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Last night...hostess files a complaint that the kitchen crew stares at her and makes her feel uncomfortable when she walks through the kitchen...she generally wears the shortest mini skirts, low cut crop tops or booty shorts full of rips with her cheeks hanging out! Now I have zero tolerance for lewd, inappropriate or offensive behavior and expect my team to behave as gentleman and ladies when we have company in the kitchen, but really...!?! You're just looking for attention when you dress a certain way and if it comes by way of someone you don't like, a creepy looking person or someone that doesn't speak English it's a problem.
 
^^ This, the hostesses where I work, dress pretty loosely
 
lumo said:
Last night...hostess files a complaint that the kitchen crew stares at her and makes her feel uncomfortable when she walks through the kitchen...she generally wears the shortest mini skirts, low cut crop tops or booty shorts full of rips with her cheeks hanging out! Now I have zero tolerance for lewd, inappropriate or offensive behavior and expect my team to behave as gentleman and ladies when we have company in the kitchen, but really...!?! You're just looking for attention when you dress a certain way and if it comes by way of someone you don't like, a creepy looking person or someone that doesn't speak English it's a problem.
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Lumo, it still doesn't give you to act on your judgement. To judge is human nature. Hey it's a pretty strong survival skill. The difference is when you decide to act. Just because I ain't down with someone's attire when they wear their paints under their asses in public. I try not to remind them their a dumb ass. I'm successful at this task most of the time ;-)

At Bush Gardens this weekend I saw so many people with huge discs in their ears. Some an inch in diameter. This is voluntary in 2016 but Even though it that ain't my thing, I say to each their own.
 
Yeah, I hate to say it, but some of the other comments smack of the ****** old 'She was asking for it' crap. I'm covered in tattoos. Which doesn't give you a license to blatantly stare, or worse actually walk up and grab my arm so you can get a better look(which has happened on more than one occasion).
On Monday I went swimming on a lake, that is reasonably public, and has some more secluded spots that can accommodate a few people to store their belongings and hang out comfortably. A female couple showed up right next to our spot with a very friendly and delightful dog in tow while I and my friends were enjoying the water. They commenced to strip down naked unabashedly and hopped in the water, and swim around for a bit. SOMEHOW, the 3 males in my group(as well as the one female), managed to not stare at them the entire time, or make ****** comments.
 
OK, barging in on a pro thread again :(... just wondering why the middle ground of "none of their business what you display, none of yours how they look at it" has become so deserted in this and related discussions :) I always say, if I was, for example, wearing a t shirt of a boxing gym, I would totally have to expect strangers to approach and want to have a friendly chat about boxing, maybe even state an unambigously friendly and optional challenge.. that no license is implied to threaten or attack me should be so obvious...
 
Why doesn't management simply impose a dress/grooming code and enforce it?
If you allow or encourage your staff to project a certain image, then deal with the fallout.

Certain cultures have carried this 'individualism' too far. "Do as thou wilt" and expect no reaction? I call BS.
Wanna swim naked in public because it's you 'right'? It's my right to observe absolutely anything in my field of vision. Don't like it? Buy a swimsuit. And wear it.
Got lots of ink/piercings/etc.? Expect stares or even comments. Or cover it up. I do when the situation requires it. It's an individual's choice to display to whatever degree the bodily modifications they've made. Why should somebody else's rights be infringed upon because you don't like the attention it draws?

Not to single out Josh or alienate him, but there's a huge gap between eyeballing someone who's (by choice) scantily clad and sexual assault.
 
Doing the catering for a corporate event at a castle, using a 500 year old cellar as a make-shift kitchen, head-chef is having a go at one of the preppers for whatever reason (too busy doing my own thing), he turns around, tells chef to stuff his job, throws his apron at him, storms out the door, smacks his head on the lower than normal door frame and knock himself clean out.
 
ecchef said:
Why doesn't management simply impose a dress/grooming code and enforce it?
If you allow or encourage your staff to project a certain image, then deal with the fallout.

Certain cultures have carried this 'individualism' too far. "Do as thou wilt" and expect no reaction? I call BS.
Wanna swim naked in public because it's you 'right'? It's my right to observe absolutely anything in my field of vision. Don't like it? Buy a swimsuit. And wear it.
Got lots of ink/piercings/etc.? Expect stares or even comments. Or cover it up. I do when the situation requires it. It's an individual's choice to display to whatever degree the bodily modifications they've made. Why should somebody else's rights be infringed upon because you don't like the attention it draws?

Not to single out Josh or alienate him, but there's a huge gap between eyeballing someone who's (by choice) scantily clad and sexual assault.
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Fully agree! I'm sorry, but 99.9% of people dressing a certain way know that this will cause people to look. So you're either ok with that or you actually want to provoke this whole "don't you dare look at my you pig, even though I dress in a way that you really cannot look away".

And there's a difference between looking and staring for minutes, drooling, making remarks etc...

The other day I saw a 6'1ish woman with zebra print yoga pants and a sports bra in a store. The bra, I'm not even sure it was a sports bra. It was basically a super thin fabric, tight shirt that was cut off below the breasts. You could clearly see her boobs, and the nipples... And it was soooo see trough that you were able to make out the tattoo on her breast...

Ah, she was also wearing super high heels. EVERYONE in the store stared. Men, women, kids...
 
ecchef said:
Why doesn't management simply impose a dress/grooming code and enforce it?
If you allow or encourage your staff to project a certain image, then deal with the fallout.

Certain cultures have carried this 'individualism' too far. "Do as thou wilt" and expect no reaction? I call BS.
Wanna swim naked in public because it's you 'right'? It's my right to observe absolutely anything in my field of vision. Don't like it? Buy a swimsuit. And wear it.
Got lots of ink/piercings/etc.? Expect stares or even comments. Or cover it up. I do when the situation requires it. It's an individual's choice to display to whatever degree the bodily modifications they've made. Why should somebody else's rights be infringed upon because you don't like the attention it draws?

Not to single out Josh or alienate him, but there's a huge gap between eyeballing someone who's (by choice) scantily clad and sexual assault.
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I agree on your last point, and I wasn't trying to say that was the case here by any means. It's just a tad lazy to imply the staff wasn't able to control themselves based on visual stimuli. I also agree with the dress code suggestion. Meant to bring it up in my prior post. And yes- I observed said naked swimmers, we all did. We just didn't ogle, or cat call.
 
You're right Josh, I should have addressed the "self control" topic. :spankarse: It is the flip side of the personal freedom coin for sure.
Didn't mean to come across as a d-bag. Maybe because my world is so regulated these days that I forget what the real world is like.
I probably go through more SAPR training in a year than most people do in a lifetime. And yet it doesn't seem very effective. There are always incidents...
 
ecchef said:
You're right Josh, I should have addressed the "self control" topic. :spankarse: It is the flip side of the personal freedom coin for sure.
Didn't mean to come across as a d-bag. Maybe because my world is so regulated these days that I forget what the real world is like.
I probably go through more SAPR training in a year than most people do in a lifetime. And yet it doesn't seem very effective. There are always incidents...
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No d-bag flags popped up in my view buddy:)
 
brainsausage said:
This was my point exactly. A modicum of self control, and a drop of couth goes a long way in my book.
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I'm sorry, but if I'm at the beach and a female couple strip down nude and head into the water, I'm treating it like a free strip club at the beach. It gets old after five, maybe ten minutes of staring anyways. I refuse to look while pretending that I'm not looking. Or worse, pretend that the pink elephant is not in the room. I call that a slippery slope.
 
Wait, I should ask...were the ladies in question attractive? From the looks of your story, it seems to me that they were either fat, or ugly, or both?
 
brainsausage said:
This was my point exactly. A modicum of self control, and a drop of couth goes a long way in my book.
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daveb said:
"Glance and look away."
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Agreed, agreed, like I said I expect my teams to act like gentleman, ladies and professionals. Not judging her negatively at all, she's actually very bright and pleasant.
We do ask staff to not wear their street clothes in the dining room or kitchen but things are a little looser while we go through orientation and preopening.
 
Chef Doom said:
Wait, I should ask...were the ladies in question attractive? From the looks of your story, it seems to me that they were either fat, or ugly, or both?
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I had some how forgotten how classy you are when it comes to discussing members of the (presumably) opposite sex.
 
lumo said:
Agreed, agreed, like I said I expect my teams to act like gentleman, ladies and professionals. Not judging her negatively at all, she's actually very bright and pleasant.
We do ask staff to not wear their street clothes in the dining room or kitchen but things are a little looser while we go through orientation and preopening.
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Where in Boston are you working(you can send a PM if you'd rather not post)? I'm gonna be down there next weekend with Panda...
 
ok back on topic....

The staff bathrooms here have the lights on timers. So so this server last night was caught in there with the lights out, frozen, junk in hand saying thank goodness someone came in and turned the lights on. I was afraid to p____ and didn't know how I'd get out of here!
 
i've been in position where professionalism is mandatory, but that's not really me. i'm a filterless not give a F kind of dude, so i should really find a restaurant that facilities such personalities (or the owner will look the other way while i instill a raucous culture).

so with that said, i'm with chef doom on this one.
 
Sorry but not sorry to barge in again - the idea of different workplaces having relevantly different cultures is so 90s, I guess it is considered a hallmark of worker oppression nowadays :) God forbid people choose to work or not work for a certain employer due to culture, it messes up the political image of all work being wage slavery with unified standards, and all workers being victims dependent on the oversight of politics for their salvation, up terribly.
And I say that as somebody with a lot of leftist and punk spice in his marinade. Ashamed of that fact these days.
 
Try and be anything but completely and utterly professional in a French kitchen. Dare ya. Once word gets around, you will not be hired anywhere.
 
PieMan said:
Try and be anything but completely and utterly professional in a French kitchen. Dare ya. Once word gets around, you will not be hired anywhere.
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I'm with PieMan on this one. Having worked in a few French Kitchens they are very disciplined. However, I believe if you pull through all the tough times you can learn a lot from French Chefs. They are very talented at least in my opinion.
 
JaVa said:
Our excecutive chef was making a mudcake and in his haste accidentally mixed in the dough white pepper powder instead of vanilla sugar. He didn't even realize his mistake before the first piece went out.
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An executive chef who A makes mudcake and B doesn't taste what he makes before serving to customers... how is he an executive anything? You guys Stateside sure love the word 'executive', even to describe just what Europeans would describe as a head chef. Over here, you're only Executive if you are supervising a chain of restaurants and hotels...
 
jbl said:
You guys Stateside sure love the word 'executive', even to describe just what Europeans would describe as a head chef. Over here, you're only Executive if you are supervising a chain of restaurants and hotels...
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You are very correct. I think it is an attempt to justify the salary exemption when often it is a very empty title. In the assisted living/retirement industry here in the states it is usually a hands on position pulling shifts with very little control over menu/hiring/firing. Not really what the overtime exemption law was made to cover. I agree with your definition.

Cheers,
rj
 
my understanding is that in europe everyone who isn't commis pay grade is considered a chef and can be referred to as such, here that would be a real faux pas or someone is taking the piss out of you if they are calling you chef and you're not.
 
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