What type of steel and grit edge do you like in a sujihiki for slicing roasts?

[dafox]

So far my favorites have been AUS8 and aogami super with a Shapton pro 1k (800) grit edge.

 

[Benuser]

I wouldn't advocate the use of a coarse finish on a carbon steel to have it keep its bite, like a micro-saw. Edge retention will suffer, and frequent touching up with a relatively coarse stone will waste material. Better look for a coarsely grained steel that keeps its bite, refined or not. My experience with the SK-3 used with the Fujiwara FKH series.
For the stainless or almost stainless, 440C and SLD are solid options. 19C27 as well, but found sharpening it frankly unpleasant. To me it's an important factor.

 

[daveb]

I'm a little suji stupid, even by local standards. I like em.

My 10/10 suji is made of Zwear from HSC. I liked the steel when used in a gyuto and thought it would be perfect for a suji. A little tough to sharpen but holds an edge forever. Harbeer took my height, length and weight requirements and turned out a great knife.

My 9/10 include a Kintaroame from Wat, a blue steel (now gone) from Wat and an unknown carbon Heiji (freshly stolen). I had a Toyama that was for all practical purposes identical to the carbon Wat but someone wanted it more than I did and the resultant sale paid for the HSC. The 9/10 share a good grind, thin behind the edge growing to a robust spine. And a substantial weight, these were all in the 190g + neighborhood. The weight translates into a pretty stiff blade, yet another important characteristic.

A Devin ITK and Gengetsu share the 8/10 spot. A little shorter, a little lighter, both of these are 165g+ (IIRC). Neither are flexi, they just don't have as much ass to them as the others, something I prefer for slicing big stuff into little stuff. They excel at portioning fish, cutting rolls, and sllicing smaller cuts. The Devin and Gengetsu rotate in my home block.

I've had several other suji, including Suisin and Kono lasers and have used a few more. For me 165g is the minimum weight I want to use, both for the heft and the stiffness. The lasers can't stay.

I don't finish any knives on a low grit stone, except of course other peoples shi!t on a stick knives. I'll usually finish a suji on a G4K or G6K, and if I'm feeling sporty I might even get out a nat or two.

Discussed this on here with Panda awhile ago - IIRC he preferred the more laser-ish suji for cooked protien and favored heavier with raw protiens. My preference is the opposite, a little thinner for the raw and can't be too heavy for the cooked protiens.

I suggest to newcomers to use weight as their first threshold attribute. If a knife is not 165g+ then look for one that is. Then look for grind, the spine should have some ass to it, the edge can't be to thin. Don't recall height numbers but I don't want a "tall" suji or last weeks gyutohiki fad.

 

[panda]

i only take suji to 1k cause i want big teeth, meat has big grains, dont want tiny grains going through it, it just feels strange to me with polished edges.

really it's all upto preference as you can see they vary quite a bit from person to person.

@daveb someone stole your heiji!!???? the carbon is known, it's iwasaki steel. i miss having a thicker heavy suji. my honyaki one is freaking badass, but it's just so damn light and thin. my ideal suji would be a mid sized, lol. like a shig kasumi, but those are rare as funk.

 

[Chopper88]

@daveb that is an awesome write up!

I don't mean to hijack the thread, feel free to move this, or let me know if you want me to open a new thread, but this topic and your response relate perfectly to what I am searching for.

I own an Ashi Ginga, and think it's an awesome knife for raw proteins, but would like a stiffer heavier suji for larger cooked proteins like a ham.
I think ideal would be the Wat 270, but it's over my budget at €400 before shipping and tax.
Do you know of any carbon 270mm options in the same weight class around $ 350/€ 300?

 

[daveb]

@daveb someone stole your heiji!!???? the carbon is known, it's iwasaki steel. i miss having a thicker heavy suji. my honyaki one is freaking badass, but it's just so damn light and thin. my ideal suji would be a mid sized, lol. like a shig kasumi, but those are rare as funk.

I remember that now about the steel, Iwasaki. Liked it a lot. I left my bag in my office one night and some phuckstick took the suji. They left a Tillman Leder gyuto in the next pocket over - guess it didn't look fancy enough. Had a Shig kasumi suji for awhile - did like it - about the only Shig I can say that about.

@Chopper88 Nothing comes immediately to mind. You might try contacting Heiji directly and see how bad they would hurt you for a carbon. Or reach a little deeper for the Wat. Or hang by the BST forum and see what comes up. One of the things about a suji is that good ones are not cheap but even the best don't hold their value as well as they should and some good deals can be found on the secondary market.

 

[spaceconvoy]

Some people don't like Mazaki (only cause they're unlucky ), but if you can kind a good one that's straight with no overgrinds, it's a nice stiff suji and over 200g.

 

[fimbulvetr]

After my Toyama 270 suji, my Hinoura Shirogami 285 from cleanut.eu has been awesome, affordable, and all the rest of my crews’ favorite. We cut mostly raw meat. I sharpen it on a Shapton Pro 1k with the occasional secret trip home to be stropped on a red aoto.

 

[Kippington]

You actually get more sauce sticking to the carved meat if the cut isn't smooth. Terrible for presentation though...

 

[Chopper88]

I remember that now about the steel, Iwasaki. Liked it a lot. I left my bag in my office one night and some phuckstick took the suji. They left a Tillman Leder gyuto in the next pocket over - guess it didn't look fancy enough. Had a Shig kasumi suji for awhile - did like it - about the only Shig I can say that about.

@Chopper88 Nothing comes immediately to mind. You might try contacting Heiji directly and see how bad they would hurt you for a carbon. Or reach a little deeper for the Wat. Or hang by the BST forum and see what comes up. One of the things about a suji is that good ones are not cheap but even the best don't hold their value as well as they should and some good deals can be found on the secondary market.

Yeah I noticed the second hand value, noticed one 300mm Wat that sold (albeit 3 years ago though...) on another forum for $350. A new one is listed on Watanabe's website for +- $ 588 now

Also forgot to say earlier; sucks that your Heiji got stolen! I remember another job I had where stuff went missing (not from me fortunately), I can't even imagine taking something from someone at my workplace, and then looking them in the eye the next time...

Some people don't like Mazaki (only cause they're unlucky ), but if you can kind a good one that's straight with no overgrinds, it's a nice stiff suji and over 200g.

I don't consider a Mazaki suji as they are way too high at the heel for my liking.
The ones previously listed on JNS are:

Blade Height at Heel- 43mm
Blade Height at Heel- 49mm

My Ginga is +- 35mm.