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scott6452

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Its fascinating how something relatively constant (kitchen knives) manages to still go through demand cycles.

The specific example I have in mind at the moment is Carter. Back when I was first getting into this, I was after one (falling into the trap of their popularity at the time) and there was only ever a few available in stock on his website. New batches sometimes sold out within hours. When I finally did get luck and reserved a few I was so pleased. I was just looking at the stock on his website and the choices are (by handmade knives standards) endless. There are 3 pages of stock specifically by Murray himself and lots more by the general company. I wonder how sales are comparing to say 5 years ago. I thought maybe he perhaps had the ability to produce higher numbers but there are specific knives I have been eyeing up that have been there for a while now.

What is it that influences these trends and what other examples are there around of popularity rises and falls?
 
Shig and Kato. Couple years ago it was possible to find stock at random days. Now, not so much.
Unfortunately for me, I had a Kato in my hand but decided not to purchase it (abt a year ago for 2/3rd the current cost). And now I want one quite a lot.
 
Kochi too, everyone raved about them a little over a year ago and they sold out within minutes. Now there is a good stock on jki, unfortunately the cad is much worse now.
 
Yeah funny how that goes?

It seems a while back (probably thanks to Konosuke hd2 and such) lasers were all the rave. Now for some time there seems to be an ever growing interest for the "workhorse" ride (probably thanks to Kato and such) and suddenly it seems there's a little less love for the lasers?
 
Hiho
@Java:
Yep i know what you mean.. i have more Lasers than the Deathstar and now i like honest workhorses suddenly more.
Its like when you didnt like cabbage as a kid and now you can take a bath in it ;)

We had the same trends in german forums a lot.. there was a kono and ashi super rush, shiro kamo was the must knife and so on.. trends change pretty fast.
well at least the knifes are still awesome, but you often think "why the hell did i have to buy 30+ first to recognize what i really like" ;)
 
:goodpost::lol2:
And there is nothing wrong with that. It is just a fun ride to learn what one likes. Right?

The way things are shaping up, it is going to be a big chinese cleaver party next? :D
 
Which is funny, because isn't one of the selling points of them that they're relatively cheap?
 
I feel like there are also mini trends, before i was into knives i remember hearing murmers around knife stores about Santoku's and how magical they are. To me the phase died pretty quickly.
And lets be honest the High end knife world is pretty small. (anybody know the numbers of knives from big guys vs small custom market?? i would guess %95 of knives are sold by henkels/shun/global etc.)

The real trends are what the big companies advertise . Evidently its VG10 and Damascus is super hot untill the sales die out and they start producing knives in the next best steel to start the whole mass production / mass sale cycle over again.


Admittedly I want a chukka to try out as well.
 
I mean I think a lot of the issue is that with the knives being so expensive, people can't afford to go buy 10 and see which they like best. So they settle for the opinions of others, and if someone buys a shigefusa then they will do the same thing yet even then they aren't that popular. Hell I was at knifewear in Ottawa and told them I had a few shigefusas and a kato, and they had no idea about these makers and just looked at me like "that's nice" In reality the percentage of people who buy japanese knives are small, and those who collect them is even smaller.
 
havox07;428683 I was at knifewear in Ottawa and told them I had a few shigefusas and a kato said:
Agreed - But they really know nothing about knives beyond their product lines. I think its because they need lines that they can have in stock at all times. even then you get a lot of "this is blue steel, it cuts great" - " this is white steel, it cuts great." - and I'm not afraid of saying that because even though i love the shop, none of the employees are on any forums.
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LucasFur said:
Agreed - But they really know nothing about knives beyond their product lines. I think its because they need lines that they can have in stock at all times. even then you get a lot of "this is blue steel, it cuts great" - " this is white steel, it cuts great." - and I'm not afraid of saying that because even though i love the shop, none of the employees are on any forums.
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This is true of almost anything though.

Unless you are selling to extremely discerning customers, at the super high end, knowledgeable staff may be detrimental to the bottom line.

I worked in a bicycle shop years ago, and wound up not working with customers. If you answer someone's questions honestly and have real knowledge, you often put them off by making then aware of shortcomings and they'll go buy from someone else who either didn't know of the shortcomings or keeps them a secret.

I wouldn't be surprised if some stores which cater to the more mainstream clients actually favour less knowledgeable staff. A lot of people don't want to hear pros and cons and would rather be reassured that a product in the absolute best of the best (and will give their custom to someone who tells them that).
 
MAS4T0 said:
I wouldn't be surprised if some stores which cater to the more mainstream clients actually favour less knowledgeable staff. .
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I agree with you. BUT I would love there to be a resident knife encyclopedia.
And this is why i joined the forum. to talk to people about knives, that are not out for profit.

BACK TO OP.
Knife fashion trends - Different and new steels. I feel like less and less makers are trying to perfect heat treatment of the basic carbon steels and are trying newer steels almost yearly. I wonder how long before carbon becomes obsolete :stinker:* previous thread reference right there for those that don't check this site daily.
 
Can't they try different and new carbon steels? I know WillC is.
 
LucasFur said:
I agree with you. BUT I would love there to be a resident knife encyclopedia.
And this is why i joined the forum. to talk to people about knives, that are not out for profit.
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Sorry for the derailment.

I absolutely agree. If the staff don't seem knowledgeable, I usually ask to speak to the owner/ manager. Usually they'll either live for and love the products (like Jon) or you'll see quite quickly that they're not interested in the products and have just seen then as a way to make some money (in which case you know what to do).
 
I think each brand is trying to differentiate themselves and to break out of their niche, they're vying to be "the" Japanese knife brand rather than "a" Japanese knife brand so a lot of changes and "advancements" are being made.

I'm sure that the old brands offering many high end single bevels for Japanese pros will retain their current focus.

DanHumphrey said:
Can't they try different and new carbon steels? I know WillC is.
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I think they're mostly discussing commercial (factory) knife makers rather than individual craftsmen.
 
MAS4T0 said:
I think they're mostly discussing commercial (factory) knife makers rather than individual craftsmen.
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Oh. Well, for most people buying factory knives, the upkeep on carbon is a non-starter, so that's not surprising at all. Just like trying to get a three-pedal car these days.
 
MAS4T0 said:
This is true of almost anything though.

Unless you are selling to extremely discerning customers, at the super high end, knowledgeable staff may be detrimental to the bottom line.

I worked in a bicycle shop years ago, and wound up not working with customers. If you answer someone's questions honestly and have real knowledge, you often put them off by making then aware of shortcomings and they'll go buy from someone else who either didn't know of the shortcomings or keeps them a secret.

I wouldn't be surprised if some stores which cater to the more mainstream clients actually favour less knowledgeable staff. A lot of people don't want to hear pros and cons and would rather be reassured that a product in the absolute best of the best (and will give their custom to someone who tells them that).
Click to expand...

Well said, a good example of "ignorance is bliss".

I remember talking to a rep at a non-KKF vendor in Canada and mentioned the issues with Takeda, and it didn't really click at first... after all, a $400 knife has to be really good, right? I was eventually able to communicate this to a manager, and overall felt taken care of even if they couldn't personally realise what I was describing.

BTW, after talking to you about bikes awhile ago, I'm now thinking that the $2100 Cannondale F-Si 1 may be lacking lol. Still would be better than anything I've ever had... but would have to upgrade to XTR ;)
cannondale-f-si-carbon-2-copy-237839-1.jpg
 
DanHumphrey said:
Oh. Well, for most people buying factory knives, the upkeep on carbon is a non-starter, so that's not surprising at all. Just like trying to get a three-pedal car these days.
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It took me a while to register what you meant as the vast majority of cars here are manual transmission, and I think I only know one person who has an automatic car!

tjangula said:
Well said, a good example of "ignorance is bliss".

I remember talking to a rep at a non-KKF vendor in Canada and mentioned the issues with Takeda, and it didn't really click at first... after all, a $400 knife has to be really good, right? I was eventually able to communicate this to a manager, and overall felt taken care of even if they couldn't personally realise what I was describing.

BTW, after talking to you about bikes awhile ago, I'm now thinking that the $2100 Cannondale F-Si 1 may be lacking lol. Still would be better than anything I've ever had... but would have to upgrade to XTR ;)
cannondale-f-si-carbon-2-copy-237839-1.jpg
Click to expand...

Feel free to reach out any time. XT might be better suited depending on your needs, it's generally more durable but a little heavier than XTR. Also of note is that those already have the XTR rear mech.

The components which might not be ideal for you can be replaced easily and relatively cheaply and you'd probably end up changing the seat and bars on any bike you buy if you want it to feel just right. I think I'd maybe be looking to change the shifters, but that's just personal preference based on hand feel.

If it's the right style of bike for what you're doing, you'll find nothing lacking on there.
 
Unfortunately fashion and trends quite often are the same thing. Allot of it isn't really practical but for many its fun and for some its serious ,almost like religion/ocd. Most people in society run pretty average and when buying into something just want an upgrade and some cool factor, they don't want some dissertation by a product nerd. There are every few things out there if any that don't have short comings or drawbacks, pluses and minuses. I think our society's search for perfection in products, whether it be technical or appearance, is a bit absurd . Knifewear is a business started by someone with a passion for Japanese knives , decided to make a living at it and wanted to turn average people onto the benefits of having a decent Japanese handmade knife. The staff fits that situation. From what i've experienced recently with them the staff is above your average user but not like many of the very passionate people here (-; .
 
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