Why all the Shun hate?

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Ceriano

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I tried the 8" Shun classic chef knife at the store the other day and I really liked the fit and the finish. If Shun is overpriced at $120 what other better options are out there? Do knife people just hate them because they are generic?
 

M1k3

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Weird balance. Flattish grind. Heat treatment of steels could be better.

Something like Masahiro, Masamoto or Takamura VG-10 or Chromax will be better performers in my opinion.

Shun does have the guarantee and sharpening aspect going for them though. If needed that is.
 

TSF415

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I tried the 8" Shun classic chef knife at the store the other day and I really liked the fit and the finish. If Shun is overpriced at $120 what other better options are out there? Do knife people just hate them because they are generic?
They are a huge pain in the arse to sharpen. There are quite a few knives in the $150 range that would blow it away. What knife depends on what you're looking for and for that you can fill out the questionnaire available and people on here will help guide you. I recommend a Takamura chromax for friends of mine.
 

Ceriano

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They are a huge pain in the arse to sharpen. There are quite a few knives in the $150 range that would blow it away. What knife depends on what you're looking for and for that you can fill out the questionnaire available and people on here will help guide you. I recommend a Takamura chromax for friends of mine.
I did fill out the questionnaire but I didn't get any response back :) I had Takamura listed as one of the alternatives. There are not that many options sub $150.
I do like the free sharpening service on Shun.

 

Nagakin

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My biggest issue is that they're fairly thick behind the edge and turn into hammers quickly. I don't know how my coworkers are using them, but it's definitely not just the factory edge that's chippy either. Together, that's a lot of labor and maintenance to keep it worse than the competition.
 

Ceriano

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Weird balance. Flattish grind. Heat treatment of steels could be better.

Something like Masahiro, Masamoto or Takamura VG-10 or Chromax will be better performers in my opinion.

Shun does have the guarantee and sharpening aspect going for them though. If needed that is.
I like Masamoto but the ones with Japanese/Wa handles are way above $200-$300.
 

daveb

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I'm not a fan. But I will cede that for their target market they are fine. They are housewife knives, marketed to housewives. They perform reasonably well when new and are pretty to look at. They are great for showing neighbors and friends. Ideally they will see about 8 hours use / year.

For someone who puts more demand on a knife they quickly become unsuitable. Sharpening them is a b**tch and is beyond the abilities of most of their customers. The "local" sharpener only has the grinder available and while he can grind a new, 60grit edge on the knife, any thinning will typically be beyond his skill. Any hand sharpening / thinning will quickly scuff hell out of that pretty blade.

Most of the Shun I've encountered are not sharp, are fat, and so terrible cutters. Wedge monster is not an unreasonable description. I've a friend I sharpen a couple knives for, a couple times a year but I told her up front they will not be pretty when I'm done. They don't suck but I wish she had gone with MAC or Misono.

That said the 3.5" parer is a pretty solid little knife. I've also owned / used the 150mm petty they call a "utility" knife. That was my first Jknife.
 

Ceriano

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I just equated Shun with wanting a western handle. Check out Tanaka? Kaeru?
So far these are the ones I could find under $200:
Tanaka Kurouchi Gyuto 210mm and Takamura Chromax both at $140. I'm new to the knife world and I understand they are charging money for the blades but I feel at these prices they are going kinda cheap on the handles.
 
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daveb

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Should have been more clear. They don't suck because they're lightly thinned and sharpened on stones a couple times a year. Not many Shun can claim that. They do look like crap - I don't spend a lot of time on keeping knives pretty.
 

MowgFace

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The profile is what gets me. Granted, if I went to a friends house and they had Shuns I’d be stoked that they have better than most.

In all honesty, if you really want a Shun, get a Shun. If you care enough about handles to sway your decision, then so be it. You may love it.

Personally I’d take a shatty handle on a good performing blade, but I understand those who want a “showpiece” that also performs well.

I’d imagine that many households would look at our patina’d knife with thinning scratches and never want something like that in their kitchen

F&F is going to be hard to come by at this price point.
 

Ceriano

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The profile is what gets me. Granted, if I went to a friends house and they had Shuns I’d be stoked that they have better than most.

In all honesty, if you really want a Shun, get a Shun. If you care enough about handles to sway your decision, then so be it. You may love it.

Personally I’d take a shatty handle on a good performing blade, but I understand those who want a “showpiece” that also performs well.

I’d imagine that many households would look at our patina’d knife with thinning scratches and never want something like that in their kitchen

F&F is going to be hard to come by at this price point.
I actually do like the hand finishing and rustic look of Tanaka. I do wish they used a higher quality wood for their lower tier models.

Sorry for my ignorance but how much should I expect to spend on a decent Japanese knife? Is something like Takamura Chromax good enough for home cook or should I spend and extra 100-$200 get something more decent? There are way more options sub $300.
 

Blerghle

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Just over $200 here: Tanaka Blue 2 Gyuto 210mm Migaki Finish (that's carbon, they also have stainless/ginsanko). A Takamura Chromax or a MAC Pro or really any of the knives mentioned above are plenty good. Rather than spending more on the knife, I think most people would recommend saving some money to get some basic sharpening supplies and learning to put an edge on it. That will make for a far greater boost to performance than spending more on the knife.

I haven't tried to sharpen a Shun but I still remember trying to sharpen a coworker's Global. Woof. I think more than anything else, difficult sharpening results in the most negative feedback here.
 

YumYumSauce

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They're okay when maintenance is kept up. Asthetics wise they look tacky to me. I'd rather get a mac.
 

Ceriano

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Just over $200 here: Tanaka Blue 2 Gyuto 210mm Migaki Finish (that's carbon, they also have stainless/ginsanko). A Takamura Chromax or a MAC Pro or really any of the knives mentioned above are plenty good. Rather than spending more on the knife, I think most people would recommend saving some money to get some basic sharpening supplies and learning to put an edge on it. That will make for a far greater boost to performance than spending more on the knife.

I haven't tried to sharpen a Shun but I still remember trying to sharpen a coworker's Global. Woof. I think more than anything else, difficult sharpening results in the most negative feedback here.
Does Ginsan hold edge as good as Chromax or should I just stick with B-2 with the Tanaka knives?
 

Blerghle

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I have no experience with Chromax. Tanaka ginsan sharpens up easily for stainless. Blue 2 will take a keener edge and would be my choice among all of these, but it's fully reactive carbon, so almost a different category.
 

Ryndunk

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I really don't think shun is hard to sharpen. To me the issue is they are thick behind the edge, and the terrible profile. The steel is to chippy for the masses they are marketed too. The grind isn't good enough for those who know better. It's really is an unhappy medium with just enough bling and fit and finish to keep the sales going.
 

Ceriano

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In theory Chromax will hold edge longer and Ginsan will be easier to sharpen but IMO both are really good all around steels.
How do you compare mac vs takamura chromax? Other than the look is there any reason to pick Mac over takamura? Of all 3 I like the look of Tanaka the most but the one I like costs almost twice as much as the chromax.
 

tostadas

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Does Ginsan hold edge as good as Chromax or should I just stick with B-2 with the Tanaka knives?
I also posted in your questionnaire thread, but this one seems to have all the cool kids in it. You mentioned in that thread that you want a stainless knife. Are you open to non-stainless carbon knives? That would open up a lot more options. Blue and white steels are non-stainless carbon steel.
 

Barashka

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Shun has it's place, as does Miyabi and zKramers.

At 30% off they become quite fine knives for the money, maybe not the stellar performers people want them to be, but lifetime sharpening and no questions asked returns etc, is worth something to people. You just have to understand you are not paying purely for perf.

There's also eye candy ... yeh similar or cheaper knives might have equal or mildly better perf, but life is too short to use an ugly knife. I've certainly bought something more expensive just so it's nicer to look at, knowing full well a boring looking knife will outperform it. I'm pretty sure most people here are guilty of that.
 

Ceriano

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I also posted in your questionnaire thread, but this one seems to have all the cool kids in it. You mentioned in that thread that you want a stainless knife. Are you open to non-stainless carbon knives? That would open up a lot more options. Blue and white steels are non-stainless carbon steel.
how quick do they rust? Do they rust or they just develop a hard patina? I own a couple of knives of Alaska (D2 steel) never had any issues with the rust. I also have a few cheap mora knives that I intentionally left in lemon juice and mustard to create a hard patina.
 
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