Japanese or North American - who makes a better knife?

[l r harner]

go big or go lhome
http://forums.dfoggknives.com/index.php?showtopic=15046

 

[SpikeC]

Awesome!

 

[jackslimpson]

Wabi sabi is bull $hit. If I got a high end "wabi sabi" knife it would go back n a heart beat. That goes for gringos to.

So, is a forced or natural patina a "wabi-sabi" characteristic?

Cheers,

Jack

 

[Michael Rader]

Great thread. Very interesting.
-M

 

[Eamon Burke]

That wheel is amazing butch! But I have to say, you said something about having a platen that is curved to match the curvature of a 4' wheel, and that is a much more efficient, smart idea.

Forced patina is the opposite of a Wabi-Sabi ideal, Patina is a layer of moderate oxidation that protects the metal. The Statue of Liberty is coated in a kind of patina, and it's not exactly heading back to it's roots anytime soon. Kuro-Uchi would be an expression of this in visual/artistic terms, simply because of it's unfinished qualities.

 

[olpappy]

apples vs oranges

I would not compare a $200 Japanese mass produced knife like Takeda vs a high priced American custom knife like Kramer with a two yr wait list.

There are a few Japanese makers who make custom knives in the 'American' paradigm, among them are Itou, Hattori, Takeshi Saji, their knives are done in American style and the fit and finish are comparable to knives by American custom makers.

The more common Japanese knives are rustic, forged, clad with iron - no similar knives are made in USA except for Murray Carter, the Yoshimoto bladesmith who had the skills of village bladesmith passed to him, then moved to USA. Somewhere in Japan there is a village that has no one to make their forged tools...and a previous generation bladesmith who is likely kinda pissed off

sashae's excellent post hit the nail on the head, the Japanese ideal is quite different from the American concept. Which you find 'better' is a matter of your personal preferences. Most people can appreciate the good and bad points of both.

 

[Salty dog]

As far as a pure cutting machine the Masamoto honyaki gyuto is easily the best performer I have ever used. (For my style mind you) I know I have missed a couple American makers but I have most of them covered.

 

[sashae]

Thanks, olpappy. I'm not nearly as qualified as many of the folks here to decide on what should be the "platonic ideal" of the perfect knife -- even within that platonic ideal, there will be people who prefer a thicker or thinner blade, more or less belly, harder or softer steel, etc. It's fascinating to see how different US and Japanese ideals are though, in terms of what perfection is and how it's achieved. I find it amazingly compelling.

 

[RRLOVER]

Wabi Sabi:rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2: That makes me laugh every time.

 

[Salty dog]

yeah, I'm not going there.

 

[Michael Rader]

...Murray Carter, the Yoshimoto bladesmith who had the skills of village bladesmith passed to him, then moved to USA. Somewhere in Japan there is a village that has no one to make their forged tools...and a previous generation bladesmith who is likely kinda pissed off...

Ha ha. Come on. - I spit wine on my keyboard... damn-it
-M

 

[Chef Niloc]

Ha ha. Come on. - I spit wine on my keyboard... damn-it
-M

That's BS Murray Carter is 10 feet tall and spits fire Balls from his a$$, and if he was here now he'd tell you all that you can take his life, but you will never take his Egooooo.

 

[rockbox]

Ha ha. Come on. - I spit wine on my keyboard... damn-it
-M

I totally missed that. Thanks for quoting. That might be my sig for a while.

 

[BertMor]

Acutely given resent events I tack back what I sad. I have no preference to any maker, I think every knife is equally good.

Awwww come on Colin, you know your favorite knife is a Mike Stewart Bark Rver!