the term "stain free high carbon steel" and kitchen knives often lack proper descriptions

[diamond dogs]

And the lack knife knoladge in the general chef / kitchen community.

Ok this is a bit of a rant, I admit it. looking for a cheap but decent high carbon kitchen knife to teach sharpening with (started another thread about it, thanks for the good suggestions).

in my search I have become extremely frustrated with the term "stain free high carbon" or "high carbon stainless" as it floods my searches with cheap stainless crap. well I found that ebay actually has a blade steel search catagory (even though its only carbon steel and stainless steel) clicked on this filter excited to finally find what i was looking for, only to find out countless sellers of, you guessed it, "stain free carbon steel" knives are listing them as carbon steel.

this brings up something thats bothered me for a while. lets put it bluntly, allot of chefs and home cooks dont know anything about knives, present company excluded ofcourse. is this reflected in the fact that very few large kitchen knife manufacturesrs will even tell you what kind of "stain free high carbon steel" their knives are made of?

contrast this with the outdoor and folding knife markets, where you almost always get the actual steel in the knife description, possibly even an hrc number, and they dont seem to go around calling some .50% carbon 15% chromium steel "high carbon stainless".

I do remember when this trend and term started, i think. i believe, it was in the 80's or early 90's. the first time i heard it was in referance to ats-34, i think because they wanted to put it apart from other stainless steels we were used to at the time. then at some point it worked its way into kitchen knife descriptions and has stayed ever since, and now is totally meaningless.

Yes i know, alot more chefs and home cooks are becoming knoladgable about knives and sharpening, and thats great. and there are alot more choices for quality kitchen knives and stones than there used to be, and the vague descriptions are almost totally absent from high end knives and japanese knives. but i still see alot of ignorance in a community that should be all about the knife knoladge imo, and a frustrating lack of not only accurate descriptions from mainstreem manufacturers but their seeming lack of intrest in trying new steels and heat treatments.

 

[WildBoar]

In the US, mainstream manufacturers primarily sell to home user who do know about -- or care to know about -- sharpening with stones. Nor do they want to deal with a knife that is not stainless steel, or knives that chip easily. Lower HRC is great for these people, who are the vast majority of knife buyers/ users, and where the manufacturers make all of their money. I suspect it is like this in many other countries as well.

 

[HRC_64]

Several explanations at play here

1) TMI - too much information (wedding gifts, etc)
2) People don't really care (survivabiliy>sharpenability)
3) Trade secrets (even high end vendors)

I think its "all of the above",
but much has to do with the context
of who is buying/selling.

 

[faverodefavero]

Generally it’s cheap X Cro Mov steel with 0,3~0,6 Carbon, about 52~57HRC, very springy and malleable blades thick behind the edge, laser cut and badly finished.

 

[faverodefavero]

Oh, I forgot: and ridiculous about of fat fat free Chromium and Chromium carabides (which are basically the worst carabides you want on an actual cutting tool).

 

[bahamaroot]

The general public doesn't know or care about carbon content or Chromium carbides. All they care about is can they put it in the dishwasher. This is who all these cookie cutter factory made knives are marketed too. Having "Dishwasher Safe" on the package will sell more knives than the type of steel and HRC values.

 

[diamond dogs]

im definatly aware that most people dont care at all about what their knife is made of as long as it dosent rust and they can throw it in the dishwasher. its rare to even find someone who actually sharpens their knives in any way shape or form, even with some gimmic sharpener.

i suppose it makes sense that kitchen knives are marketed this way, because everyone owns kitchen knives and they are probably by far the most common type of knife sold, so they are marketed to the most avarage consumer.

my comparison with outdoor knives and folding knives i guess isnt really accurate because those are probably allot less commonly sold and people that buy them are perhaps a bit more discerning, or atleast slightly kore than the avarage person.

i just wish they hadnt come up with the term high carbon stainless.

 

[Walla]

I've had exactly the same experience...I simply gave up...even tried Boolean search using the - operator...did help a bit...

Take care

Jeff

 

[Keith Sinclair]

It's kind of like all the words on food packaging. No GMO, All natural, etc. etc. You have to read the ingredients. Totally processed food with all kinds of misleading language.

No one is going to check steel content. Agree high carbon is used very loosely to make some junk knives sound good.