First entry into carbon Japanese knives to cook and learn sharpening?

Hello everyone,

First of all, I have been reading as much topics as I could for a while but the more I read and the more I get confused. It seems I can’t finally take a decision by myself and this is why I am deciding to stop lurking and post this message, hoping to get the help and advices which will help me to finally know where to go

LOCATION

Belgium

KNIFE TYPE

Gyoto and Yaganiba / Sujihiki

Are you right or left handed? Right handed
Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle? I love the look of the Japanese handle but it isn’t a decisive constraint.
What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)? 210 / 240 mm for the Gyoto, 270 mm for the Yanagiba / Sujihiki
Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no) No, I would like to go carbon
What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife? 200 for each knife

KNIFE USE

Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment? Home
What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.) All purpose for the Gyoto, Fish slicing (sashimi) and exceptionally “bleu” cooked beef thin slicing for the Yaganiba / Sujihiki
What knife, if any, are you replacing? None
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.) Pinch grip
What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.) Slice and Walking
What improvements do you want from your current knife? N/A
Better aesthetics? N/A
Comfort? Medium weight
Ease of Use? N/A
Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)? weekly at the minimum, if not longer

KNIFE MAINTENANCE

Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.) Yes
Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.) No
If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.) Yes
Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.) Yes

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

Ok, so here we go. I am really interested to learn how to sharpen my own knives and this is one of the motivation in purchasing new ones.
At first, I wanted to buy some cheap knives, worrying to damage them while learning sharpening but reading topics helped me realized that this should not be my primary concern.
I currently have a short list of knives I am looking into, mainly from bluewayjapan and JCK.

E.g. for a Yanagiba (Even though I could get a Sujihiki instead if you think it is more appropriate)

Japanese SAKAI Carbon Steel Yanagiba Knife 270mmwhich is really cheap

Fu-Rin-Ka-Zan Kurouchi White Steel No.2 Series Yanagiba wich is inside my budget range

Japanese Sakai Ichimonji Kichikuni Blue Steel Yanagiba Knife 270mm, a little over budget but I would prefer to add 30 USD and not regret it if it is the solution you suggest.

E.g. for a Gyoto

Misono Sweden Steel Series Gyuto 240mm from JCK inside my price range

Japanese Sakai Ichimonji Kichikuni White Steel Wa-Gyuto Knife Black Blade 240mm from bluewayjapan inside my price range

I know it is not the place to speak about stones but, to let you know, I plan to buy the King 1000/6000.

Here is where I am at the moment.

Thank you so much for taking the time to read through my post and helping me out!
Cheers,

How often do you make sashimi? A yanagiba is a very much one purpose knife that requires special sharpening skills. A sujihiki is much more general purpose. Have you looked at the itinomonn series from jns?

The Misono carbon gyutos are a good—you may also want to consider the Suien carbon knives, which are reasonably priced.

I agree with Spipet, unless you make a lot of sashimi, get a suji. I good yanagi will break your budget.

Masahiro makes good introduction carbon knives—I'm happy with my Masahiro sujihiki, Western carbon petty, and honkatsu—good first carbons.

If you have a good cutlery story near you, go and test out a few different knives.

Some good carbon gyuto recommendations here.

My thoughts on yanagiba vs sujihiki: sujihiki is easier/cheaper to maintain (less stones needed, a 1k/6k combo is sufficient, same almost cannot be said for yanagiba). It is also easier to use as a versatile slicing knife as it has a less delicate edge. At +/- 200$ finding a serviceable 270 sujihiki is easier than finding a serviceable 270 yanagiba at that price point.

If you're new into free hand sharpening on water stones and new to using Japanese style slicers I would say go with a sujihiki, you will get more value out of it in the kitchen.

If you are in Europe, I would look up Maxim at Japanesenaturalstones.com. The Munetoshi Gyuto looks ideal and is full carbon (€184 for 210mm or 2 €235 for 240mm). The sujihiki might have to be Itinomonn if they are in stock but these are still €269 for a 270mm sujihiki.

Also, is you budget $200 USD or €200 per knife?

Tanaka B#2 from James, may be a smudge over budget but it's phenomenal as for the suji, masakage Mizu would be my go to or a masakage yuki or a misono swedish steel with a dragon :knife:

fatboylim said:

If you are in Europe, I would look up Maxim at Japanesenaturalstones.com. The Munetoshi Gyuto looks ideal and is full carbon (€184 for 210mm or 2 €235 for 240mm). The sujihiki might have to be Itinomonn if they are in stock but these are still €269 for a 270mm sujihiki.

Also, is you budget $200 USD or €200 per knife?

Click to expand...

If the Itinomonn suji is anything like the gyuto from the same line, it should be a really great slicer for the price.

Thank you so much for all your great answers!
I had not considered all these possibilities.

I make sashimi around once a week so it is not an intense use. I will follow all the advice here and go with a Sujihiki instead of a Yanagiba.

For the budget, I was sitting around €200. But I can stretch it a little. So I am taking all your propositions into account.

I really like the Munetoshi Gyuto at €235 for 240mm, really love the rustic look of it ! The Tanaka Blue 2 is also on top of my list now, so... Who knows.
Thanks again for those submissions.

For the Sujihiki, it looks a little more complicated.
I had not looked at the Itinomonn but it is a little over budget. I could still get one if it is worth it on the long term.
Will try to look a little more into the Misono, Masahiro, Masakage Mizu and Itinomonn and try to shorten the list

I can vouch for the Tanaka. I've got the B2 kurouchi 240 and love it. Food release is excellent, sharpens easily and has good edge retention. I got the upgraded version from James at K&S but I think he's currently out of stock. Other retailers may have it but the F&F won't be as good.

I have no experience with the Mune but there's a current thread on here extolling their virtues so there seems to be plenty of love for them.

jeal said:

Thank you so much for all your great answers!
I had not considered all these possibilities.

I make sashimi around once a week so it is not an intense use. I will follow all the advice here and go with a Sujihiki instead of a Yanagiba.

For the budget, I was sitting around €200. But I can stretch it a little. So I am taking all your propositions into account.

I really like the Munetoshi Gyuto at €235 for 240mm, really love the rustic look of it ! The Tanaka Blue 2 is also on top of my list now, so... Who knows.
Thanks again for those submissions.

For the Sujihiki, it looks a little more complicated.
I had not looked at the Itinomonn but it is a little over budget. I could still get one if it is worth it on the long term.
Will try to look a little more into the Misono, Masahiro, Masakage Mizu and Itinomonn and try to shorten the list

Click to expand...

The Itinomonn is up there in my opinion, a great knife for a decent price and maxim is a good guy to buy from.

After checking all morning, I finally opted to go for a Munetoshi Gyuto 210mm and a Itinomonn 270mm Sujihiki.
I think the reduced size of the Gyuto will help while working on a smaller work plan at home. And the spared bucks can easily go toward the Itinomonn so here it is.

Once again, thank you so much for the help in making this choice!

Nice knives and I am sure you will like them!

jeal said:

After checking all morning, I finally opted to go for a Munetoshi Gyuto 210mm and a Itinomonn 270mm Sujihiki.
I think the reduced size of the Gyuto will help while working on a smaller work plan at home. And the spared bucks can easily go toward the Itinomonn so here it is.

Once again, thank you so much for the help in making this choice!

Click to expand...

Excellent choice, I'm sure you'll be very pleased!

Combining a short general purpose blade with a sujihiki is a rather smart solution in a home situation.