which zwilling j a henckel knives?

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I think one should note the differences between the branding; Zwilling being higher ended; Miyabi, a more accepted Japanese brand; Henckels, run of the mill; International, being garbage. No?
 
For whatever MY opinion is worth I have always preferred Wusthof to Henckels, and that because of functionality-the Tridents are better human engineered with respect to a natural knife stroke. Speaking as an old guy, many chefs of my generation would preach about their Zwillings being the "best" because of "ice temper"; I have it on pretty good authority that it is nonsense. On the other hand, I picked up a Global once, and put it RIGHT back down.

I was first exposed to quality Japanese cutlery working as a chef in Bermuda, many of the chefs in our Chinese restaraunt had a set of sushi knives; but then for daily use they had a thin blade cleaver, a thick one, and a long thin paring knife. Thong Chai and his cooks would laugh at me bringigng in a whole case of Tridents, particularly when I used a chukabocho as a line knife. (Still do!)

The point of all this rambling is that it is a matter of one's pont of view. I will always prefer Tridents for european-style knives, the fact that Wolfgang Wusthof himself presented me with a 8" Wide Cook's after attending one of my cooking classes has alot to do with that! Japanese cutlery is superior in many ways e.g. steel, workmanship in the case of hand-hammered blades, etc. but I would not use a damascus takobiki on the line during a dinner rush. Use what works best for you, and please limit the ad hominie attacks; live and let live, chefs! Remember our real enemies are the waiters!!!

Hax CLEAVERS RULE!!! :D
 
Nice post, Hax. You're on my good list! Hahaha
 
OMG, what have I done. I have ignited an outburst of criticism and quite frankly well deserved. First, my sincere apologies to BurkeCutlery. Although strongly disagree with him, I should have worded my comment in a different and civilized manner, instead of this ugly assault. Hope he will accept it. Then I apologize to the other members of the forum who felt insulted by my writing. Once again I am really, really sorry!
 
Tatletz said:
OMG, what have I done. I have ignited an outburst of criticism and quite frankly well deserved. First, my sincere apologies to BurkeCutlery. Although strongly disagree with him, I should have worded my comment in a different and civilized manner, instead of this ugly assault. Hope he will accept it. Then I apologize to the other members of the forum who felt insulted by my writing. Once again I am really, really sorry!
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Forgiven. That's big of you.

Why do you like Henckels? I mean the name brand lines. I might argue with you. :wink:
 
Thank you BurkeCutlery! Well, for about 2 years I have been using some cheap and poor quality set of knives that I had to sharpen after every single use(and not extensive one) and I got fed up. After some search on the net and local stores I found three brands which all had the same excellent reputation: Sabatier, Wusthoff and Zwilling J A Henckels, and quite similar prices with Wusthof being a couple of dollars more expensive in some shops then the others. Over the Christmas season one of the knife stores offered better discount on Henckels knives so I went for them. No particular reason though, it could have been any of the other two if given better discount then the Henckels. That's the story :)
 
What do you like about them?

I really do want to know. There are no wrong answers.
 
Ok, lets start with the points in your post;

1. Geometry - visually comparing them with other western brands they are quite similar in their shape, I don't think that Wusthof for instance are any different.
2. Heat Treat - apart from Friodur ice hardening process I don't know much
3. Edge quality(strictly sharpening job) - I am really amazed as how sharp they are, honing them with the steel provided is just for fun and not that is really needed
4. Design - Good enough for me as well as many others
5. Comfort - Very well balanced in my hand, lighting years away from the crap I was using before
6. Aesthetics - Don't see significant difference from other top brands.

And above all I am not a pro, just an enthusiast and have not used any other brand. Just forgot, l recently bought a Kasumi 20 cm Chefs knife.
 
Hi, and welcome to the forums :biggrin:. I am certainly no knife expert (just a home cook) and am rather new to the forums myself, however I do have experience with Henkels, having used a set of 4 stars for over 30 years. I thought they were just fine, having nothing to compare them to. About 2 months ago, after getting infected with the enthusiasm from the forum, I splurged on a new (gently used) knife for Christmas from the B/S/T section, one of the original DT ITK western Gyutos. I realize it was much more of a jump than most people are willing to make, but it was the best (or worst for my wallet) thing I ever did. For me, there is no comparison and no going back. I am slowly (well, as quickly as my knife orders are finished) replacing my knives and my Henkels sit in their block waiting for the day when they can move to the basement.
 
I happily used a Forschner 8" chef for 20+ years, and thought it just fine. Then I experienced a Takeda 210 gyuto and the old knife now just gets used to cut dog food rolls that have bits of bone in them. Until you experience the difference you just can not understand what the chat is about!
 
Tatletz said:
Ok, lets start with the points in your post;

1. Geometry - visually comparing them with other western brands they are quite similar in their shape, I don't think that Wusthof for instance are any different.
2. Heat Treat - apart from Friodur ice hardening process I don't know much
3. Edge quality(strictly sharpening job) - I am really amazed as how sharp they are, honing them with the steel provided is just for fun and not that is really needed
4. Design - Good enough for me as well as many others
5. Comfort - Very well balanced in my hand, lighting years away from the crap I was using before
6. Aesthetics - Don't see significant difference from other top brands.

And above all I am not a pro, just an enthusiast and have not used any other brand. Just forgot, l recently bought a Kasumi 20 cm Chefs knife.
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What do you think of the Kasumi?

What did to switch to Henckels from? Were you using Farberware or Chicago Cutlery or what?
 
BurkeCutlery said:
What do you think of the Kasumi?

What did to switch to Henckels from? Were you using Farberware or Chicago Cutlery or what?
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Kasumi is amazingly sharp, and the damascus patern is just captivating. Very comfortable and a real pleasure to use. Before Henckels I had Bruno Barontini knives(bet you never heard about them). Australian design and China made from poor quality steel with virtually non existing edge retention. At one point I was thinking to buy Jamie Oliver set of knives, but somehow "Made in China" put me off(hope I don't offend someone).
 
If you are truly in love with Henckels and want to find a knife that is a true joy to use, see if you can find a vintage carbon steel chef Knife A Grand Prize 1900 model 102 and then you will know what made Henckels famous. This new stuff is shite compared to them.
 
Ahhhhh, com on guys why are you so against Henckels? I am currently using them and so far I must say they are brilliant. Well, I am not a rich man(unfortunately) so can't afford the joy of buying all the famous knife brands and compare them myself.
 
Tatletz said:
Ahhhhh, com on guys why are you so against Henckels? I am currently using them and so far I must say they are brilliant. Well, I am not a rich man(unfortunately) so can't afford the joy of buying all the famous knife brands and compare them myself.
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not against Henckels at all, i truly love the antique and vintage ones over any of the new ones. They feel better in the hand and take an edge that today's can only dream about. My first chef knife was a Henckels classic and that one is way better than today's version of the same knife. Go with what you love and can afford. Everyone's opinion is just that.
 
Tatletz said:
Ahhhhh, com on guys why are you so against Henckels?
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They're just not good. Steel is too soft to hold any kind of edge over 500-1000 grit. They're just blunt, heavy objects with no balance that bruise and crush through food. This goes for Wusthoff, Messermiester etc... I've had many and no longer use any of them save for opening tin cans with.

Good Japanese steel can be had for cheaper than you might think. Give us your budget for at least 1 Gyuto and we will point you in the right direction. I promise your life will change forever!
 
Tatletz said:
Ahhhhh, com on guys why are you so against Henckels? I am currently using them and so far I must say they are brilliant. Well, I am not a rich man(unfortunately) so can't afford the joy of buying all the famous knife brands and compare them myself.
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Don have to spend that much!! I was using henkels and thought they were like the best ever until I switched. U WILL feel the difference, trust me. And there are good Japanese knives to be had for the price of a henkels 4 star or cermax.. At least that was the case when I started switching earlier this year.
 
ThEoRy said:
They're just not good. Steel is too soft to hold any kind of edge over 500-1000 grit. They're just blunt, heavy objects with no balance that bruise and crush through food. This goes for Wusthoff, Messermiester etc... I've had many and no longer use any of them save for opening tin cans with.

Good Japanese steel can be had for cheaper than you might think. Give us your budget for at least 1 Gyuto and we will point you in the right direction. I promise your life will change forever!
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I have a Gyuto=> Kasumi 20cm damascus made by Sumikama Cutlery in Seki City Japan. So sharp, I am afraid to hold it:)justkidding:) Really very comfortable and a pleasure to use it.
 
Well, I agree that Kasumi seems to be sharper than Henckels(out of the box) and retain the edge for longer. But if I feel that the german one can not slice through a sheet of paper freely, all it takes is a few strokes on the steel unlike the japanese one that requires to soak the stone. So there are pros and cons, nothing is perfect.
 
That is very true, and totally valid--that there is a way of doing knives that says to make them tough and soft and hit the hone regularly. The problem is that a great heat treat on a hard knife can mean that a knife will go a few weeks without a touch up at home, and a few days in a pro kitchen, and a proper touchup on a strop or rod can bring back the edge in a fairly sturdy condition. Combine that with the lackluster bevel geometry of most euro knives(Henckels included), and it's hard to prefer it.

I find them to be uncomfortable because the spines are sharp on them ootb. They are often either flat ground or carelessly convexed from spine to edge without regard to the profile taper. The profile is not carefullly considered for tip placement, knuckle clearance, and cut completion, but more for style and aesthetics, with a general swoop being considered all that is needed. The heat treat on them does not bring out a knife that is any better in performance than the worst of all carbon steels(I've made and used an un-heat-treated carbon steel kitchen knife out of a machete, and it will shave arm hair off a 1200 grit rod too).

I don't think poorly of the "softer, serviceable edge" thing, I grew up with Sabatiers I still like a ton. But Henckels isn't nailing it. That is what I was venting about originally.
 
Interesting, I never knew this stuff. Just being a home enthusiast cook who was so happy with his new set of knives, until visited this website. Now all my happiness and joy are shattered down the drain :sad0:(just kidding). Anyway, what do you think about this site?: http://japanesechefsknife.com/default.html
 
You can order from Japanese Chefs Knife with confidence. The operator (Koki) is knowledgeable and responsive. Large selection of quality knives and cheap, fast, reliable shipping from Japan.
 
Thank you Johnny.B.Good, I should have joined this forum long ago :doublethumbsup: . Just busy reading on the net about my favorite singer Whitney Houston's passing( I know it's not related to this discussion, but only a human thing). I was interested in buying a santoku knife from them.
 
If you're starting out, certainly quality over quantity... and don't worry about getting all knives from the same series or even manufacturer.

I'd say you want 2 knives at the outset, and 4 in the mid-term.

Here are my suggestions on a starter set in order of acquisition priority:
Gyuto / Chef 200 - 250mm Does 90% of the cutting, slicing and chopping
Paring 60 - 100mm For on and off-board cutting (a.k.a. "in hand")
Utility / Petty 100 - 160mm General purpose and for slicing, relatively shallow blade
Serrated 150 - 300mm For crusty foods, including bread

Many other people with far more expertise have commented on steel choices and manufacturers, so I won't comment further there.
 
Guys I will need your help. While sharpening my chef's knife on the stone I got a few bruises above the edge. As not experienced yet I was probably holding it at a too narrowed angle to the stone. I would appreciate it if you could give me some advice on removing them if possible :thankyou:
 
Tatletz said:
Guys I will need your help. While sharpening my chef's knife on the stone I got a few bruises above the edge. As not experienced yet I was probably holding it at a too narrowed angle to the stone. I would appreciate it if you could give me some advice on removing them if possible :thankyou:
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Actually it was more likely from 'wobbling' while sharpening. When you wobble you aren't holding your knife at one angle throughout your sharpening strokes, and you can get those sharpening scuffs. Everyone gets them in the beginning, don't worry about it.

If you want to get them out you can polish them out with automotive sandpaper lubricated with dishwashing soap. It helps if you back the sandpaper with something and only move the sandpaper in one direction (I move from heel to tip.)
 
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