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welshstar said:
The DT knives are great but for a stock knife a 50% increase seems very steep.

Do people like Marko, Dave M, Mike Davis etc lose money when they make a 240 knife ? it seems to me as a layman that these makers put more custom effort into one of their knives, especially in terms of F&F. I can see the DT knives being great knives but they do not have the f&f to justify a 50% hike

If CTKG can get these higher prices though and still sell out then why wouldnt they, will be interesting to see if the used ones go up now with people trying to cash in.

Alan
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Did you read Devin's comment? He's going to put more work into each knife making them better than they were previously therefore justifying the increase.
 
It must just be me

Im just struggling to recall the last time i got a 50% pay rise, oh hang on that was never !!! Ill try telling my boss on Monday that im going to work harder and put in more effort so I should get a 50% raise !!

Whats the next thread " why Kramers are great value at $6000"
 
welshstar said:
Do people like Marko, Dave M, Mike Davis etc lose money when they make a 240 knife ? it seems to me as a layman that these makers put more custom effort into one of their knives, especially in terms of F&F. I can see the DT knives being great knives but they do not have the f&f to justify a 50% hike
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Do you own one of Devin's knives Alan? Do you own a knife made by Dave, Marko, or Mike? You talk pretty confidently about the fit and finish provided by all of these makers, so I assume you have at least handled a knife or two from all of them. Obviously someone thinks Devin's knives have the "f&f to justify a 50% hike" or the increase wouldn't be happening. And the market will decide if it is a good idea, not the "layman" commenter. If they sell out at the new price, I would consider the hike justified.
 
welshstar said:
It must just be me

Im just struggling to recall the last time i got a 50% pay rise, oh hang on that was never !!! Ill try telling my boss on Monday that im going to work harder and put in more effort so I should get a 50% raise !!

Whats the next thread " why Kramers are great value at $6000"
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Go over to KF and read the thread in the CKTG vendor sub forum. Part of the price increase is because Devin can make more money doing high-end customs than he can the ITKs. It's a reflection of what his time is worth, and it seems as if there's a whole lot of his time that goes into making an ITK, and all the increase is doing is adjusting the ITK price in line with this.

Or, to put it another way, it's like your boss deciding to have you work on project 'X' that returns 50% more profit that project 'Y'. He'll put you back on 'Y' if he can raise the price of project 'Y' to compete with 'X', otherwise, project 'Y' will not go forward. It's just business.
 
Wasn't there Misono 50% price increase recently? Didn't Japanese knife prices go through a roof in the last 5 years (Nenox, Watanabe, Takeda to mention a few) some by as much as 100%?

So, for ITK knives to increase price by 50% in two years, from a starting price that was fairly low for semi-custom knives doesn't sound excessive.

I got to add that I hope they sell out as quickly as Devin can make them, for these are not factory-made, mid-tech labeled knives, they have better heat treatment (in-house) than majority knives on the market, and they perform. The finish will be better but fit has always been fairly good, or on par with higher priced Japanese.


M
 
I do not own knives made by Marko or Dave

I do own knives made by Mike and I have had a DT ITK 270 but sold it because I was not a big fan, it wasnt a quality issue I just never clicked with it.

It seems as if im not explaining myself very well, I have no problem with the product at all, its just that in todays society with everyones personal finances going to crap ( including mine ) i just get dont think everyone should sit back and let a vendor increase prices by 50% maybe its just frustration with life coming out !!!

The kitchen knife world is strange, i thought chefs were a poor group of people who were underpaid, yet everyone seems so willing and even encouraging of these price hikes !!

Alan
 
It was either price hike or don't make them because at the old rate there was no profit.
 
I think one has to differentiate between an upcoming maker (some-part time or hobbyists working from their garages) and an established maker with an overhead. Not in so distant past, Bob Kramer's custom 8" chef (52100) was selling for $499. It's selling now for at least 3 times more.

It comes down to what one's time is worth.

M
 
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welshstar said:
i just get dont think everyone should sit back and let a vendor increase prices by 50% maybe its just frustration with life coming out !!!
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The best way to not sit back is to refuse to buy one. DT made a few batches, they were more time consuming then initially expected, so at the selling price really not worth his time. He probably did us all a favor by making as many as he did at those prices.

No one is forcing anyone to buy any of the knives discussed on this forum.
 
welshstar said:
It seems as if im not explaining myself very well, I have no problem with the product at all, its just that in todays society with everyones personal finances going to crap ( including mine ) i just get dont think everyone should sit back and let a vendor increase prices by 50% maybe its just frustration with life coming out !!!
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Occupy Panaca!!
 
The part time and hobbyist maker glut has, IMO, almost destroyed the non-kitchen side of the custom knife market because the number of knifemakers has far outstripped the number of collectors in the last 20 years.. That has not happened yet in the kitchen knife market. Just encourage way too many makers to start making kitchen knives and you will be able to drive the prices back down to early 1990's level (with better quality) like has happened in the case of many, if not the vast majority of the ABS makers like myself.:D
Marko Tsourkan said:
I think one has to differentiate between an upcoming maker (some-part time or hobbyists working from their garages) and an established maker with an overhead. Not in so distant past, Bob Kramer's custom 8" chef (52100) was selling for $499. It's selling now for at least 3 times more.

It comes down to what one's time is worth.

M
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welshstar said:
It seems as if im not explaining myself very well, I have no problem with the product at all, its just that in todays society with everyones personal finances going to crap ( including mine ) i just get dont think everyone should sit back and let a vendor increase prices by 50% maybe its just frustration with life coming out !!!

The kitchen knife world is strange, i thought chefs were a poor group of people who were underpaid, yet everyone seems so willing and even encouraging of these price hikes !!
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Your finances are going to crap, not everyone's. The money did not evaporate. There is more of it now than ever--but it's being taken from you. If you want a pay increase when your product is worth a lot more and you can increase quality and focus on one item and make it worth your time, you can--unless there is some boss telling you to work harder and give them all the money, in return for a steady income.

1965 average hourly wage in a factory was $19.61. Now, it is $19.71.
1965 average hourly wage for a CEO was $490.31. Now, it is $5,419.97.

If you want to Occupy, occupy your own life--stop asking your boss permission for a better quality of life. I think Devin is running a phenomenal business, and he sells dammy left and right, and his knives are spot-on American craftsmanship. They were underpriced, and since we care about having guys like him in this world, we're happy to pay him for it.

Sorry if it came off ranty-ful, I didn't mean to :soapbox:. I am just passionate about self-employment and apprenticeship.
 
Sorry to those that are offended by the increase in price.

I don't make that much money. We struggle to make payroll every week. I have to raise the price or stop making them.

The new price is closer to the industry standard.

Hoss
 
DevinT said:
Sorry to those that are offended by the increase in price.

I don't make that much money. We struggle to make payroll every week. I have to raise the price or stop making them.

The new price is closer to the industry standard.

Hoss
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I don't think anyone is blaming you Hoss, its more just the state of the world currently. Everyone has to increase prices. If you look at the prices of CKTG regularly item's will slowly jump up as popularity grows on them.

And you are also putting more work into them and not simply just raising the prices. I think that speaks for something by itself.
 
It's understandable you need the knives to be at a certain price point in order to take the time to make them vs producing damascus billets or custom knives. People are always unhappy with price increases, and just because the economy is down doesn't mean specific businesses are not allowed to increase pricing. After all, raw material prices are up quite a bit the last few years, as well as health insurance costs, plus the Gov't wants those who work and pay their bills to pony up more $ to cover those that do not.

Just promise you won't raise your spoon prices :bat: :)
 
WildBoar said:
...No one is forcing anyone to buy any of the knives discussed on this forum.
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+1 This thread is so full of BS, it's hilarious. Hoss can put whatever price on them, he sees fit. If you think the "advertisement" is misleading or he's a fraud as a knifemaker, that's one thing. If you don't think his knives are worth the price, don't buy them! There are thousands of choices out there, lol. I, for one, believe this probably a good thing for the DTITK line. I think the extra time put into these could result in a consistantly better product that more accurately reflects the quality Hoss is capable of.
 
This reminds of when people complained they had to start buying their downloaded music from itunes or amazon instead of stealing it. It was way under priced before, now it is reasonably priced.

I noticed the slow down in ITK production (why make ITKs at little or no profit when your time is better spent making more profitable customs? no brainer, really), and combined with the super rapid sales once they became available, I prefer this model. A fairer price for Devin and family, more ITK production, better ITK product, and maybe less rapid sales/stock on shelves so it's not such a crap shoot to get one.
 
It annoys me that Devin feels the need to defend his pricing. No wonder Bob Kramer avoids knife forums. Fair market value is whatever the market will pay. It's not like he is selling sandbags at a 50% markup in the middle of a flood. There are plenty of options out there. If you feel Devin's knives are not worth the price he is asking, guess what? You don't have to buy one! It's one thing to say you don't feel they are a good value, or that there are better options for the money, but it's quite another to begrudge his success. I would never pay $6,000 (or $25,000) for a Kramer, but he sounds like a nice guy and if he can get it, more power to him.
 
I'm sure I'll be flamed to oblivion for this, but I've been looking at knives for sale by maker at bladeforums for a while now, and I've posted below some links to recently-sold kitchen knives. These were all hand-forged, ground, heat-treated and handled in-house. Some have hamons, some have bolsters, and all have "western" handles requiring considerably more fitting than wa handles. If these guys can make a profit selling these knives at these prices (and there are dozens more like these), it just isn't clear to me how DT was hurting at $340 for a pre-cut blank.

Ryan Weeks chef knife: $210
David Loukides santoku: $220
Phillip Patton chef knife: $300

What am I missing?
 
No flaming required, haha. I'm not sure why you think western handles are more difficult to do than wa. Regardless, I've tried out dozens of knives from a number of different custom knifemakers. Most of them don't cut food worth $hit and I'm not kidding. The three I know that can consistently make an outstanding knife are Devin, Murray and Rottman.
 
JBroida said:
dont count out the japanese guys ;)
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My bad. Japanese knifemakers' knives are such great cutters, in general, I seem to have taken them for granted. A lot of them have made hundreds if not thousands of excellent knives and learned to make them by apprenticing with someone that made hundreds or thousands of excellent knives before them. That's hard to compete with.
 
Many of those bladesmiths may not know that there are people out there who will pay a fair price for an outstanding kitchen knife (and actually use it for its intended purpose) even if your name isn't Jerry Fisk, Harvey Dean, Larry Fuegen or what have you. I sure didn't until I started coming on this forum. People keep saying that Hoss' time is too valuable to be making these knives for less when he could be making customs. This is true in part, but remember also that he makes a LOT of damascus so making knives in general be they custom or semi custom, has to make enough money i order for him to take time away from making his steel. It goes without saying that the highest and best use of his time is probably making custom knives out of his own damascus, but if the other lines make financial sense, then he can make those. While custom damascus knives can be very profitable, they market for them is fairly limited, whereas, I would think that the market for knives like the ITK line is arguably much larger. Pretty much anyone who has shelled out serious bucks for a really good Japanese kitchen knife is a potential customer. Personally, I am surpised that more makers haven't gotten on the "buy American" bandwagon when it comes to kitchen knives. :lol2:
Johnny.B.Good said:
You think these guys wouldn't be charging Devin's prices if they could? Devin should keep increasing his prices until the company that carries his knives can keep them in stock for a few days.
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Nice Devin

Love your work, still your knives are to cheap. So I hope you continue to raise the prices.
People who have a problem with that you should ignore, nobody works for free :)
Seems like folks focusing only on price will get what they deserve, a low-tech cheap knife made in China.
Lots of customers will pay what you charge, and when the home market gets more into high end cutlery, you will have customers with lots of money interested in buying your knives.

The problem you have Devin, is to marketing your knives to these people. Nerds on this forum is not your future customers, and you should find a way to reach the other markets. C K T G is ok, he gets more and more customers due to internet shopping. Hows your MS title coming, any plans to take it?

I got 3 ITKs. Love em all :)
When will we see the ITK parer?
 
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