Which Takamura R2 as first knife or other laser?

[Ricedeath]

Hi everyone, I am looking for some advice on getting my "first" knife. Since I live with my parents it will be something that will be put away when not used by me and as such will be treated with a lot of care. So just looking for some cutting fun on the special occasion. That "wow" effect when seeing how sharpening/honing that knife has paid off.

LOCATION
Germany

KNIFE TYPE
Gyuto, Nakiri/Usuba or Santoku
Handle
Preferably Japanese for the look, open to western handles
Length
Still unsure, only ever used paring knives my whole live 160-210mm?
Stainless or Carbon?
Either is fine
Max Budget
150€ Takamura as Baseline, would pay about 80€-100€ extra for (beautiful) wa handle over western (more would be possible, but for now just a soft limit to keep myself from spending too much)

KNIFE USE
Main Use
Home cook, 95% vegtables and fruit. Onions, carrots, cucumbers, Apples etc.
What knife, if any, are you replacing?
115mm Gyuto / Utility Knife
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use?
Hammer grip, open to learn pinch grip
What cutting motions do you primarily use?
Push Cut, Chop still learning how to properly cut still
What improvements do you want from your current knife?
I want a knife with a laser geometry and also try out a bigger sized knife, it should melt through food even better than my current knife

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
Cherry End Grain, considering rubber
Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
Yes

Optional but nice to have:

• Wa handle with bolster NOT made of plastic
• Decent Edge Retention

Knifes considered so far

• Takamura R2 180mm Gyuto 150€
• Takamura R2 210mm Gyuto 190€ (Out of stock..)
• Takamura R2 Santoku 140€

And then a lot of manufacturers have been thrown my direction: Akifusa, Ashi Hamono, Kei Kobayashi, Gihei
Now those all seem to be just a little bit over what I would like to spend, so it would take a lot of justification to get those over the Takamura.
So far I have only found the handle issue, though the western handle would better fit my momentary grip style and F&F wise I think a Takamura would be adequate given my current (non existing) skill level. Though since I will be treating myself to a knife, a little something special would not be bad either I guess?

Now to my problem Takamura Santoku vs Gyuto?
I mean yes, with proper technique you will be able to Julienne with either Santoku and Gyuto, and in this size category (180mm vs 170mm) with a height difference of 4mm at the heel it probably isnt even going to make a difference apart from the looks. But I mean if I know I will be cutting 95% vegtables, even though it will be my first Knife would it still not be better be to take the "one trick pony" dedicated for that type of task (cutting vegtables) over the allrounder (Gyuto?). Though for example with onions I would feel more comfortable with the nimble tip of the Gyuto.

This then results in the following questions

1. Should I consider getting a Nakiri/Usuba instead?
2. Should I wait for the 210mm Gyuto to come back in stock, because it is more versatile?
3. Out of the two options does it matter Takamura 180 Gyuto or Santoku?

To clarify, this will be my fun knife, to be used for special occasions. That means if I do feel the need for a more specialized knife exclusivley for cutting vegtables lets say I can still get that one later as well. Same goes for an actual workhorse knife that can be handled less delicately. So with that in mind what kind of knife would bring me the most fun/entertainment through satisfying/sharp cutting feel? Which is why subjectively I would also feel like the 180mm Gyuto would be better suited to me, since I would feel more in control due to its smaller size, resulting in a more controlled feeling and thus more satisfying experience? (I have been cutting everything with Herder paring knives..)

With the statement above I subjectively answered some of the questions myself:

1. Can still get more specialized knives later if I feel those are necessary
2. Since main argument is versatility, same as above can stilll get a bigger knife if I feel that is necessary as home cook. Workhorse would also fit the versatility theme better than laser?
3. Managed to accordion vegtables even with our Santoku at home, so probably wrong technique than wrong knife here.. So go with the aesthetically more pleasing one?

What do you guys think? Should I just get the Takamura for now and see if this is something for me or should I pay the extra upfront and get a knife checking every point off my wishlist? I think since I am relatively new and taste develops over time, going with the Takamura first and going more expensive later would be smarter? Then again with my woodworking tools I learned, going for the option that suits your needs 100% off the bat saves money in the end, because you will not buy the 100€ tool first and then end up with the 300€ anyway.

 

[myguidingmoonlight]

If you want something that is as thin as the Takamura but stainless and has a wa handle, then look at the Ashi Ginga 210 Stainless Gyuto.

It's a bit more expensive, but I think it's a nice option since you said you'd pay more for a knife like the Takamura but with a wa handle.

 

[blokey]

Second for Ashi, can't go wrong with it and they always come with a nice saya.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2346985140...eemlijrru2&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[Cliff]

I love Ashi. Edge retention will be better with Takamura. Size really is a matter of personal preference. I'd rather have the 210, but I tend to like bigger knives.

 

[Ricedeath]

Thanks for all the answers! Unfortunately after midnight in Germany already, so will be back tomorrow.

Short question, is that an asymmetrical grind on the Ginga or am I just imagining things? I am good to go with symmetrical grinds, since I count my strokes on each side when sharping, but no idea how I would fare on an asymmetrical grind.

 

[Cliff]

Ginga is pretty close to symmetrical if not 50/50. It really doesn't take too much to get the hang of sharpening asymmetrical blades. You just follow the grinds as they exist. I wouldn't let that be the deciding factor.

 

[OnionSlicer]

I picked up a takamura 180 here on BST earlier this year with no expectations, just to try out something new, and somehow it's become one of my favorite knives. It's a perfect knife for most home recipes, very nifty and just enough blade. A western handle is actually better for a knife this size imo, I pinch mine around the bolster. My other most used gyuto is a 270mm workhorse that I bring out for big preps. Everything in between has become sort of a dead zone.

Versus santoku: I've had multiple santokus from respected brands over the years, and never really warmed up to any of them. The gyuto shape is just the best, for veggies and everything else.

Versus ginga 210: another great knife, and sometimes I wish I'd still kept mine; however the relatively soft aeb-l steel loses toothiness rather quickly when used for a lot of board work. The takamura stays hella toothy.

I can't speak to ease of sharpening, as mine is still going strong with initial edge after a lot of use. One swipe per side on a fine ceramic rod refreshes the edge well. Excellent edge retention.

 

[JASinIL2006]

If this is your first J-knife and you're looking for an all-arounder, I'd probably stay away from a nakiri and I certainly wouldn't consider a ususba. Nothing wrong with santokus, but personally I find myself reaching for a santoku less and less, in favor of a gyuto, which seems much more useful and suitable for a variety of cutting tasks. For me, 180/190 mm knives feel kind of small. I'd probably wait for a 210, rather than rushing into a 190 just because it's available. For larger ingredients, anything less than 210 feels like a challenge.

I don't have an Ashi Ginga, but I've come pretty close to pulling the trigger on one, based on the positive reviews from users here and elsewhere, and their really beautiful looks.

 

[esoo]

If you are looking at Takamura, the Chromax line is also very good. Not quite as stainless as R2, but will be easier to sharpen.

Usubas are pure vegetable knives meant for certain techniques. Unless you need it for those techniques, likely a waste.

Nakiri are general purpose vegetable knives, meant for taking big pieces and making small pieces. If you're cubing up boneless portions of meat, a nakiri could fit the purpose as well. The lack of tip may be a drawback as well.

In a short knife (180mm), your technique will really make a deciding factor if you like the particular blade or not. Being so short, there is more compromise in how much curve/flat there is in the blade so one 180 may suit a rock chopper while another will suit a push cutter. Santoku will tend to have a lower tip, which leads to a flatter blade, but I seen quite a bit of variety in that.

 

[esoo]

There is always the old standard - the HD2
https://www.japaneseknives.eu/a-626...ctagonal-honoki-210-mm-with-saya/#description
Very similar to the Ashi, but a semi-stainless. It does patina, but very slowly and essentially rust-resitant.

 

[myguidingmoonlight]

There is always the old standard - the HD2
https://www.japaneseknives.eu/a-626...ctagonal-honoki-210-mm-with-saya/#description
Very similar to the Ashi, but a semi-stainless. It does patina, but very slowly and essentially rust-resitant.

I really like the HD2, I think it fits the title of laser workhorse nicely, thin but robust. I would wait for a nice sale on these though, pricey.

 

[Ricedeath]

Thanks for all the kind suggestions. The Konosuke sounds good, as mentioned a little pricey still. With the Ashi, I think I would pick the Konosuke over the Ashi, also because the Ashi would have to be imported to Germany unfortunately.

Today I went and checked some Knife sizes and I have to say for now I feel more comfortable with the 180mm Knives, also given that our kitchen space is a little limited. So I see myself more often reaching to the small chopping board and Santoku we currently have. The only bigger ingredient I saw myself using a bigger cutting board/knife so far was watermelons, though I dont see myself using a laser knife cutting watermelons.

In conclusion, I think I will just pull the trigger on the Takamura 180mm Gyuto, I think that is a good balance in price and performance for my beginner knife. And once my knife skills get a little bit better I think I will consider getting a knife such as the konosuke, maybe there will be some good knife deals around black friday.

 

[chiffonodd]

In conclusion, I think I will just pull the trigger on the Takamura 180mm Gyuto, I think that is a good balance in price and performance for my beginner knife.

It's an excellent choice and you won't be disappointed. I bought a takamura 180 r2 for my wife and now i basically just steal it all the time. Extremely user friendly and easy to wield, cuts like a champ, and I rarely miss the extra length in my home kitchen where I only cook for two. Yes, volume prep on batch cooking days would be more efficient with a bigger knife, but I just don't cook at nearly enough volume to really make it a thing.

Enjoy!!

 

[Jovidah]

Personally I'd lean to a 210 simply because it's a bit more versatile. And they're still light as hell.
I have a review of the Takamura R2 somewhere. It's not a perfect knife, but cuts really well. My main gripes with it is that spine and choil are quite sharp - but that's to be expected at this price point. Another thing I don't like personally is the rather dampened 'soft' cutting feedback (probably because of the combination of thin knife + very soft cladding). As a result it feels a bit flimsy to me. In comparison an Ashi has far more direct cutting feedback. However that's more personal preference territory; I could totally see someone else actually preferring the Takamura for that reason.
Both will cut really really well; they're 2 of the 'default' lasers for good reason.

 

[e30Birdy]

Also here from Germany and the Takamura Migaki R2 was my first J knife. I hardly use it now though as i find it too short and not tall enough for myself and have since then really moved on to 230 (Spåre) and mostly 240 which are a lot taller, just not a fan of short knifes. Before i reach for my Takamura I usually always catch myself reaching for my 180 Shibata Kotetsu Bunka, it may be shorter but i love the height and slices a dream.

Personally i would recommend a Shibata Kotetsu over the Takamura but to each his own. If not the 210 Gyuto then maybe the Bunka at 180mm if that is the length you prefer.

I have not tried the Ashi most are recommending but hear wonderful things about it.

Nakiris I think are awesome but one doesn't need them and not all like them, I love mine but one can live without one but has made me want to explore CCKs though. Usuba are very specific and feel like they aren't needed for most western kitchen tasks, would rather get myself a Honesuke to break down poultry.

Just my 2 cents on all this.

 

[Ricedeath]

I have to say, after doing some more research I am finally starting to understand the appeal of the other Knives such as the Ginga. The Shibata Kotetsu does look pretty nifty as well. To be honest, fart too many nice Knives to choose from. But man I have to say, that hike in price for (in my amateurish eyes) diminishing returns is kind of off putting. Which further emphasizes to me what a great price the Takamura is. But I am just too good in overthinking.. I mean I would just take that one knife that speaks to me the most. Unfortunately I like them all the same.

• Ashi Ginga 180mm Gyuto 250€
• Shibata Kotetsu Bunka 18cm 245€
• Shiro Kamo Santoku 240€
• Takamura 180mm Gyuto 150€
• (Ashi Ginga 210mm Gyuto 300€, actually would not wanna spend more than 250€)
• (Ashi Ginga Santoku 61 Hrc 350€)

What I like about the Ashi 180mm is, it is damn light and comes in a Monosteel. Apart from the reason stated by Jovidah I would also see it as a plus since it would not scratch as easily compared to the softer cladding used in the Takamura. Also a little more toughness does not sound bad. Don't get me wrong, sure I do want the laserishiest knife I can get, though I can't deny that such a delicate knife might not belong in the hands of a beginner that still has to refine their technique.

Now about my concerns, I read that softer heat treated knives especially with laser geometry would be more susceptible to rolling edges? If that were the case, I guess the Ashi would not be recommended that often as one of the go to Laser Knives I suppose?

The Kotetsu really looks like a shape I can imagine being very useful and overall just stands out to me a little more with its unique shape. I think when in use I would enjoy it more aesthetically than the Takamura.

The Shiro Kamo is also an interesting one, I did like the idea of the knife being entirely made by one smith as opposed to the stamped knives. Also it is a little bit flashier that the other ones and comes with a wenge wa handle, which I like. Though less of a laser, just an interesting knife from an interesting knifemaker I stumbled upon while browsing. How does this one fare, considering I was initially looking for a laser?

Performancewise inspired by the "how do you cut an apple thread", I would be interested in which knife here would cut the tastiest most satisfying apples, will be cutting those a lot.
Aesthetic wise I f&f would be important to me, also in regard to the prices it is offered at. Otherwise I would say pretty subjective matter.

 

[Ricedeath]

Maybe a little addition as to why I am still a little wary about the ashi. With the high importing fees, it just feels to me as if I would be getting "less" knife as opposed to lets say the Kotetsu. Given I really decide to go one price range over the Takamura. I just want to more thorougly look at the options I think.

 

[tostadas]

I have to say, after doing some more research I am finally starting to understand the appeal of the other Knives such as the Ginga. The Shibata Kotetsu does look pretty nifty as well. To be honest, fart too many nice Knives to choose from. But man I have to say, that hike in price for (in my amateurish eyes) diminishing returns is kind of off putting. Which further emphasizes to me what a great price the Takamura is. But I am just too good in overthinking.. I mean I would just take that one knife that speaks to me the most. Unfortunately I like them all the same.

• Ashi Ginga 180mm Gyuto 250€
• Shibata Kotetsu Bunka 18cm 245€
• Shiro Kamo Santoku 240€
• Takamura 180mm Gyuto 150€
• (Ashi Ginga 210mm Gyuto 300€, actually would not wanna spend more than 250€)
• (Ashi Ginga Santoku 61 Hrc 350€)

What I like about the Ashi 180mm is, it is damn light and comes in a Monosteel. Apart from the reason stated by Jovidah I would also see it as a plus since it would not scratch as easily compared to the softer cladding used in the Takamura. Also a little more toughness does not sound bad. Don't get me wrong, sure I do want the laserishiest knife I can get, though I can't deny that such a delicate knife might not belong in the hands of a beginner that still has to refine their technique.

Now about my concerns, I read that softer heat treated knives especially with laser geometry would be more susceptible to rolling edges? If that were the case, I guess the Ashi would not be recommended that often as one of the go to Laser Knives I suppose?

The Kotetsu really looks like a shape I can imagine being very useful and overall just stands out to me a little more with its unique shape. I think when in use I would enjoy it more aesthetically than the Takamura.

The Shiro Kamo is also an interesting one, I did like the idea of the knife being entirely made by one smith as opposed to the stamped knives. Also it is a little bit flashier that the other ones and comes with a wenge wa handle, which I like. Though less of a laser, just an interesting knife from an interesting knifemaker I stumbled upon while browsing. How does this one fare, considering I was initially looking for a laser?

Performancewise inspired by the "how do you cut an apple thread", I would be interested in which knife here would cut the tastiest most satisfying apples, will be cutting those a lot.
Aesthetic wise I f&f would be important to me, also in regard to the prices it is offered at. Otherwise I would say pretty subjective matter.

If you're only interested in cutting dense stuff like apples, go for the absolute thinnest one you can find. The shibata and takamura are both pretty close, so then it comes down to other things like handle type and blade shape.

 

[tostadas]

Maybe a little addition as to why I am still a little wary about the ashi. With the high importing fees, it just feels to me as if I would be getting "less" knife as opposed to lets say the Kotetsu. Given I really decide to go one price range over the Takamura. I just want to more thorougly look at the options I think.

The shibata knives have excellent F&F out of the box. One of few that I've come across with fully polished spine/choil. And their handles are well executed with additional chamfers on the front and back edges. Their R2 steel is very good. I find it a bit tricky to sharpen for some reason. The main consideration against the shibatas I would say are the profile/shape. They don't make a typical gyuto shape for most of their models, so you have to like the bunka. It's tall, flatter than average profile (but no "flat" spot), and the tip feels fragile so just be careful with it.

 

[e30Birdy]

I am that guy that loves the k-tip but only on a Bunka and not a fan of a Santoku which is weird as it basically the same knife with a different tip. I will say it was one of my latest purchases and i grab this blade a lot, f&f ootb is stupid nice, i like the height of the blade and just like @tostadas the level of detail put in with polished choil/spine and great handle while only being like 245 euro is awesome. Such a great knife. I have to force myself lately to pick up different knives in my collection because i really do enjoy the Kotetsu. Not trying to sway a decision but i think the extra money i paid compared to the Takamura was worth it as i never grab it. Should just let it go but it kind of represents where all this started for me.

 

[OnionSlicer]

There is only so much you can learn by researching on forums and websites, especially when you're new and don't have any points of reference. You have good options in front of you, it's best to dive in and get some hands-on experience at this point. I will say though, with the local prices you quoted, the takamura is by far the best value for money, and it's kinda crazy that some of the other ones cost double.

I'll offer up another, less sexy option: MAC HB-70. The cold, hard truth is that it will perform almost as well as any of the knives on your list. In the US you can get it for $60. This is a respected brand around here, you can ask anyone. It would make a great knife to practice sharpening without worrying about scratching it or whatnot. The steel is pretty tough and you may even end up donating it to your parents.

 

[chiffonodd]

There is only so much you can learn by researching on forums and websites, especially when you're new and don't have any points of reference.

And especially because much of the feedback in this thread is a function of personal preference rather than some absolute quality possessed by a given knife. End of the day, OP just has to pull the trigger and see what works for him.

This brings up another point: if the OP doesn't jive with the knife, can always list it on BST for a minor loss. Any of the knives discussed here would sell with little trouble. Takamuras, ashis, etc. are always in demand.

 

[Jovidah]

Yeah figuring out personal preference is the hardest part. It's easy to match specific preferences to knives, but you can't tell someone else what they like. It's like asking someone else what your favorite flavor of ice cream should be.
I can't tell you whether you like the softer cutting feedback from the Takamura vs the directer cutting feedback from an Ashi. Or whether you mind the sharp corners on the spine and choil on the Takamura and whether it's worth paying more for a Ginga to get them eased... I empathize with the position though; I found myself in the same situation in the past, and especially if you want limit the expenditure it's hard to make these decisions without being able to test drive.

Another thing to add though: look at blade height. Ashi knives tend to run 'low'. To the point that 180 and 210 are borderline too low for me. If you just want bang for your buck, depending on price you pay of course, it's hard to beat a Takamura.

 

[Delat]

I would advise against the Shiro Kamo damascus simply because you’re on a tight budget and the damascus just adds to the cost for no functional benefit (I can say that since I own one!).

However Shiro Kamo also makes knives in white and blue steels which are significantly cheaper and are supposed to be quite thin. He’s pretty popular in Europe so you should be able to find some online to check out.

Of the other knives on your list I also have the Shibata bunka and it’s a great knife. The cladding is soft as you noted, but the knife is definitely acknowledged as a laser (along with the Takamura and Ashi). Other j-knives I’ve had that cut as smoothly/easily as the Shibata were Yu Kurosaki and Yoshikane (in SKD). I suspect those two will be out of your price range, but worth checking.

But of course as many have pointed out, the Takamura is a great value.

 

[Ricedeath]

I will say though, with the local prices you quoted, the takamura is by far the best value for money, and it's kinda crazy that some of the other ones cost double.

Yeah, importing in Germany is kinda expensive and exchange rates for the Euro are terrible at the moment. And with Ashi.. for example the listing for the 210mm Gyuto expired, subsequently they increased the price it seems. At the very least I would end up with 321€ now. Only if you are lucky with the shipment carrier, cause they demand at the very least 6€ for paying your customs upfront. Exchange rate (at least for paypal) 1€=0.94$ + 19% VAT + 8.5% customs + 6€ carrier customs upfront fee. That puts a 210$ Ashi to 320€. Brutal I would say.

I will make it easy on myself now. First I will decide Shibata or Ashi and out of that decision either those or the Takamura.
Reason being, the Ashi listing for the 250€ 180mm Ashi is expiring in 6 hours, will be more expensive probably afterwards.
Given that I would have to pay same for either Ashi or Shibata, are those in the same league? From pictures only it does seem like the handle is a little better on the shibata though. Looking at the transition.
Otherwise I will just flip a coin honestly. Should all be good knives.

Of the other knives on your list I also have the Shibata bunka and it’s a great knife. The cladding is soft as you noted, but the knife is definitely acknowledged as a laser (along with the Takamura and Ashi). Other j-knives I’ve had that cut as smoothly/easily as the Shibata were Yu Kurosaki and Yoshikane (in SKD). I suspect those two will be out of your price range, but worth checking.

There are a few yu Kurosaki within my range, I can get Senko, Shizuku and Raijin 210€-270€. I did consider them. Though I was told they are not the best for the price as they are a little overhyped because of their flashy looks?

 

[Ricedeath]

I think I see myself going for the Shibata 180mm Bunka. The Takamura is really well priced, probably should also get one before those also get pricier. But I just see the Shibata checking a few more points than the Takamura.

 

[tally-ho]

A Kei Kobayashi R2 knife is more expensive than it's Takamura equivalent in size but has better fit and finish. The 210mm gyuto is 260€, 170mm santoku is 255€.

 

[Heckel7302]

I have to say, after doing some more research I am finally starting to understand the appeal of the other Knives such as the Ginga. The Shibata Kotetsu does look pretty nifty as well. To be honest, fart too many nice Knives to choose from. But man I have to say, that hike in price for (in my amateurish eyes) diminishing returns is kind of off putting. Which further emphasizes to me what a great price the Takamura is. But I am just too good in overthinking.. I mean I would just take that one knife that speaks to me the most. Unfortunately I like them all the same.

• Ashi Ginga 180mm Gyuto 250€
• Shibata Kotetsu Bunka 18cm 245€
• Shiro Kamo Santoku 240€
• Takamura 180mm Gyuto 150€
• (Ashi Ginga 210mm Gyuto 300€, actually would not wanna spend more than 250€)
• (Ashi Ginga Santoku 61 Hrc 350€)

What I like about the Ashi 180mm is, it is damn light and comes in a Monosteel. Apart from the reason stated by Jovidah I would also see it as a plus since it would not scratch as easily compared to the softer cladding used in the Takamura. Also a little more toughness does not sound bad. Don't get me wrong, sure I do want the laserishiest knife I can get, though I can't deny that such a delicate knife might not belong in the hands of a beginner that still has to refine their technique.

Now about my concerns, I read that softer heat treated knives especially with laser geometry would be more susceptible to rolling edges? If that were the case, I guess the Ashi would not be recommended that often as one of the go to Laser Knives I suppose?

The Kotetsu really looks like a shape I can imagine being very useful and overall just stands out to me a little more with its unique shape. I think when in use I would enjoy it more aesthetically than the Takamura.

The Shiro Kamo is also an interesting one, I did like the idea of the knife being entirely made by one smith as opposed to the stamped knives. Also it is a little bit flashier that the other ones and comes with a wenge wa handle, which I like. Though less of a laser, just an interesting knife from an interesting knifemaker I stumbled upon while browsing. How does this one fare, considering I was initially looking for a laser?

Performancewise inspired by the "how do you cut an apple thread", I would be interested in which knife here would cut the tastiest most satisfying apples, will be cutting those a lot.
Aesthetic wise I f&f would be important to me, also in regard to the prices it is offered at. Otherwise I would say pretty subjective matter.

If you can swing the extra cash, I’d go for a Shibata Bunka. If for nothing else than the height alone. 180 Takamura are around 40mm tall. That’s just too short for me to find comfortable. My Shibata Bunka is 52mm. Takamura western handle is also just way too handle heavy for me to enjoy, especially in shorter length like 180.

Shibata was my second j-knife and is still one of my favorites. It’s the knife that tipped me into this weird obsession. Ultimate laser performance, convex grind, superb fit and finish, neutral balance, great profile, great steel. It might be more expensive than Takamura, but it feels like it.

 

[Delat]

If you can swing the extra cash, I’d go for a Shibata Bunka. If for nothing else than the height alone. 180 Takamura are around 40mm tall. That’s just too short for me to find comfortable. My Shibata Bunka is 52mm. Takamura western handle is also just way too handle heavy for me to enjoy, especially in shorter length like 180.

Shibata was my second j-knife and is still one of my favorites. It’s the knife that tipped me into this weird obsession. Ultimate laser performance, convex grind, superb fit and finish, neutral balance, great profile, great steel. It might be more expensive than Takamura, but it feels like it.

Ooof, 40mm tall for a main knife is really low. If you’re still learning how to use your off-hand to guide the knife (or haven’t started yet) then you will definitely appreciate the extra height of the Shibata down the road. For board work I personally find anything below 47mm to be too low, and 50mm or taller to be ideal.

Regarding the Kurosaki, I personally loved the Fujin 210mm in AS that I had. Still regret selling it. It’s a bit heavier and feels more substantial than the Shibata but cut just about as well. I reached for it way more than the Shibata and if I could keep only one it would be a Kurosaki. I only sold it because I have way too many 210 gyutos and it overlapped with my Yoshikane. And if I recall correctly, it was a touch low at around 47mm.

 

[Ricedeath]

Short update. The Shibata Kotetsu arrived and damn is it a fine Knife. Rounding of choil and spine is superb. Really happy with the choice.

I went on sharpening. 1k, 2k, 5k and finishing on a naniwa 8k with mirror polished cutting edge. Wanted to get rid of that inconsistent looking micro bevel, also did not pass my shave forearm test oob. While I do not own many knives, I did notice while sharpening that the knife did have some flexiness to it, probably due to the sanmai or thickness? Just a subjective observation from my side, felt unusual since I was used to stiffer knives. Was not noticeable during cutting.
Afterwards, that thing just melted through potatos and apples. I was amazed, that cutting or I’d rather say gliding through apples could feel like that. That isn’t the kind of "cutting" I was used to.
When I was done, I put it back into the anti rust paper it came shipped in and only after sliding in, I realized it had cut through 1cm of the paper and my thumbs skin. Felt nothing and it just cut effortlessly. Luckily did not bleed.

On the flipside, the transistion between handle and ferrule (is that the name? can’t remember it..) could have been a little smoother. And while it sure glides through produce, that thing is stick city. Though to me a sacrifice I am willing to make. On that account even better, because I have been considering to mirror polish it. Like stickiness already felt bad, could it really get worse?

So far I never put micro bevels on either my woodworking tools nor knives, since I was okay with the durability and resharpenability even without. On the Shibata I noticed though after todays cutting session while not really visible there were a handful of glistering spots, I suppose the edge is rather delicate, so should I consider putting a micro bevel on it?