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Jovidah

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I couldn't care less about being slightly harder to thin; I just prefer the cuttting feedback monosteels give versus clad knives. They just feel better to me.
 

ian

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To make up for the lack of controversy in my last statement:

Am I the only one who thinks flat-earthers have a point? The earth is flat for the vast majority of people. After all, spacetime is curved, but physicists pretend that 'local flatness' is a legitimate concept. In that sense, the earth is 'locally flat' for most people who aren't flying commercial planes or working with satellites.

Physicists, a.k.a. 'flat-spacers' are hypocrites.

Love it. Although isn’t “the earth is locally flat” a pretty popular opinion, disputed only by mountain climbers like @valgard?
 

timebard

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Honestly I’m beginning to think it’s more with the specific iron cladding. My wat and mazaki irons reacted so fast they went orange on their first onion cuts before moving to blue. The mazaki settled down and I would say it’s not much different then caring for the white#2 steel which still feels a bit more reactive than regular mono steels.

On the other hand I’ve got an iron clad catchie where the core is reacting faster than the cladding. Have another on route so we’ll see if that situation repeats but it’s been weird to see it happen so far.

Stainless cladding on carbon just feels so soulless to me, nothing against monostainless or stainless clad stainless though. Just seems weird to mix it

Agree re iron cladding. I tried a couple Mazaki and Munetoshi knives in the past, they reacted like crazy and I said "iron cladding sucks, I'm done." Messed around with monosteels only for a bit. But after a while I got the itch to try a Y Tanaka and a couple others and dipped my toe back in, only to find that knives like my Kono MM are a lot calmer. Now like 4 of the last 5 knives I've picked up are ironclad. So far, all good!
 

esoo

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Until you have a blade with hard stainless cladding (60-61HRC) and a Rex121 core (67ish HRC). That one will make you hate sharpening and forget about thinning.

Yeah, but it's REX121. Will you ever really need to thin it?

I know, you will eventually. Send it out to someone with right wet belt sanding setup
 

jjlotti

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Honestly I’m beginning to think it’s more with the specific iron cladding. My wat and mazaki irons reacted so fast they went orange on their first onion cuts before moving to blue. The mazaki settled down and I would say it’s not much different then caring for the white#2 steel which still feels a bit more reactive than regular mono steels.

On the other hand I’ve got an iron clad catchie where the core is reacting faster than the cladding. Have another on route so we’ll see if that situation repeats but it’s been weird to see it happen so far.

Stainless cladding on carbon just feels so soulless to me, nothing against monostainless or stainless clad stainless though. Just seems weird to mix it
"She is nothing but a soulesss one wandering
Waiting for a soul to fill her"
20220512_201120.jpg
 

blokey

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Looking forward to your video of you removing silverskin with a Nakiri 😎
Just get the right nakiri!
 

jjlotti

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Just get the right nakiri!
And a angle grinder...
 

spaceconvoy

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lord forbid a massdrop knife not conform to the most average forum preferences... another 225-250 carbon gyuto with distal taper and a wa handle, shocking! 😮
 

Feiii

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Extreme beauty! Does it perform as well as it looks? What is the height on it?
 

Tea_Hills

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All new sharpeners should start with a jig.

The kitchen knife world needs a Spyderco type maker with fairly standard products, decent fit and finish, and a slew of different knife steels instead of many makers all using the same tried and true 5 - 10 knife steels.
 

Jovidah

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I think a jig is a horrible idea for 'new sharpeners'. It's a significant investment that creates a far higher bar to entry, and would be a waste for the many who will eventually conclude that it's 'not for them'. Then there's the long list of issues related to jigs.

I really don't see the point in having the same knife in 10 different flavors either; in the end the knife steel isn't all that superduper important for performance, especially for 'the masses'.
What makes more sense is a knife that ticks all the actually useful boxes, like proper grind, good geometry, and if possible quality of life stuff like rounded spine and choil, at a pricepoint acceptable to normal people. Ideally in Europe...
 

Naftoor

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I’m not sure I would say a jig, but a set of angle blocks is an excellent thing for new people.

I learned freehand by approximating angles, and using one of those heavy digital angle cubes (don’t recommend) and my edges have always been more then serviceable. Push cut, shaving all good.

Recently I picked up a set of angle blocks intended to stick near the stone to use as a reference during sharpening, and for 20 bucks they’ve definitely upped my sharpening game since it helps me learn the muscle memory for an exact angle. The knives do the same stuff, but the edges feel a little better at the above tests now.

I also focused more on learning to deburr at the same time so maybe that’s the real cause though 🙃
 

Tea_Hills

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I mean like a 30 dollar jig. Sharpening is 2 main components rifht
I think a jig is a horrible idea for 'new sharpeners'. It's a significant investment that creates a far higher bar to entry, and would be a waste for the many who will eventually conclude that it's 'not for them'. Then there's the long list of issues related to jigs.

I really don't see the point in having the same knife in 10 different flavors either; in the end the knife steel isn't all that superduper important for performance, especially for 'the masses'.
What makes more sense is a knife that ticks all the actually useful boxes, like proper grind, good geometry, and if possible quality of life stuff like rounded spine and choil, at a pricepoint acceptable to normal people. Ideally in Europe...
Nah I'm talking about a 30 dollar jig like a hapstone t1 not a whole system. It allows a newbie to focus on pressure and procedure rather than holding an angle perfectly. It also is a great way to get a visual feel for what say 15 degrees looks like. There is never the question "Did I wobble like hell or did I deburr incorrectly". And chances are a new sharper will be able to get shave sharp on their first try and avoid some discouragement. King 1000 and cheap jig and you got yourself a sharper knife than you will ever need in the kitchen. Once you have the knowledge of what process to follow to sharpen then you can build your skill if you want to.

And sure there are a lot of other things that go into a great knife but I feel that steel choice is still fairly underrepresented in knives under 500 dollars when compared to ginds, finish, geometry. Would be nice to have more steels more accessible.
 

pleue

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I think every new sharpener should get a chosera 400 or a shapton glass 500 or something along those lines and learn bevel setting, pressure, and getting a good sharp knife from a coarse stone before getting lost in polishing a bad edge or relying on a jig and getting a super wonky tip because of it.
 

Jovidah

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You can just fold a piece of paper to get a 15 degree angle... just use that to sort of get a feel for the angle and boom you're done.
I don't think angle guides are all that helpful though. The angle guides are problematic on any knives that actually have any curve to them (they won't give the same angle at every spot of the knife).
People also really shouldn't be focusing on getting exactly X degrees... it's putting emphasis on the wrong aspect IMO.

As to steels... it's again putting emphasis on the least relevant aspect IMO. Different steel won't make a knife cut any different. Part of the reason you see a limited amount of steels is that 'the market' (including us) chooses to focus on a limited amount of makers from a very limited geographic origin.
And on top of that most people insist on limiting themselves to these few 'known' steels. It's a bit of a chicken & egg problem.
 

MowgFace

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Of those that are very picky about knife weights +/- 10 or 15g, I wonder how many have seen how much variance exists in the thickness/length of the blade tangs hidden inside of their WA handles.

I have noticed many knives that are obvious western conversions. VERY short inconsistent tangs, with the rivet holes still present.

Just rehandled a Gesshin Ginga and that bad boy had a tang that was close to 75% of the entire handle length. TWICE as long as the knives that were western tang conversions.
 
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