Sequence after thinning?

[Seemore]

What is your sequence after thinning to check the outcome - polish then sharpen, or sharpen then polish? (Then cut a carrot).
I go to zero edge while (infrequently) thinning, then polish first, because I can’t imagine preserving the edge while polishing. Then I sharpen, it doesn’t take much, starting with 3-4K. But I usually need to go back for more thinning, thereby starting the rather long operation all over again.
This refers to knives convex BTE.

 

[Bear]

After thinning I try to do some test cuts, carrot, onions, whatever, if it needs more I just go back at it. I can usually tell even if it hasn't been sharpened, I try not to completely remove that original edge anyway.

 

[Benuser]

I can't imagine thinning and polishing not having an impact on the edge. Have seen too often a burr appearing where the very edge remained untouched. Sharpen it the next day.

 

[Choppin]

I usually do the heavy lifting on a 200 grit or so stone (currently a Debado 180). When I feel I'm about 70% done, geometry wise, I jump to a SG500 for "final" adjustments. When the geometry is done on the SG500, #200 scratches are also removed. I then use a 1-2k stone to remove SG500 scratches and finally I sharpen the edge on the same stone. Then go cut some carrots.

The finish from coarse stones is too grabby and can feel wedgy, so I like polishing up to 1-2k before testing. Just a quick lazy polish to improve the grabby feeling.

On most knives I try to thin hamaguri-style, so your experience with a zero grind might be different. Also, just before thinning I like to lightly sharpen on a ˜4k stone, just enough to create a visual bevel. As I thin, that bevel gets smaller and smaller, so I use it as a visual guide to how thin I want the BTE area (on a zero grind you erase the bevel completely).

 

[Choppin]

I usually do the heavy lifting on a 200 grit or so stone (currently a Debado 180). When I feel I'm about 70% done, geometry wise, I jump to a SG500 for "final" adjustments. When the geometry is done on the SG500, #200 scratches are also removed. I then use a 1-2k stone to remove SG500 scratches and finally I sharpen the edge on the same stone. Then go cut some carrots.

The finish from coarse stones is too grabby and can feel wedgy, so I like polishing up to 1-2k before testing. Just a quick lazy polish to improve the grabby feeling.

On most knives I try to thin hamaguri-style, so your experience with a zero grind might be different. Also, just before thinning I like to lightly sharpen on a ˜4k stone, just enough to create a visual bevel. As I thin, that bevel gets smaller and smaller, so I use it as a visual guide to how thin I want the BTE area (on a zero grind you erase the bevel completely).

Forgot to continue...

If I'm happy with the performance, I go back to the 1-2k stone for a more careful polish, then continue my polishing progression (usually Gesshin 6000 + suita). And finally I resharpen, back to the 1-2k stone and continuing to whatever suits the knife best.

 

[Seemore]

I usually do the heavy lifting on a 200 grit or so stone (currently a Debado 180). When I feel I'm about 70% done, geometry wise, I jump to a SG500 for "final" adjustments. When the geometry is done on the SG500, #200 scratches are also removed. I then use a 1-2k stone to remove SG500 scratches and finally I sharpen the edge on the same stone. Then go cut some carrots.

The finish from coarse stones is too grabby and can feel wedgy, so I like polishing up to 1-2k before testing. Just a quick lazy polish to improve the grabby feeling.

On most knives I try to thin hamaguri-style, so your experience with a zero grind might be different. Also, just before thinning I like to lightly sharpen on a ˜4k stone, just enough to create a visual bevel. As I thin, that bevel gets smaller and smaller, so I use it as a visual guide to how thin I want the BTE area (on a zero grind you erase the bevel completely).

By hamaguri-style, do you mean two distinct sections, blade road and cutting edge, with a little blend where they meet?

I think I adopted the zero-grind-while-thinning method because I (maybe mistakenly?) think I’m removing the least amount of blade height by ultimately sharpening on one finer stone, two at the most. Also, even after more than a year of practice, I get better longer lasting edges the fewer stones in my progression.
I should mention that the gear and the practice are good with me, but the real joy is cooking with sharp knives.

 

[M1k3]

Before thinning, I'll dull the edge a little.

After thinning on the coarse stone, I'll hit the blade face with some 1k sandpaper a little bit. Just to reduce the extreme grabbiness. If I'm happy, I'll go up to my highest grit stone, then I'll use a sandpaper progression. I'm not a stone polisher whatsoever.

Then sharpen.

 

[Benuser]

Before thinning, I'll dull the edge a little.

What is the idea behind it? Safety?

 

[M1k3]

What is the idea behind it? Safety?

Yes, safety. Learned the hard way.

 

[Choppin]

By hamaguri-style, do you mean two distinct sections, blade road and cutting edge, with a little blend where they meet?

Pretty much, yeah. Calling it hamaguri is a stretch, lol. I just use Jon’s approach here, but adapted to double bevel knives with convex grinds.

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co...ingle-bevel-sharpening-hamaguri-and-beta-togi
I recently did that to a Misono gyuto. I start by laying the blade road “flat” on the stone, as if it was a single bevel. Here I’m hitting the shoulder, let’s call it the equivalent to the upper part of a hamaguri grind. I put pressure on top of the shoulder and use a very subtle rocking motion with my right wrist to keep the convexity there (lowering the spine like 2 degrees or so… very very gentle).

Then I put pressure near the edge and rock to the opposite direction (raising the spine), again very subtle. Here I’m thinning the lower part of the blade road (first 5-10mm).

Since I’m using a rocking motion, there are no facets to blend. On thinner blades like Misono I find this easier. On thicker sanmai knives I do basically the same thing but no rocking, just changing pressure like Jon’s technique.

I’ve done zero grind thinning but I find it easy to overdo and end up with a foil edge. I blame it on my technique of course.

 

[Seemore]

Pretty much, yeah. Calling it hamaguri is a stretch, lol. I just use Jon’s approach here, but adapted to double bevel knives with convex grinds.

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co...ingle-bevel-sharpening-hamaguri-and-beta-togi
I recently did that to a Misono gyuto. I start by laying the blade road “flat” on the stone, as if it was a single bevel. Here I’m hitting the shoulder, let’s call it the equivalent to the upper part of a hamaguri grind. I put pressure on top of the shoulder and use a very subtle rocking motion with my right wrist to keep the convexity there (lowering the spine like 2 degrees or so… very very gentle).

Then I put pressure near the edge and rock to the opposite direction (raising the spine), again very subtle. Here I’m thinning the lower part of the blade road (first 5-10mm).

Since I’m using a rocking motion, there are no facets to blend. On thinner blades like Misono I find this easier. On thicker sanmai knives I do basically the same thing but no rocking, just changing pressure like Jon’s technique.

I’ve done zero grind thinning but I find it easy to overdo and end up with a foil edge. I blame it on my technique of course.

Thank you for the details and link.