JNat Beginners Guide to Buying: Stories of Success, Pitfalls, and Fails

[ethompson]

Thanks @naader for the vote of confidence - means a lot coming from someone as deeply knowledgeable as you.

Obviously I'm biased, I sell the stuff, so take everything that I say with a grain of salt. I don't think there are really any one stop shops for stones. Depending on what you're looking for and the timing, Carbon Knife Co, Strata, Aframes (I think underrated as a stone seller), JKI, et al can have compelling options. LaCasaDeToishi on IG has some seriously gorgeous high-end stuff, if that type of museum grade stuff is in your fiscal wheelhouse he is definitely worth a message. @naader is the type 24 king as far as I am concerned and likewise has some killer gems tucked away.

Auctions are a thing too - you won't (usually) find bargain suita or full size bricks of the really fancy stuff trading at less than 50% of retail like you used to find (before my time), but it is fun for sure and I've bought stuff from there with great success and a couple absolute failures. One of my favorites stones of all time was an auction stone I bought off a member here last year, so the real gems do exist.

BST here is probably where I see the best value consistently. Its not everyday, but at least once a month I feel like something seriously cool pops up and trades at prices more consistent with 2016 than 2023.

And then yeah, there is Tennen Toishi, which some little birdie tells me has some nifty things most of the time too

 

[user 16756]

Carbon is an excellent source for Morihei stones, which IMO are always reasonably priced given that they also tend to be high quality. I've also grabbed several Maruo stones and even a Nakayama tomae from Craig.

Not the most stone for the money, but honestly the one thing I've learned is to always go for the performers unless it's just way, way overpriced.

If that means you only have a single finisher for a while, well then so be it.

 

[Dune Cough]

Hi there!
I think I already know the answer, but how likely is it that an Uchigumori can be colored deep blue with a deeper blue pseudo-karasu-like effect?
I have used ebay to get 4 other stones in the last 3 months, and while I'm not disappointed, I also am realizing don't understand the stones I have, let alone have the ability to judge stones by pictures.

 

[naader]

Hi there!
I think I already know the answer, but how likely is it that an Uchigumori can be colored deep blue with a deeper blue pseudo-karasu-like effect?
I have used ebay to get 4 other stones in the last 3 months, and while I'm not disappointed, I also am realizing don't understand the stones I have, let alone have the ability to judge stones by pictures.

Post pics

 

[dragjp]

let alone have the ability to judge stones by pictures.

I think nobody here has this superpower, but a few can somewhat tell from pics if the stone is a total bs or worth a shot. So, pics?

 

[Dune Cough]

Well, the stones in question are not in my possession, but here are some pics from one listing. This stone is listed by tcmc14641, as were 3 I now have, though I've since heard the seller is in poor repute.

 

[Dune Cough]

I could simply share the link, but I'm not yet sure if there is a policy...

 

[jedy617]

Nah that's fine

 

[dragjp]

The pics brought back some hazy memory, I probably saw them on Mercari couple months ago. And the price on ebay is definitely off.

 

[Dune Cough]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/166126093127https://www.ebay.com/itm/166126100122Their appearance seems to correlate to naturalwhetstone's glossary description of 'shikiuchigumori'. And while I certainly would be happy with a beautiful stone that performs like an uchi, I doubt it warrants the price, or the risk.

 

[user 16756]

The pics brought back some hazy memory, I probably saw them on Mercari couple months ago. And the price on ebay is definitely off.

I would concur that that does not strike me as a 1000 dollar stone, and the pictures look lifted straight off a Japanese auction site.

@Dune Cough what are you looking for exactly you have a bazillion options in that price range. I will almost never buy uchis unless I want an off-size stone to grind up for patina removal powder because well if you want a genuinely pure one you are gonna be out huge $$$ and I'd rather put that into final step stones. Maybe if you describe what you're looking for, or post a WTB, someone might have something for you either for less or if you want to spend 1K, I mean yeah do it but get something worth it.

JMO

 

[ethompson]

Good, high quality uchigumori is expensive and not the easiest to find. Lots of it is riddled with cracks, suji, and su as well.

Don’t get me wrong, I love a great ohira uchi, but there are almost always better ways to spend money for knife stones. They tend to be fairly slow and not always the best match for the steels and cladding we use around here.

 

[ethompson]

Uchi can look like that, here is one I sold not too long ago.

Miss it…

Or this one I won’t be selling anytime soon

But sometimes tenjou suita from multiple lines kinda look like uchi but aren’t

 

[dragjp]

Uchi can look like that, here is one I sold not too long ago.
View attachment 251299
Miss it…

The other one just for display is an even nicer crepe heh.
Been saving budget for one like this.. you know how to hit me up if such beauty restocks.

 

[naader]

Well, the stones in question are not in my possession, but here are some pics from one listing. This stone is listed by tcmc14641, as were 3 I now have, though I've since heard the seller is in poor repute.

Thats uchi. Not a particularly clean one but it should be perfectly fine for knives

 

[naader]

Also, obligatory uchi flex

 

[user 16756]

Also, obligatory uchi flex
View attachment 251310

that is a thousand dollar stone in the sense that you put down one thousand dollars then you keep going.

 

[ethompson]

that is a thousand dollar stone in the sense that you put down one thousand dollars then you keep going.

Count with me 1 thousand, 2, 3, 4.... 5 (maybe)

 

[user 16756]

Count with me 1 thousand, 2, 3, 4.... 5 (maybe)

ah ah ah

 

[Dune Cough]

what are you looking for exactly you have a bazillion options in that price range.

I can tell you what I think I want, and the steps in how I came to think so:
I have Yasuki steel single bevel knives, and a Swedish steel, an AEB-L and a VG10 double-bevels. I want a 5-6 stone progression that I can use for both honyaki and kasumi, starting with synthetic, and finishing with naturals. I hope to use the mizuasagi I already have for uraoshi. I am a chef, so the beauty of the polish and and the stones themselves are a plus, but secondary to the edge it leaves and the practicality for a novice.
How I came to be interested in JNats:
1) Start dishwashing at restaurant- incidentally a sushi restaurant.
2) 3 years later I'm working on the line, and I'm far more interested in beautiful knives and sharp edges than most of my coworkers.
3) I buy more synthetic waterstones to push how finely I can sharpen knives, and to repair chips that plague my dreams.
4) I wanted try out honyaki, -- then I first read in more detail about JNats in the course of researching honyaki.
5) Learn that JNats can leave a longer lasting edge because of feather-variation? I buy a couple.
6) They are PRETTTYY, and make my knives PRETTTYY!
-
I realize that I am bound to carry many misconceptions, so if you suspect I am carrying any, I will not be offended by correction.
I also don't really know how to shop around, I hardly ever bought anything over the web before.

 

[Dune Cough]

I had my questions answered, so thank you all.

 

[Dune Cough]

Does Buyee prohibit the sale of Uchigumori to overseas?

 

[user 50275]

I join the Uchi party :

 

[user 16756]

Does Buyee prohibit the sale of Uchigumori to overseas?

no.

but they have keywords stopping the purchase of certain items. in the case of uchis, it's probably the adjacency to swords.

at any rate, if you ask them to unblock, they probably wont. but they have on occasion for me. I dont think they have a human actually look at the listing itself which is a shame, or at least I dont get the impression they do.

 

[naader]

no.

but they have keywords stopping the purchase of certain items. in the case of uchis, it's probably the adjacency to swords.

at any rate, if you ask them to unblock, they probably wont. but they have on occasion for me. I dont think they have a human actually look at the listing itself which is a shame, or at least I dont get the impression they do.

Email support to unblock it if the on site request fails, then they have to review it properly. Make sure to include in the email that "this is a whetstone" and "i have bought hundreds of them through your service and they are not restricted for export" and you'll be good. I've done a lot of arguing with the clowns at buyee.

 

[Dune Cough]

no.

but they have keywords stopping the purchase of certain items. in the case of uchis, it's probably the adjacency to swords.

at any rate, if you ask them to unblock, they probably wont.

Email support to unblock it if the on site request fails, then they have to review it properly.

Thank you, both! Here's hoping.

 

[simona]

no.

but they have keywords stopping the purchase of certain items. in the case of uchis, it's probably the adjacency to swords.

at any rate, if you ask them to unblock, they probably wont. but they have on occasion for me. I dont think they have a human actually look at the listing itself which is a shame, or at least I dont get the impression they do.

Similiar thing with kiridashi which are sometimes translated as "small sword" by the AI; there is a sturdy kiridashi-like knife for splitting open eels, which also translates as a sword, and therefore often blocked. Handles with horn are also sometimes stopped - I think this is an ivory/bone issue. And so on and so forth. Weapons, leathers, woods, protected species - weapons can be real swords, hunting knives, plastic toy guns, replicas, or things related to swords, hilts, spacers, wrappings...also happened once when I tried to buy a second noodle machine.....?!?
I have only used a few proxy sites and the response varies from, "no chance in hell" to "opened". Jauce has the best customer service, but it comes at a premium.
Cheers.

Edit: In a similar vein there is a thinner kiridashi which normally has a curved 'handle', and these are typically small knives for pruning. They are often sold as bonsai pronging knives and are therefore blocked, as are many things bonsai. Now you know.

 

[simona]

Yeah, tennentoishi.com is probably the best bet in the US for interesting stones that aren't overpriced. Otherwise check the BST here regularly, stones come up fairly often.

I've chatted with lacasadetoishi and he tends towards more collector type stones at high prices (full size bricks, no missing corners, etc). I don't have anything bad to say about him, but not the right stuff if you are just getting into jnats.

He sells some very expensive stones on his site and advertises them on IG, though his Yahoo.jp page at the moment has from 1Y to 230 000Y, varying koppa to collectors stones.
Apologies, I was confusing him with 天然砥石 Naturalwhetstone Sharpen (@japanese_natural_whetstone) • Instagram photos and videos

 

[jedy617]

Man...I want a beautiful suminagashi stone like this someday: suita purple suminagashi and renge 2382g | Natural whetstones sharpening powered by BASE

 

[KenjiF]

Does Shohonyama translate as true main mountain? Does anyone know the mines this is referring to? I also see shomotoyama but I think that is the same thing and is just a google translate issue.