New Knife for Beginner from Australia

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daves88

Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
10
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0
LOCATION
What country are you in?
Australia



KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?

Chefs Knife

Are you right or left handed?

Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

Flexible

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?

210 mm (open to slightly bigger/smaller)

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)

Yes for maintenance purposes

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?

$150 AUD

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?

Home

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

Slicing/chopping meats and veggies.

What knife, if any, are you replacing?

First proper knife

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)

Learning as i go

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)

Learning as i go

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

Easy to use, wont break and will last awhile.

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?

Maybe something with a black handle, Damascus would be nice.


KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)

Looking for a matching board as well

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)

Looking for recommendations

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

All listed above!
 
Hi Dave. Just be aware that by convention, this forum operates in USD rather than AUD.

At this price point, damascus cladding will mean that you get less of everything else.

Having said that, if I were buying at this price point, I'd consider trying the Tanaka VG10 damascus. I'm a little hesitant to recommend it only because I haven't used it, but Tanaka's heat treatment of VG10 is said to be pretty good. The heat treatment of any steel is super important but it is said to be especially important for VG10, as a good heat treatment makes the deburring part of sharpening a lot less tedious with VG10 (which is notoriously tedious to deburr).

If you can stretch another 50 bucks or so, look at the Tanaka Ginsan Najishi Lite. The Lite version is not quite as well finished as the more expensive versions but it has the same steel and grind underneath. Most reports that I have read don't rate the fit and finish as a major issue (although most of these reports were from people fairly new to knives). Ginsan is one of the easiest stainless steels to sharpen and deburr (still not as easy as carbon steel, though), and edge retention is OK. The Najishi has a fairly curved profile (probably a lot less than what you are used to though). The knife is a wide bevel and it has a pearskin ("najishi") finish above the wide bevel, which I personally find quite attractive.

Both of the above are available at knivesandstones.com (aka KnS) which is in St Peters in Sydney.

On chopping boards- get something in timber (not bamboo, rubberwood or acacia), end grain if you can afford it. I use a large baord from choppablock, but they are not cheap. I use one of the KnS rubber boards as a meat board, which is also kind to edges.

On learning sharpening, I found the JKI and the knifeplanet.net series to be quite good. If you want to buy stones, you probably should do a "which stone should I buy" thread.
 
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Knives and stones is the best place for us to purchase from these days. Prices are very competitive for high quality knives and shipping is quick as well. The tanaka ginsan was one of my first knives and most used when learning to sharpen. The 210mm has a reasonably wide blade which I liked as I found a few 210mm knives to be too small for me (I generally go for 240mm and above now for the added length and they tend to be a fair bit wider in general too). You will end up paying a bit more than your budget for one now though.

If you absolutely can't blow more than $150 the tojiro dp series is a nice place to start. I would probably recommend the 240mm gyuto over the 210 as you get a lot more knife but if you're more comfortable with something smaller the 210 is still solid. This series is vg10 coated in softer stainless steel which means if you decide down the track to thin the knife out it will be fairly easy to do compared to a single steel blade. Factory edges on these seem to be pretty hit and miss.

The misono mv series (aus 8 steel) is also decent and has higher levels of fit and finish than the tojiro for a comparable price point. I have a 240mm which is oversized (255) so I imagine the 210 to be slightly bigger as well. Judging from the pictures it seems to have a wider blade at the heel (which I like personally) than a tojiro 210. It is a solid construction of aus 8 which makes thinning a bit more difficult, however the grind on this series seems to be pretty good so its not something you would have to worry about for a while. Its a fairly tough blade that won't damage easily. Factory edge is okay on these (if a little overbuffed) and pretty even (more so than the tojiro). Profile of my 240 seems to follow that of their carbon line of knives and the masamoto ks/sabatier (quite a french profile with the pointed tip).

Both are found on hocho-knife and are on special for the next 2 days for ~$100aud plus shipping. Be prepared to wait a while for delivery though.
 
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All advice above is good. Agree that to get damascus increases costs without much benefit at your price point. The only stainless damascus I can mention is the same as Nemos' suggestion: the Tanaka VG10 damascus clad 210mm gyuto - available from James at knivesandstones.com with a western handle (slightly over budget) or from metalmaster-ww.com in a Japanese handle (within budget, poorer F&F than James' offering and OOS at present). A caution - some say that VG10 is not a great steel for learning sharpening.

One other I have is the Gesshin 210 gyuto in AUS-8 from Jon at japaneseknifeimports.com. It comes with a rosewood handle and saya but is a little over budget after shipping - $159 (or $219 AUD). My wife's taken to it and it's a very good entry level 210 stainless knife.

Both James and John are vendors on this forum and are very helpful. Email them with your questions. I'll leave sharpening recommendations to others.
 
Thanks for the in-depth responses nemo, masibu & Marek07, i greatly appreciate it.

Damascus inst a deal breaker for me so i am happy to go without for this first purchase.

Do you guys find yourselves purchasing your knives locally or overseas more?

Nemo said:
If you can stretch another 50 bucks or so, look at the Tanaka Ginsan Najishi Lite. The Lite version is not quite as well finished as the more expensive versions but it has the same steel and grind underneath.
Click to expand...

Nemo this looks like a good option, I'm guessing when you refer to the finishing - you are talking about the handle?

There also doesn't seem to be a big price difference between the 210 & 240. Is this just size preference at the end of the day?

masibu said:
If you absolutely can't blow more than $150 the tojiro dp series is a nice place to start. I would probably recommend the 240mm gyuto over the 210 as you get a lot more knife but if you're more comfortable with something smaller the 210 is still solid. This series is vg10 coated in softer stainless steel which means if you decide down the track to thin the knife out it will be fairly easy to do compared to a single steel blade. Factory edges on these seem to be pretty hit and miss.
Click to expand...

This is also an option i have seen a few people mention before mainly around the price point. I'm kind of flexible as I'm a firm believer of doing things right the first time without regret. :)

Marek07 said:
Gesshin 210 gyuto in AUS-8 from Jon at japaneseknifeimports.com.
Click to expand...

I really like this option as well, price bumps up to $270 aussie if ive located the correct one. (Shipping appears to be the big killer)
 
daves88 said:
Do you guys find yourselves purchasing your knives locally or overseas more?

Nemo this looks like a good option, I'm guessing when you refer to the finishing - you are talking about the handle?

There also doesn't seem to be a big price difference between the 210 & 240. Is this just size preference at the end of the day?

I really like this option as well, price bumps up to $270 aussie if ive located the correct one. (Shipping appears to be the big killer)
Click to expand...

Most of my knives come from Aus. KnS is a great place to start. They have a prerty good range, good prices and I have found the service to be very good. Lots of great local knifemakers here too.

I agree that shipping from the USA can make it difficult to justify some options that would oterwise be very worthwhile considering. If it's any consolation, it can be even worse if you live in the bush.

JNS deliver free (and quickly) for orders over 1000 DKK (currently around 210 AUD).

Fit and finish can refer to the handle or how well the spine and choil are eased or even rounded (makes the pinch grip more comfortable). The finish on the blade face can also factor in fit and finish.

I have the non-lite version of the Tanaka Ginsanko Najishi, which I think makes a great value gateway knife. It could be the only knife you ever need (but of course, it won't be [emoji6] ).

Yes, at the end of the day, gyuto length is just preference. A 240 will do everything that a 210 does, but more of it. FWIW, the first gyuto I bought was 210 but my subsequent ones have all been 240-280. 240s also tend to be a bit easier to sell if it ever comes to that.
 
I used to buy more from overseas vendors when starting out about 6 years ago but the aussie dollar was worth a lot more then (more than the us dollar at one point) and the prices were lower as well. I was lucky enough to get some bargains early on which you cant really get anymore. Most of my recent purchases have come from k+s, jns or hocho knife as the total costs aren't too bad and any factory sharpening issues i can easily fix compared to when I was starting out

The tojiro dp is a commonly recommended knife but do be aware that it's not the most perfect and vg10 can be difficult for some to sharpen at first. They will come with acceptable sharpness but can do with a bit of a tune up. It's very much entry level for japanese blades and a good 'work' knife as it is fairly cheap. Having handled both the tojiro and misono I prefer the misono despite being of an "inferior" alloy but other people may think otherwise. It comes down to preferences really and unfortunately it's not the easiest to find stores that sell both lines so you can actually feel them in your hand to compare
 
I like the Natures Blue Moon at Japanese Chef Knife. It is a good cheaper first knife for several reasons. It is durable, thick spine gets thinner toward the edge with a tall 70/30 grind and is a good cutter. The Nashiji stainless clad with real chisel carved Kanji is a good looking blade. The core steel is Blue#2 carbon steel that is easy to sharpen for beginning students of free hand sharpening. Only the edge will patina so it is user friendly just wash and dry completely before storing.

98.00 for the 210mm and cheap 7.00 shipping from Japan to Down Under.
 
The Tojiro is an OK knife, but I'd choose the Tanaka vg10 dammy every time over it. The grind and steels heat treat are so much better.

And the Tanaka ginsan nashiji lite is a step up from that. Great value if you can stretch your budget. It can stand and bang in a much more expensive crowd toe to toe. The handle is very well made, but the spine and choil might need easing.
 
Marek07 said:
Regards the Gesshin AUS-8 210mm gyuto from JKI:
The price I quoted was what I paid last year. Seems the shipping charges have changed dramatically.
Click to expand...

Yeah... not something I have control over... all automatically done with dhl’s system... sorry [emoji17]
 
thanks for the feedback guys. I'll do a little more reading and post back when I've purchased :)
 
Took the plunge and purchased a Tanaka Ginsan Nashiji Gyuto 240mm - Lite from James at K&S. Great bloke with great advice.

Thanks for your help guys.

Cheers
 
Reporting back.... the knife has been a charm. It's made cooking more enjoyable.

Can anyone recommend a knife for slicing raw chicken/steaks/ugly bits off pork ribs?

Cheers
 
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