prociutto and serrano

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I remember a bar in Madrid where there was a long line of hams hanging over the bar and the patrons drinking there. Everyone was smoking up a storm and the hams were up there in a cloud of tobacco smoke. I was kind of wondering how that effected the flavor? :)
 
I remember a bar in Madrid where there was a long line of hams hanging over the bar and the patrons drinking there. Everyone was smoking up a storm and the hams were up there in a cloud of tobacco smoke. I was kind of wondering how that effected the flavor? :)
hard to say, but the reason they can survive for long time is due to the thick skin, so my hope is they won't be affected... but you never know!
 
I remember a bar in Madrid where there was a long line of hams hanging over the bar and the patrons drinking there. Everyone was smoking up a storm and the hams were up there in a cloud of tobacco smoke. I was kind of wondering how that effected the flavor? :)
Well no wonder the hams are addictive.
 
Still thinking about this. I've noticed everything discussed so far is relatively long - at least 8 inches. But I don't think I've ever seen a proper jamon or prosciutto slice wider than 4 inches and every slicing video shows people cutting close to the handle and not the tip. Is there a reason for this? Does more than half the blade end up unused?
 
Still thinking about this. I've noticed everything discussed so far is relatively long - at least 8 inches. But I don't think I've ever seen a proper jamon or prosciutto slice wider than 4 inches and every slicing video shows people cutting close to the handle and not the tip. Is there a reason for this? Does more than half the blade end up unused?
Long knives let you make long sweeping motions, which produce cleaner slices. Why people are not taking advantage of this in the videos does seem strange.
 
Still thinking about this. I've noticed everything discussed so far is relatively long - at least 8 inches. But I don't think I've ever seen a proper jamon or prosciutto slice wider than 4 inches and every slicing video shows people cutting close to the handle and not the tip. Is there a reason for this? Does more than half the blade end up unused?


I think this kinda depends on the ham itself, how you prep the leg initially, and then which bits of it you’re slicing.

Below is one of the pics I posted before. The two longest (skinny) knives I’d guess at about 9” or 10”. And from memory were used to slice the main part of the ham where his hand is. The shorter slicing knives were used for other cuts where I’ve put the blue arrows.

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(n.b. It’s perfectly possible I’m talking nonsense here. I was really quite drunk at the time).
 
Whichever way; here’s a resounding success story, as I’ve managed to make the world’s first nice carbon steel jamon knife (@Rangen)...

Yesterday evening I did the resto of my friend’s old Sab slicer. I’ll probably do a proper WIP thread with some more pics, but here are a few to be getting on with.

Filled the massive gap between scale and tang. Rather surprisingly managed to straighten the huge bend out of the blade without heating it. Remade the profile. Re-did the geometry, thinning the f out of it all way up to the spine in order to increase flex. Polished out the fairly heavy grind marks. And sharpened.

It takes a wonderful edge. Even by my own lofty standards I’m pretty happy about this. :)

Before:

1D4BCAC7-142A-425B-A2C7-9ED5C1C5A99F.jpeg

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After:

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0935E84E-EF83-46D4-953B-159B153D4C2E.jpeg

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Is that the same handle or a new one? Did you just use a grinding wheel to change the profile? How much flex does that blade have?
 
I think this kinda depends on the ham itself, how you prep the leg initially, and then which bits of it you’re slicing.

Below is one of the pics I posted before. The two longest (skinny) knives I’d guess at about 9” or 10”. And from memory were used to slice the main part of the ham where his hand is. The shorter slicing knives were used for other cuts where I’ve put the blue arrows.

The first 2 knives, especially the 2nd one, are the most interesting. Do you know what brand these are? Why is the blade so long? Do you actually use the entire length of that blade? I'd assume reducing the actually thickness would have a bigger effect reducing drag than reducing the width, so why is it so narrow? I'd assume a wider blade would be more durable for the same thickness.
 
The first 2 knives, especially the 2nd one, are the most interesting. Do you know what brand these are? Why is the blade so long? Do you actually use the entire length of that blade? I'd assume reducing the actually thickness would have a bigger effect reducing drag than reducing the width, so why is it so narrow? I'd assume a wider blade would be more durable for the same thickness.


Note that I am not an expert in any of this. I’ve tried slicing jamon a total of one time, and I was not very good at it by any stretch of the imagination! Everything I’ve said in this thread is just hazy recollections from sitting in countless Andalucian bars, and occaisionally noting what’s going on behind them. My impressions may be (probably are) wildly inaccurate and/or misremembered, but fwiw...

Again I suspect the length of the knife likely depends on the ham itself; not just the cut, but also how long it’s been cured, how hard it is, the fat content. And also on the skill of the person carving; using the full length of a long knife could probably result in an ultimately cleaner and finer slice, but it’s gonna be way more difficult to use. The guy in my picture above is an award-winning-level jamon bloke. He could probably do it with a spoon!
 
Is that the same handle or a new one? Did you just use a grinding wheel to change the profile? How much flex does that blade have?


Same handle, just filled and sanded/shaped. It’s gutta percha rather than plastic, which is probably why it warped in the first place, though it does come up quite nicely in the end.

Profile was done on a belt, the subsequent thinning and geometry work on a horizontally spinning wheel running a 120 grit stone.

Something like this (it’s a slightly difficult thing to quantify or describe!)

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I ordered a Pallares 10" Ham Knife Carbon Boxwood, it should be a good start. I will have my cheap Costco knife that came with the first ham, and if I order a higher end Costco Jamon, I will get a (slightly) better knife with it. This should give me a good idea of what the options are.
 
The ham arrived today. I prefer the Pallares to the knife that came with the ham, although both are adequate, and I can probably throw away the cheaper knife that came with the serrano. I am surprised how soft this ham is, especially compared to the Serrano also bought at Costco. In some ways, this makes slicing a bigger challenge, as I don't necessarily want to cut as thin as possible. I am also appreciating the length of these knives, as short sawing motions like the videos give a ragged piece of meat and longer stokes look (but don't taste) better. The ham is just under 17lbs, absolutely delicious, but unlike prosciutto. This is dark red, very rich and flavorful with almost a touch of sour note. Prosciutto is much more subtle. Thinking of how expensive these are, I can't help compare it to Japanese Wagyu and feel I got a better deal - 1 lbs of Jamon for $30 is a lot of Jamon and even 1 ounce per day is a lot. I overestimated the size of my fridge, so right now, this is in my pantry. I am hoping as the ham gets smaller and I move shelves around, I can fix that. Overall, I am very happy with this purchase, although I was a little disappointed to see the label say sugar was used in the curing process, which as far as I know, is not tradition. Still, this is less than half of what I'd pay for an Iberico Bellota on Tienda, and a stand was included. The stand is pine, and smells of pine sap, but the hardware is high quality. After this ham is gone, I might keep the stand hardware and upgrade the wood to maple, oak or walnut.
 
Way off the subject of knives, but should this be eaten with cheese? And if so, what type? I did splurge on a case of expensive Oloroso, which goes very well.
 
Gotta love Spanish supermarkets. Ham from 50€ up to 400€
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BTW if you buy whole piece, don't let it stay on the counter more than a couple of weeks, it dries out rather quickly. If in doubt you can always buy paleta - front leg should be about 4-5kg instead of 7-8.
 
Gotta love Spanish supermarkets. Ham from 50€ up to 400€
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BTW if you buy whole piece, don't let it stay on the counter more than a couple of weeks, it dries out rather quickly. If in doubt you can always buy paleta - front leg should be about 4-5kg instead of 7-8.
Anyone know of an equivalent in Germany? Mail order might be the way to go as I live out in the Sticks (sort of).
 
Probably most of the Spanish gourmet shops can send to Germany
Google jamón iberico envío a Europa
Shouldn't cost more than 30€
 
Last Christmas and New Year holiday season I sliced half boneless Parma ham and boneless Jamon Iberico. Ham stand is very useful and even more if you have bone in ham. I attached ham so that cutting surface is horizontal and cut like a single bevel knife so you can see the cut and have control for cutting.

Mazaki 305 mm sujihiki was very good. I didn’t try flexible slicer but maybe you have better control with stiff slicer.
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A professional at work in Madrid. His knife seems perfect for the task in hand. Skip to @11:00

 
A professional at work in Madrid. His knife seems perfect for the task in hand. Skip to @11:00


I’m wondering why flexible and long knife if you don’t use its flex and lenght? Seems to me that he cut short sawing motions with heel?
 
everyone should try Pata Negra one time in their life.
Expensive treat though.
Ham in my photo (75% iberico) was 170€. 100% feed exclusively acorns and the price shoots up to 500ish.

To clear the nomenclature:
Paleta - front leg
Jamón- hind

Jamón serrano - Common white pig (usually duroc)
Iberico - Spanish breed iberico (more marbling, better quality meat)
50/75/100% iberico - crossbreed or pure
Bellota - exclusively fed acorns (not exactly true as the pigs roam dehesa and eat what they see git, just acorns are the most common food)
Cebo - pigs fed feed

For people interested in buying a piece, Paleta is much smaller, however also relatively more difficult to cut
Difficult to get more than 35% of its weight in slices
With jamon even a lousy slicer like me can fairly easily get 50%

Buying a Cat in a bag - it's not uncommon to buy a jamon that has been overly cured, or is particularly fatty - it should never be a problem to exchange a faulty piece, even in the supermarket after opening it
 
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