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Most people in the United States won't witness or be involved in a violent crime, any crime for that matter. ( Can't say what the stats are) I think the world press doesn't paint the prettiest picture.
 
AFKitchenknivesguy said:
the majority of registered firearms in the US are owned by a small number of people
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This is a slight overstatement. there are about 300,000,000 firearms owned by something like 100,000,000 people. More than a "small number of people" by far....but a definite minority, which I think was the main point.

Also, the likelihood of owning a firearm goes up quite a bit with your distance from a major city. (i.e. ownership is skewed towards less densely populate areas.)
 
Hmm

Nr 2 worldwide
Pretty selfe to me
http://www.divinecaroline.com/31/82437-world-s-ten-safest-countries-visit/3

Canadian said:
Attributing a low crime rate (or a healthy society in general) to strict gun control laws is unacademic.

Denmark might have a moderate crime rate (it's not low by any standard), it has one of the highest suicide rates in the world...

I guess what i am getting at is that the prevalence of firearms does not dictate how screwed up the socio-economic situation is, and that's what Maxim is hinting at.

In small town Canada people also leave there doors unlocked, keys in the ignition, etc. But I guarantee you most people lock their doors in Copenhagen...
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Salty dog said:
Most people in the United States won't witness or be involved in a violent crime, any crime for that matter. ( Can't say what the stats are) I think the world press doesn't paint the prettiest picture.
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exactly. there aren't any news stories about how ~299,990,000 firearms weren't used to commit a crime today.

Movies don't help either...
 
Thanks guys very nice comments i undestand much more now :D
 
...to protect ourselves from the police.

I've been wronged myself more than once.

I've also witnessed a violant crime more than once...

Paint the pictures how you want to. White America is relatively safe. Grow to in the hood, and you will have battle scars.
 
maxim said:
Hmm

Nr 2 worldwide
Pretty selfe to me
http://www.divinecaroline.com/31/82437-world-s-ten-safest-countries-visit/3
Click to expand...


Sorry, but "divine caroline" is not the authoritative source on this subject.

Check interpol website. The Danes have a higher burglary and auto-theft rate relative to the US. Moreover, violent crime is on the rise...

I'm not trying to make this a pissing contest. I'm just stating the facts. Guns really have nothing to do with violent crimes other than the fact that they can be used to aid them or to prevent them, but so can a chef's knife...
 
Dave Martell said:
I wanted to ask you gun toting folks what your opinion is on the great hand gun caliber debate. Do you go 9mm, .40 S&W, or .45 ACP.....what's your preference and why?

Oh and I realize that this can turn into a religious/political type debate very easily but I'd appreciate cool heads here. Thanks :)
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.45acp. Owned/shot handguns for 30+years. Sold my favorite/last gun – a Colt Commander, about 5 years ago. Recently met the “new” owner for the 1st time since he bought it. He is very happy with the gun and suggested I join him at the range so I just did. That Colt Commander still feels really good and I shot ok but I am done with hand guns. Then I got invited to shoot skeet - 1st time for me and actually hit a few targets. Never interested in long guns but now know how beautiful some o/u shotguns are!...:cool2:
 
I agree :) Lets not make it in to contest.
And i am not saying what right or wrong here, i have no problem with guns at all

But i talking about how safe i feel not much how many burglary there is. Police do they job very well and i think in 3 years here in DK we had like 1 unsolved homicide.
Please see it from my point of view i dont know any people or heard of any people where they say ohh i wish we had guns legal here or i wish i had a gun to protect my self, its actually other way around reduce as many firearm as posible.

I know it is very different in some counties where guns is legal.


Canadian said:
Sorry, but "divine caroline" is not the authoritative source on this subject.

Check interpol website. The Danes have a higher burglary and auto-theft rate relative to the US. Moreover, violent crime is on the rise...

I'm not trying to make this a pissing contest. I'm just stating the facts. Guns really have nothing to do with violent crimes other than the fact that they can be used to aid them or to prevent them, but so can a chef's knife...
Click to expand...
 
I can see how gun carrying looks crazy to most people. I used to myself think that this was sort of stupid and unnecessary thing to do and I always figured that I'd never do that. I changed my mind a lot in the recent years when my kids came along and as I've got older and lost the sense of invincibility that I once had.
 
i got my carry permit for when i go to shows. sepending on the show i might have quite a bit of $ and knives work more $ . while i woudl liek to think its only $ and if i woudl get robbed it woudl not be a big deal cause i can make more. fact is that if i lost a full shows worth of money i coulld not pay bills or buy more steel and wood to keep making $ i woudl likly loose everything in one fail swoop
 
Get what u can shoot comfortably. Statistically, most handgun rounds larger than a .22 take one point something, so call it two, shots to stop the bad guy. There's a huge statistically very significant improvement in stopping reliability when you move to a 20 gauge shotgun or a deer rifle. Best source for factual, sober advice on such things is on Grant Cunningham's website. He's a revolversmith and arms instructor in Oregon. His recommendation for a first hand gun for protection is the Glock 19.
 
I'm to old school, I like big slow bullets. 5 shot 44spcl is my all time choice.

For me a high capacity 9 would sit in the cabinet doing no one any good. I have always had an affinty for revolvers and never could shoot autos with any comfort. If you have to carry I feel it needs to be something you are willing to put up with and can shoot properly when thinking is to slow for what is happening around you, and for me that is a revolver.

I have nothing against people using autos and heck the big wigs that do this for a living all push the auto, they just don't work for me...
 
There have been six mass shootings in Wisconsin in the last five years. The Sikh Temple shooting was ten minutes from me and. the most recent incident at the beauty salon is in an area I frequent often.

Those kinds of things make me a little paranoid. I can keep myself out of trouble if I choose but this random crazy stuff is scary.
 
dave, kelly loves her 9mm and does not have a problem with my 45 but since mine is a hair smaller and lighter its a bit more snappy both fit the same holsters (her G19 and my G36) we both have glock tec MIC holster that are great for low pro carry

for me i jsut dont liek 40 cal and if i was going inbetween it woudl be 357sig i say 9MM and lots of ammo or 45acp (guess you could get the 45GAP but i hve sno problem with the grip size on my G36, the G21 on the other hand is like grabbing a 4x4 post (boy is it a soft shooter tho )
 
Dave,
Did you ever pickup a handgun? I used to shoot IDPA and my carry guns are SIG P239 in 9mm and a Ruger GP100 .357. As far as ammo, Federal Hydra-shok for the SIG and my the last of my Winchester BlackTalon in the Ruger. Let me know if you want to go out shooting sometime. -Doug
 
I too am a .45 guy. If the 50AE weren't so expensive I'd rather carry that. Why? I'm a big bore snob. I like a big heavy slow moving bullet that makes a big hole and digs a long slow hole all the way through, crushes bone, punches through armor and makes the target "feel" the punch. There is real shock value in it that a smaller faster caliber doesn't have.

It suffers from a larger overall gun (normally), lower capacity (fewer bullets) and more recoil.

Smaller guns, the smallest of carries, also have few bullets, but are usually of smaller caliber, lower power, but less recoil (easier firing and follow up shots) and are easier to carry.

My #2 is a Charter Arms .44 Special Bulldog.
 
Speaking of the Sikh temple shooting: The first responding PO was shot 12 times with a Springfirld Armory 9mm XDM.
He survived with his greatest wound being the first he recieved, one in the face that traveled through his neck. The last shot the gunman took at him was from 10 feet away and it was a shot to the back of the head. (Was not his worse wound)

I want to know what ammo he was using? I'm also guessing that last shot was a "glancing" shot to the head. It actually made me re-think 9mm.
 
He also took three center mass to the vest. I suppose that would have taken care of most vestless evil doers.
 
Salty dog said:
He also took three center mass to the vest. I suppose that would have taken care of most vestless evil doers.
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Probably so. The question is, how long would it take to take care of him. Long enough for him to get really irritated and take you with him? A .45 usually solves that problem.
 
Mark me down as being staunch member of the .45 ACP fraternity. Shot competitively in the early days of the Southwest Pistol League and having been baptised in the Church of Jeff Cooper, I suppose it was inevitable. My carry piece is a Les Baer Thunder Ranch Special, although I must confess that in hot weather I somtimes just slip a S&W 642-1 into my pocket. :O

I've shot a few big, mean, and nasty critters while hunting in Africa, which only served to reinforce my belief that a large caliber, heavy bullet traveling at moderate velocity is the best way to end a fight in a hurry. What works on a cape buffalo ought to work on bad guy.
 
I carry a Glock .40 with police issues hollows inside. I bought it from an ex-sheriff for a ri-diculous deal, and I have issues with passing ri-diculous deals. There - no religion or politics involved, and probably even non-pc.
 
Round count + Caliber are not all that important, it's about about location. Here's a decent article that talks a little about it: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/03/nyregion/03shot.html?_r=1&

I wouldn't go smaller than 9mm/.38SPL though, below that the energies are too low to pass the FBI protocol...actually those rounds don't even have enough energy to splatter when firing ball ammo at a steel plate (the exception to that being 22lr).
 
geezr said:
.45acp. Owned/shot handguns for 30+years. Sold my favorite/last gun – a Colt Commander, about 5 years ago. Recently met the “new” owner for the 1st time since he bought it. He is very happy with the gun and suggested I join him at the range so I just did. That Colt Commander still feels really good and I shot ok but I am done with hand guns. Then I got invited to shoot skeet - 1st time for me and actually hit a few targets. Never interested in long guns but now know how beautiful some o/u shotguns are!...:cool2:
Click to expand...

If you enjoyed skeet - try to get out on a sporting clays course. It is a heck of a lot more fun and requires a lot more skill.
 
One last bit from me, this one on the gun rights questions from our non-American friends. Don't confuse "need" with "right." At the simplest level everyone has the "right" to defend themselves, as well as others, and their property, which we also have a right to (property). The right to own firearms has nothing to do with the need for safety, feeling in danger, or even an intended purpose like hunting, targeting or sport. As a right, not a privilege or an allowance, the idea is that it can not and should not be hindered by the government or anyone else who would want to limit the people's ability to defend themselves. The reality is not so pure, as there are many, in the government and among the people, who would welcome the hindrance, or outright refusal, of our rights to be an armed people. Some are simply misinformed, or have been conditioned against it. Others are less innocent, individuals or groups who would welcome an unarmed, and therefore undefended, public.

In short, of all our human rights, the right to defend ourselves, against all others including the government itself, is also the right to defend all the other rights we live by, the right to speak freely, the right to vote, the right to live. Without the right to bear arms, all other rights are vulnerable to a government who would wish to restrict all the other rights we have.
 
DwarvenChef said:
I'm to old school, I like big slow bullets. 5 shot 44spcl is my all time choice.

For me a high capacity 9 would sit in the cabinet doing no one any good. I have always had an affinty for revolvers and never could shoot autos with any comfort. If you have to carry I feel it needs to be something you are willing to put up with and can shoot properly when thinking is to slow for what is happening around you, and for me that is a revolver.

I have nothing against people using autos and heck the big wigs that do this for a living all push the auto, they just don't work for me...
Click to expand...

I love my 357 magnum Ruger blackhawk myself. I can hit just about anything with it up to a 100 yards, that's right 100yards. Trained by men who learned from Elmer Keith back in the day. I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with an auto. Hell, I might not be able to hit anything with the Ruger it's been so long since I hit the range. at least 10 years. man, that sucks.
 
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