First Chef's Knife - Is carbon steel a bad idea?

[RubbishCook]

Hello all,

I am looking for my first chef's knife. I have a couple of smaller Shuns and Global knifes but I am getting tired of trying to cut meat with them. I need something bigger and safer. What do you guys recommend. I really like something handmade and high quality with a good fit and finish.

Thank you in advance!

LOCATION
USA

KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in)?

Chef’s knife
Are you right or left handed?
Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

I am comfortable with both

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?
210-240mm

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)
No

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?
$350 (would like to be under $300)


KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?

Home

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)
Cutting slicing trimming meat, chopping vegetables.
What knife, if any, are you replacing?
Don’t have a proper chefs knife
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this*LINK*for the common types of grips.)

Hammer

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this*LINK*for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)
Rocking, Draw, Push-cut

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?
I would like a simple but attractive knife, something that I can sharpen (learn to sharpen myself). No Damascus type blades please.

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?

Something well balanced with a good fit and finish. I think I prefer medium to light weight knife.

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?

Very easy to use. I do not have much experience. Something that will be safe for a beginner

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?

The more edge retention the better. I can have the knife professionally sharpened if necessary.

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
I use wood and plastic cutting boards
Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
I do not but I would consider trying. There is a knife shop (Town Cutler) that teaches sharpening near my house
If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)
I am interested in learning
Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)

I don’t mind buying sharpening products

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I was originally looking at Hattori FH and Blazen knives and then I started looking at carbon steel because they supposedly are the easiest to sharpen and have the best edge retention...which to me sounds like it may be worth the extra effort if I can more easily keep the knife sharp/safe.

 

[brianh]

Regardless of what you decide on, I would work on getting away from a hammer grip and get used to pinch for most tasks. My first j knife was a Gesshin Ginga. Carbon laser and is sharp, nimble, not super reactive, and easy to sharpen. maybe something a little beefier would be best if you're rock chopping and using hammer grip.

 

[Godslayer]

As mentioned switch to a pinch, significantly better for 99.9% of tasks. I would look at carbon clad knives, with stainless cladding. Yu Kurosaki is availible at knives and stones for +/- $200 usd and is an amazing blade, nice clean kurochi finish. He also makes a semi custom version with a shiny finish for a little more. Itinomonn also comes to mind from japanese natural stones. Great little smith from sanjo. My first real knife besides a henckles was a fujimoto(tadafusa) and i definatly didnt regret getting a carbon knife, small learning curve. But such is life.b

 

[Mrmnms]

Many people are really well conditioned about keeping their carbon knives wiped and dried as they use them . When I am pressed to get dinner on the table, sometimes I drop the ball and may leave a knife out for a bit. I am more inclined to use a stainless clad knife like a yoshikane or one made of stainless , either Aeb-l or Sg-2 if I feel like I'm not going to be on top of my stuff. Maybe it's not an issue for you. Plenty of good options through the vendors and makers here.

 

[RubbishCook]

What do people think of the Asai Hyabusa Gyuto 210mm? This knife was recommended to me by the Epicurian Edge. It's stainless clad with an aogami super carbon steel core.

http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=90554

I like the Kurosaki but the 210 and 240 sizes are out of stock.

I will practice a pinch grip. Is that something you would use on smaller knives as well?

Also should I get a cheaper knife to practice sharpening?

 

[mc2442]

Look at the stainless clad Kochi from Japanese Knife Inports. Great knives.

 

[mikedtran]

I would say there is no need to fear carbons (I originally feared them when I first got into knives as well) only very select few knives with very reactive/rust prone claddings would be an issue. A standard carbon if not left wet or dirty for prolonged periods of time are not at any real risk of rusting.

Also noticed that you are in SF, I would also recommend Bernal Cutlery which is a great shop and focuses more on high end japanese knives. They also have a sharpening class there, which I took and improved my technique significantly.

Does your $300/$350 just for your knife or would you like that to be enough for a knife and sharpening stones?

Recommendations:
Toyama Gyuto - ~$250-300
Itinomonn Gyuto (comes in both Stainless and Carbon, but only the Stainless is in stock now) - ~$200
+1 Gesshin Ginga Gyuto (again comes in White #2 and Stainless) - ~$220-$265 (comes with a saya)

 

[mikedtran]

I will practice a pinch grip. Is that something you would use on smaller knives as well?

Yes, would suggest using it on smaller knives as well. Feels more like an extension of your hand than something you are holding =)

Also should I get a cheaper knife to practice sharpening?

I would say don't. I originally did and found that I learned the most when I took my "training wheels" off and just went into my expensive knives. Cheaper knives generally won't feel the same on stones and need different angles of sharpening.

You really won't do any real damage to your blade from sharpening (especially if you take a class, would recommend Bernal Cutlery). You may scuff up your blade, but that is part of learning to sharpen and won't affect the performance of the blade at all. You can always polish off the scuffing also.

 

[brianh]

I would get a less pricey knife and pick up a couple stones to practice with and still fit your budget. Patience, grasshopper. Call Jon at Japanese Knife Imports for advice. My bi-weekly direct deposit goes right into his bank account to save us both time.

 

[alterwisser]

I My bi-weekly direct deposit goes right into his bank account to save us both time.

[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

 

[Mrmnms]

I've been very happy with Epicurian Edge and their products . The only 210 in stock from that line is a kiritsuke style. I like Aogami Super. It's a hard steel. The fine edge will hold up well if you treat the knife right. Ask questions. I am sure they have other suitable options. I would also check with Jon at JKI here. He is knowledgable and can offer you several options. Have you handled any of the knives at Town Cutler? They have some cool stuff.

 

[RubbishCook]

I will definitely take a sharpening class at Bernal Cutlery. I ended up buying that Asai Hyabusa (last one)...I wasted my whole day looking at knives; I decided I need to just try one and figure it out from there. EE is going to fit a Saya to the Asai. Which sharpening stones do I need? I have seen sets for about $200. I hope I don't need to spend much more than that.

 

[Keith Sinclair]

JKI also has the Ikazuchi stainless clad AS carbon core steel. It is a light thin blade wa handle with saya. Easy to sharpen more of a laser type intro. to carbon steel. 200.00

 

[Mingooch]

My first Japanese knife was a carbon Kumagoro from EE. Still love that knife. Never had an issues with dealing with carbon.

 

[toddnmd]

I wasted my whole day looking at knives

I do not understand this sentence. There is never any time wasted looking at knives. It is all part of the education process.

I have seen sets for about $200. I hope I don't need to spend much more than that.

You could do a combo 1k/6K combo stone, if you want to keep costs down. Or you could get a 1-2K and a 5-6K stone, which will last you a long, long time.