe santoku for about 3 years now and like it a lot, so was thinking of Wat suji, but the prices are quite steep for this type of blades now, so was not sure if it is worth investment or not..
 

vlasena

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My favourite guyoto ended up being Kono HD2, which is not as sharp as Watanabe, but in practical terms is a good balance of being nimble, rust resistance, not so chippy and easy to sharpen.
 

vlasena

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I tried not so many of gyutos, but I had Laser in White2 from Sakai, which I need to sharpen almost daily, I had Tanaka in ginsan, which is amazing knife, but did not have a tapper, so was not so good for delicate work and was a bit heavier, now HD2 is a perfect compromise of all of these - it is sharp, easy to handle and not so heavy to operate. Santoku I actually do not use, it is awesome, but 240 gyutos are so much more practical.
 

LikenessMonster

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I ended up with the Masakage Koishi and couldn't be happier
 

vlasena

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I ended up with the Masakage Koishi and couldn't be happier
it looks amazing, what is the difference with Wat? I mean it has a different steel, but from practical angle Blue Super and Blue2 should not be that different? Koishi is even hardened to a lesser degree, so less chippy steel based on the numbers..
 

LikenessMonster

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it looks amazing, what is the difference with Wat? I mean it has a different steel, but from practical angle Blue Super and Blue2 should not be that different? Koishi is even hardened to a lesser degree, so less chippy steel based on the numbers..
Not sure what the difference is between the Wat, other than you can't go wrong either way. I bought a wat Nakiri and absolutely love it. Without looking at the specs, I would imagine the Masakage is slightly more of a laser
 

Chopper88

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Almost everything is different; steel/finish/blade profile/handle material.
Also not sure on the dimensions for that Masakage, says 18mm blade height for the 270mm and 22 for the 300mm, not sure how to interpret this.
It also doesn't state a weight and proper dimensions, so you'll have to ask or guess to know the amount of flex.

This is meant as genuine advice, don't just jump into something without really knowing what you want.
 

LikenessMonster

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it looks amazing, what is the difference with Wat? I mean it has a different steel, but from practical angle Blue Super and Blue2 should not be that different? Koishi is even hardened to a lesser degree, so less chippy steel based on the numbers..
Here are some better pictures of the Masakage, even one next to the Watanabe Nakiri. Online photos do no justice of how pretty she really is
 

vlasena

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Almost everything is different; steel/finish/blade profile/handle material.
I totally get it, that they look different from outside and from the specs. See video on specs of Koishi below. But from practical use, how they will be different anyone knows?
 

applepieforbreakfast

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Almost everything is different; steel/finish/blade profile/handle material.
Also not sure on the dimensions for that Masakage, says 18mm blade height for the 270mm and 22 for the 300mm, not sure how to interpret this.
It also doesn't state a weight and proper dimensions, so you'll have to ask or guess to know the amount of flex.

This is meant as genuine advice, don't just jump into something without really knowing what you want.
That 18mm and 22mm blade height is definitely a typo.
 

Chopper88

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That 18mm and 22mm blade height is definitely a typo.
Yeah, I think the first 18mm Suji is still to be created hehe.
But I just meant to point out there are so many unknowns based on the info that page provides.

I totally get it, that they look different from outside and from the specs. See video on specs of Koishi below. But from practical use, how they will be different anyone knows?
That depends on the exact specs of the Watanabe, and is pretty hard to say. I have never owned either, but the Watanabe will most likely be heavier and have less flex. Also a kurouchi finish will probably have a bit more drag, but I don't think that will effect it's behaviour that much.

The rest really depends on the actual height, weight, taper and grind etc. of both.
 
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LikenessMonster

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Yeah, I think the first 18mm Suji is still to be created hehe.
But I just meant to point out there are so many unknowns based on the info that page provides.
Selling point for me was 1) it's AS 2) hammered which "should" have better food release.
 

Twigg

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I have a Isasmedjan 270 Suji that I am very happy with. It fits in your budget and seems to align with the request. I bought it just to have on hand for occasional use. I doubt I will ever get rid of it. Slices well with raw and cooked proteins and is fits my needs. Plus, it has Viking kanji and looks great in person. It is currently out of stock, but you can send Anthony at knifeline an email to work it out. Also, Jonas is listed on the forum under the vendor section. He is wonderful to deal with.

 

daveb

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Selling point for me was 1) it's AS 2) hammered which "should" have better food release.
Food release will not be a significant factor for a suji. (1) The knife will be used almost exclusively for draw cuts, (2) the (well made) knife is not tall enough for drag to be a differentiator.

The most overlooked factor is the relationship between weight and stiffness. For your application a lighter suji would work fine but not if it's a flexi. And if you ever want to grow the knife's duties into more substantial product then weight will be your friend.
 

M1k3

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Yoshikane and Heiji direct are pretty good options that won't break the bank.
 

syinx

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Wakui have always been a no-brainer price-for-performance decision for me. I own the 270 and it's by far my favourite suji. Low maintenance stainless clad white, and gorgeous balance.
 

zizirex

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Sorry to bring this one up? Does anyone have exp with normal convex grind suji and wide bevel suji? which one is better? or it doesn't really matter in Suji because it's pretty short? I'm looking at Hinoura 270 Suji and Wakui Suji. Or I should go with a laser (Ginga or any other copy of it) type suji.
 

QCDawg

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Sorry to bring this one up? Does anyone have exp with normal convex grind suji and wide bevel suji? which one is better? or it doesn't really matter in Suji because it's pretty short? I'm looking at Hinoura 270 Suji and Wakui Suji. Or I should go with a laser (Ginga or any other copy of it) type suji.
Good question. Guess it depends on what you’re cutting. Hinoura and Heiji are definitely going to push the product away from the original cut. Sometimes that’s great. The wakui is going to be thin....slide right through the cut. You will need to use a finger to slide the “slice” over.. and keep on rolling.. wakui can’t be beat for the money tho..
 

zizirex

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Good question. Guess it depends on what you’re cutting. Hinoura and Heiji are definitely going to push the product away from the original cut. Sometimes that’s great. The wakui is going to be thin....slide right through the cut. You will need to use a finger to slide the “slice” over.. and keep on rolling.. wakui can’t be beat for the money tho..
Ok, Because I already have Anryu Suji, I want another one that is different. I will be using it for cutting and portion beef, removing silver skin on some meat. I will be cutting my homemade Deli meat as well.
 

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Ok, Because I already have Anryu Suji, I want another one that is different. I will be using it for cutting and portion beef, removing silver skin on some meat. I will be cutting my homemade Deli meat as well.
An Ashi might work well for you. Something with less height. Or a Vic Fibrox slicer
 

QCDawg

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Ok, Because I already have Anryu Suji, I want another one that is different. I will be using it for cutting and portion beef, removing silver skin on some meat. I will be cutting my homemade Deli meat as well.
I 2nd an Ashi 240 suji. 270 is kinda long for prep.
 

GorillaGrunt

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Depends on if you’re using it only for slicing meat or for general prep. Referring to the questionnaire I’d say a thicker spine, wide bevel, longer blade, stiffer, narrower height. The Tou sakimaru I say is the best of the best for slicing protein ... but if I need to do any other task I have to put that down and pick up something else. For you I might second Hinoura AS or Heiji, also Mazaki because always Mazaki.
 
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