Sukenari zdp189 210mm demascus gyuto

[gman]

I think I want this knife, but i have some quick questions. Yes, I already the previous threads on this maker and steel, but they are old and I wonder what people think lately.

tl;dr context below

1) What else should I be considering with a similar profile?

2) What's up with the supply/price? Seems sold out in a lot of places, and priced pretty steeply at places that do have it available.

3) K-tip or standard?

Context -

I'm 5+ years into my j-knife adventures. I started with a 240mm Koishi gyuto, and after a year or so of using it almost exclusively went down the rabbit hole of single purpose blades. I now have kitchen knives ranging from 75mm to 300mm, in AS, W#2, R2, and most recently AUS10.

I have a survival knife in 440A that is so terrible to sharpen it really turned me off stainless, but lately I've dipped my toe back in, and am having better results with harder modern stainless variants, so I'm ready to give a really serious stainless like zdp189 a try. Lots of practice sharpening AS probably hasn't hurt.

I'm also ready to return to a general purpose profile. Think one really sweet looking knife that I can use for full meal prep when I have guests, instead of pulling out 5 different knives and looking like a weirdo. To this end, I'm looking for something with a mid-weight spine but low and thin tip. I like a very gentle belly, but don't necessarily need or want a flat spot (my cutting technique has improved along with my sharpening).

thanks!

 

[Barclid]

I have one. I thinned it and now I like it. I don't think there are really many comparable options if you're set on that steel. As for why it's out of stock all the time; they produce each set in batches at request from vendors and the lead time is currently something like 12 to 18 months. Their production is cyclical and they're not always making them.

As for k tip versus standard, choose whatever you want. K tip will have a more defined point for detail work and will be more fragile/tipping prone.

 

[LucasFur]

I got a 240 in February 2014 ,and its one of the blades ive kept around. the steel does take a long time to work, but it is totally able to be shaving sharp. One reason i dont use it as much as others, is that i dont know how to bring back that particular damascus pattern if i were to thin it. Not that it needs it, the hardness of the steel makes it feel very "solid" (honyaki-esque)

As for K-tip ... i had a 240 k-tip hap40. which i found very very wear resistant, and didnt love it. Admittedly as soon as i got it, i sharpened to shave my face to prove to everybody (on my instagram) that all our chef knives can get "sharp" --- but for the K-tip --- the standard is just more usable and versatile with better re-sale value.

I also own YXR-7 and owned Ginsan sukenari's ... all were great knives with a nice balanced mass that isnt lazer, but something you could use for hours. ALSO, i have come across (OLD zdp) versions that are thick, and have bad performance. the ones ive owned ranged from 2014-2018 and they were all great knives. up to the recent price increase for all the custom stuff, I would say they were the leaders in exotic steels and were Great bargans.

Also! -- i know ZDP price sky rocketed after Miyabi bought everything stocked and and years of future supply for their "black damascus" ZDP line.


(I know it was Feb 2014 because it was during February masakage sale at knifewear, and i walked in for a Kujira and saw the suk zdp)

 

[gman]

great info so far, guys. appreciate it.

normally i might shy away from demascus, but one of the things i'm considering is that if the knife doesn't need to be sharpened as often, it also wont need to be thinned as often, so repolishing/etching wont be as big a concern, unlike say a white honyaki, where i could see myself having to polish the thing constantly.

 

[James]

Sukenari has a zdp line without damascus fwiw

 

[GorillaGrunt]

I’ve got the non-Damascus one, it’s pretty useful. I had an Akebono 240 ktip and a Tilman 270 with a curve instead of an angle, but the edge profile that a k-tip would have; when the Tilman got shortened I realized that I didn’t like a long k-tip but do like the 210 k-tip over a normal 210 for a lot of stuff. That said, if you bust the tip off a k-tip it’ll take a lot longer to fix than a regular gyuto, although the face/spine of the angled part of some of the higher end k-tips I’ve seen are beveled perhaps for that reason (if that’s nor the reason, it’s a nice bonus!).

Re the grind, it’s no laser, but it’s robust enough for me not to have to worry about what I’m using it for while still being thin enough to do things nicely. It’s very general purpose and the 210 k tip is nice in a tight space. I don’t know if they grind the higher priced Damascus ones thinner or the same.

Re the steel, I don’t find it chippy or fragile, and it does have better edge retention than most. Certain stones are better for this steel than others; some stones are just a no-go. I had this blade in HAP40 and YXR7 as well and preferred the ZDP — but as I get better at sharpening I’m not sure that I wasn’t just doing a bad job sharpening the others.

 

[never mind]

Jck has a house brand zdp-189 made by sukenari, including k-tip and standard, etc. it’s Fu-Rin-Ka-Zan. Good price if you want to check it out:


https://japanesechefsknife.com/collections/zdp-189-powdered-high-speed-tool-steel


ZDP-189 from Hitachi was created to compete with Cowry X.


For your info, Jck also had 13 hattori blades made by cowry-x steel (a lot of folks in the forum used to be all over hattori cowry-x blades, including a professional sharpener here), which has similar composition to zdp189:



https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll...oku-170mm-6-6-inch-black-linen-micarta-handle

 

[gman]

thanks, i'll check those out!