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rock_welch

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Joined
Sep 30, 2015
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LOCATION
Florida USA


KNIFE TYPE
I am looking for a traditional style gyuto for a right handed person, with a Japanese handle.
~8 inches in length.
$150 would be the maximum budget.


KNIFE USE
The knife would be used at home, somewhat frequently.
Slicing, chopping, mincing vegetables, slicing boneless raw meats. Possibly slicing cheese.

Aesthetics are important as it's a gift. No particular finish or pattern, wood, etc.

Ease of use and comfort are not as important as no matter what knife is chosen, it will be an upgrade from what he currently uses.

Edge retention is important, but below aesthetics. I would like him to notice that this knife stays sharp.


KNIFE MAINTENANCE
I believe it will be used against a wood cutting board or possible synthetic. Also as it is a gift I am not sure who will be sharpening the blade.


SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS
This is a gift for the guy who MCed our wedding and he did a great job. I'd like to find something that doesn't take too long to be delivered. I tried to find something but there are too many options for me to choose without proper advice.

Thanks!
 
There is a sale on the Miyabi Mizu and Kaizen lines, and I think that makes them a very good match and compelling value for what you are looking for. Very beautiful knives and great fit and finish, and come fully sharpened. Edge retention is especially good on the Mizu with its SG2 core steel, but the Kazien is pretty good too with VG-10.

http://www.cutleryandmore.com/miyabi-mizu/chefs-knife-p133133
http://www.cutleryandmore.com/miyabi-mizu-sg2/santoku-knife-p133135
http://www.cutleryandmore.com/miyabi-kaizen/chefs-knife-p121860

My suggestion is the Mizu 8" if you can do $160 and that's the best value IMO, otherwise the santoku is $150 or the Kaizen 8" is $135 — but IMHO an extra $25 is definitely worth it for the upgrade from VG-10 to SG2. Shipping and customer service is quick and well handled by Cutlery & More.
 
Thanks for the suggestions. The first website appears to have gone down and I cannot access it, so I'll wait a little bit and try again.

The Mizo is a great looking knife, that one is high on the list right now.
 
If I got on the phone I'd sound like a blithering idiot trying to remember/pronounce these brand names.

Besides, I enjoy typing Canada. ;)
 
Thoughts on these as well as the store?

Goko White #1

Kajiwara Kurouchi

Karaku

EDIT: appears the URL isn't allowed to be posted.
 
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Is the recipient going to properly take care of carbon steel? (i.e. rusting, acidic foods) White #1 gets very sharp, and sharpens easily, but doesn't have the edge retention of some of the other steels that we've talked about.
 
rock_welch said:
If I got on the phone I'd sound like a blithering idiot trying to remember/pronounce these brand names.
Click to expand...

That has never slowed me down...:cool2: Jon is patient and does not judge those of us that think Hide is a single syllable word.

"Goko White #1, Kajiwara Kurouchi, Karaku" To have a carbon knife on your shortlist is probably ill-conceived in the context of your planned gift. Stick with stainless - a knife that will be used for the foreseeable future instead of one that goes in the drawer because it rusts every time he uses it.

Myobi (sp?) would not be on my list for something like you're planning. It's pretty but. A Euro style knife with kewl characters that claims Japanese heritage. And made by Henkels. You could do worse but you could so easily do better.
 
They Miyabi is pretty, but it also happens to cut stuff too. They are not exactly made by Henckels...they are made by Japanese craftsman in Seki (just like many other Japanese knives), as Zwilling bought that manufacturer about ten years ago to launch their Zwilling Japan division and the Miyabi brand, and in recent years they also do a good job making the Zwilling Kramer knives too.

Are they mass-market? Yes. Are there knives that feel a bit better in my hand and also cut better? Yes. But are they still good performers and worthy of consideration? I would say so, depending on what you are looking for. You're not going to find a SG2 knife with that level of finish and decoration elsewhere for $160. Is something like a Takamura Uchigumo (made from the same steel and with damascus cladding) better? Most definitely yes...but that knife is almost $500.
 
daveb said:
YMMV
Click to expand...
That's the case for many things...all I'm saying is that making implications or aspersions that objectively aren't true because of one's own subjective preferences, that's not helpful.
 
Since Takamura was mentioned, I just wanted to mention the red handle line is probably the better comparison in price to the Miyabi Mizu instead of the the Uchigumo. I have owned the gyuto and the cutting performance is just fantastic. It is pretty much a laser so some people may not like that but definitely a knife I would recommend.
 
Yeah I had thought of also mentioning the Takamura Migaki R2, but I didn't want to go on too long a tangent. I have one and I love it, and personally I would take that at $175 for a 210 mm gyuto over the Mizu 8", but that's starting to get even higher over the OP's budget. (Aside: the Migaki is definitely a good comparison price-wise, and exceeds the Miyabi Mizu in performance and comfort (at least for my preferences and certain situations), and though it's a handsome-looking knife, it doesn't have the same fancy aesthetics. Not that bling should be important to everyone, but it does factor into price if you choose to include it in the knife you want. A significant limitation is that the Migaki line only goes up to 210 mm, whereas the Mizu is available in 9.5" or ~240 mm, and right now on sale for only $180.)

But the main reason I also didn't go there is that I don't think that's a good knife for a first time Japanese knife user being that it's so thin and hard. There are also times myself where I choose to use a different gyuto that's a bit more forgiving (or if I want better food release). Whereas I do know a number of people personally who have gotten a Miyabi as their first Japanese knife and they love it (and there are pros that choose to use one at work too, though they're not necessarily vocal here about it). Another benefit of Miyabi, especially for the first time J-knife user, is that they are more widely available, and those that live nearby a Sur la Table store can go there to try them out and see if they like them and how it feels in their hand. And if you end up not liking it, SLT will allow some time for you to take it back.
 
richard said:
That's the case for many things...all I'm saying is that making implications or aspersions that objectively aren't true because of one's own subjective preferences, that's not helpful.
Click to expand...

Huh? That sentence(?) is too easy to go ERex on. But it's got a great syllable count...

I've related direct experience with the knife in question. Using it. Sharpening it. Petty and Gyuto. It's a house brand so I'll probably use one some more. My "subjective preference" is based on that experience. The OP wanted a Japanese knife for a friend. I suggested one. You suggested something different. If she elects to go "Shun lite" she'll be gifting a decent knife that is marketed well, but is otherwise unremarkable.

Was going to ask what you based your advocacy on, then saw where you have a friend that has one.
 
Not at all. Shun was the first to take on Wustie and Henckels for a significant share of the American "housewife" market. A few others have tried (are trying) for a piece of that market. IMO that's what Miyabi is all about. I'm not familiar with Massahiro or Kikuichi but do note that they are mass marketed and that the length is expressed in inches rather than mm. Do recall reading good things here about both but again I'm not familiar with either.
 
I'm not an advocate for Miyabi. I do happen to have one and I like it enough to keep it, but I also have other knives I like better. But I also have friends who don't like the knives I prefer as much as a Miyabi. In this particular case, I suggested the Miyabi Mizu based on what the OP was looking for (i.e. budget, edge retention, aesthetics, first time Japanese knife user). Particularly with the Mizu happening to be on sale right now makes them somewhat more compelling IMHO, as you're not typically talking about a SG2 knife at this price point, normally at least around $250-300+, especially for something with some decoration to it (e.g. Takamura Hana, JCK Kagayaki Gekido). For a different person looking for other qualities, I might be suggesting a different knife (regardless of the sale).

Hey so you don't like Miyabi's. That's fine, I have no problem with that. But to implying they're Europeans just pretending to be Japanese or saying because they're pretty (implying they don't properly perform the important cutting function of a knife?) or along those lines seems to be bordering on irrational hatred of them (same thing that Shun gets a lot of...do we need to revisit this thread?), and so I spoke up. And "better"? Well, not everyone values the same things equally, so what's better in your mind or even in my mind may not be better to someone else.
 
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