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Knife Japan: What's notable, worth buying, etc.?
- Thread starter DitmasPork
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Thanks! Alternatively I’m thinking a Moriya Munemitsu in either Ginsan or AS, kind curious how their steel feels since they are subordinated to Yasuki
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@blokey
I've owned both steels by moriya
The ginsan is really great, it's one of my favorite steels -- I don't miss carbon while using it, the edge taking is great and I prefer it to heiji semi stainless or would say it's in the same category of good. Not as long retention as heiji but really good.l steel. Edge feels bitey and not slippery or too plasticky like some stainless.
The aogami super is also really great. More ... Uh soft? Than some makers push it. But compared to tf denka aogami super . . . The moriya feels finer and more stale, less carbon, more tough. I like the denka edge more -- goes through stuff easier, but the moriya is so much less chippy and nicer to sharpen. It feels more "particle" like, not as glassy as TF denka when sharpening. Like uh, hm, imagine good white steel in easiness to sharpen but everything feels slightly coarser, but very evenly distributed. To me, it felt like a "high end" steel or heat treat . . . Well behaved. The aogami super moriya knives are thicker than the ginsan ones.
I've owned both steels by moriya
The ginsan is really great, it's one of my favorite steels -- I don't miss carbon while using it, the edge taking is great and I prefer it to heiji semi stainless or would say it's in the same category of good. Not as long retention as heiji but really good.l steel. Edge feels bitey and not slippery or too plasticky like some stainless.
The aogami super is also really great. More ... Uh soft? Than some makers push it. But compared to tf denka aogami super . . . The moriya feels finer and more stale, less carbon, more tough. I like the denka edge more -- goes through stuff easier, but the moriya is so much less chippy and nicer to sharpen. It feels more "particle" like, not as glassy as TF denka when sharpening. Like uh, hm, imagine good white steel in easiness to sharpen but everything feels slightly coarser, but very evenly distributed. To me, it felt like a "high end" steel or heat treat . . . Well behaved. The aogami super moriya knives are thicker than the ginsan ones.
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Thank you!
Anyone have experience with this?
Seems more nimble than a deba for fish processing
https://knifejapan.com/ikenami-hamono-naginata-180mm/
Seems more nimble than a deba for fish processing
https://knifejapan.com/ikenami-hamono-naginata-180mm/
Okubo nakiri update/review. Was torn whether to post this in the "Let's talk about this knife" thread or in the formal review section, but I figured the most targeted audience is here.
TL/NGR : banger.
The Lady just ordered the stock 180 nakiri off KJ website as a gift for me, no customizing or pestering Michael on my end. Factory edge was excellent, cleanly passed paper towel test at all parts.
Came out at 180x63 mm, 234 g. Spine is 4 mm at pinch (just like my 250 gyuto), 2.38 midway, and 1.83 mm front. I didn't bother putting calipers on the blade road. Very forward balance due to light handle. I got an extra handle from Okubo san and the 240 length one weighs 33 g...half as much as a comparable rosewood handle I have.
The closest competitor I had was a Watanabe Pro nakiri 176x60, 200 grams. Size comparison and Okubo family portrait
The fuzzies on the side are from a cloth that the KU grabbed when I wiped it. Too lazy to retake choil shot.
My first cut was the biggest carrot I had. Admittedly not big, but still enough to give me an idea...I've had plenty knives fail this test. Okubo was dead silent. Julienned comfortably, the strips mostly stayed on the board or fell off as soon as I lifted. Profile is a little more curvy than my Wat, but it's comfortable in use and I don't have accordion problems push cutting. Repeated results over the past few days.
The Okubo cut through carrots and big sweet potatoes better than the Wat Pro. The Wat feels thinner at the edge, but the beautiful convex of the Okubo just feels like a snow plow or ships bow pushing the product aside and sliding through with very little stiction. The Wat Pro is a good sweet potato knife in its own right, but it felt like it was fighting that suction of the dense potato more and also wanted to bring a few more carrot strips along for a ride. Extra weight certainly helps the Okubo too.
On shallots they were about the same, both good. Okubo doesn't bite into the board as much so I prefer it for mincing garlic.
I made an onion video. Honestly they're about the same here too. Like before, the Wat is thinner overall and at the edge so it feels like it has initially a little better bite, but I prefer the grind on the Okubo more. The Okubo won on horizontal cuts as it slipped through with a little more ease. The thinness of the Wat's spine helped it not push apart onion as much on vertical slices. First video is Okubo.
All in all great knife, hasn't take much patina even after I let steak sit on it for 45 minutes. I can see some good stuff on the polished core steel but the coarse grind marks seem to negate fun patina colors
I've noticed the same on my gyuto despite repeated attempts to patina it heavily.
TL/NGR : banger.
The Lady just ordered the stock 180 nakiri off KJ website as a gift for me, no customizing or pestering Michael on my end. Factory edge was excellent, cleanly passed paper towel test at all parts.
Came out at 180x63 mm, 234 g. Spine is 4 mm at pinch (just like my 250 gyuto), 2.38 midway, and 1.83 mm front. I didn't bother putting calipers on the blade road. Very forward balance due to light handle. I got an extra handle from Okubo san and the 240 length one weighs 33 g...half as much as a comparable rosewood handle I have.
The closest competitor I had was a Watanabe Pro nakiri 176x60, 200 grams. Size comparison and Okubo family portrait
The fuzzies on the side are from a cloth that the KU grabbed when I wiped it. Too lazy to retake choil shot.
My first cut was the biggest carrot I had. Admittedly not big, but still enough to give me an idea...I've had plenty knives fail this test. Okubo was dead silent. Julienned comfortably, the strips mostly stayed on the board or fell off as soon as I lifted. Profile is a little more curvy than my Wat, but it's comfortable in use and I don't have accordion problems push cutting. Repeated results over the past few days.
The Okubo cut through carrots and big sweet potatoes better than the Wat Pro. The Wat feels thinner at the edge, but the beautiful convex of the Okubo just feels like a snow plow or ships bow pushing the product aside and sliding through with very little stiction. The Wat Pro is a good sweet potato knife in its own right, but it felt like it was fighting that suction of the dense potato more and also wanted to bring a few more carrot strips along for a ride. Extra weight certainly helps the Okubo too.
On shallots they were about the same, both good. Okubo doesn't bite into the board as much so I prefer it for mincing garlic.
I made an onion video. Honestly they're about the same here too. Like before, the Wat is thinner overall and at the edge so it feels like it has initially a little better bite, but I prefer the grind on the Okubo more. The Okubo won on horizontal cuts as it slipped through with a little more ease. The thinness of the Wat's spine helped it not push apart onion as much on vertical slices. First video is Okubo.
All in all great knife, hasn't take much patina even after I let steak sit on it for 45 minutes. I can see some good stuff on the polished core steel but the coarse grind marks seem to negate fun patina colors
I've noticed the same on my gyuto despite repeated attempts to patina it heavily.
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riba
Senior Member
Bloody enablers
This just got dropped
Must say, quite a pleasant grind. Looks perfect for my partner (who basically only uses a petty. At least this bunka has a bit more knuckle clearance).
This just got dropped
Must say, quite a pleasant grind. Looks perfect for my partner (who basically only uses a petty. At least this bunka has a bit more knuckle clearance).
riba
Senior Member
Bloody enablers
This just got dropped
Must say, quite a pleasant grind. Looks perfect for my partner (who basically only uses a petty. At least this bunka has a bit more knuckle clearance).
WOW, this is the first time that my wife is enthousiastic about a knife.......
(after just a quick touch up on a shapton pro 1K and coticule, en sticker removal
)
Okubo nakiri update/review. Was torn whether to post this in the "Let's talk about this knife" thread or in the formal review section, but I figured the most targeted audience is here.
TL/NGR : banger.
The Lady just ordered the stock 180 nakiri off KJ website as a gift for me, no customizing or pestering Michael on my end. Factory edge was excellent, cleanly passed paper towel test at all parts.
Came out at 180x63 mm, 234 g. Spine is 4 mm at pinch (just like my 250 gyuto), 2.38 midway, and 1.83 mm front. I didn't bother putting calipers on the blade road. Very forward balance due to light handle. I got an extra handle from Okubo san and the 240 length one weighs 33 g...half as much as a comparable rosewood handle I have.
The closest competitor I had was a Watanabe Pro nakiri 176x60, 200 grams. Size comparison and Okubo family portrait
View attachment 294204
View attachment 294203
View attachment 294208
View attachment 294209
The fuzzies on the side are from a cloth that the KU grabbed when I wiped it. Too lazy to retake choil shot.
My first cut was the biggest carrot I had. Admittedly not big, but still enough to give me an idea...I've had plenty knives fail this test. Okubo was dead silent. Julienned comfortably, the strips mostly stayed on the board or fell off as soon as I lifted. Profile is a little more curvy than my Wat, but it's comfortable in use and I don't have accordion problems push cutting. Repeated results over the past few days.
View attachment 294205
View attachment 294206
View attachment 294207
The Okubo cut through carrots and big sweet potatoes better than the Wat Pro. The Wat feels thinner at the edge, but the beautiful convex of the Okubo just feels like a snow plow or ships bow pushing the product aside and sliding through with very little stiction. The Wat Pro is a good sweet potato knife in its own right, but it felt like it was fighting that suction of the dense potato more and also wanted to bring a few more carrot strips along for a ride. Extra weight certainly helps the Okubo too.
On shallots they were about the same, both good. Okubo doesn't bite into the board as much so I prefer it for mincing garlic.
I made an onion video. Honestly they're about the same here too. Like before, the Wat is thinner overall and at the edge so it feels like it has initially a little better bite, but I prefer the grind on the Okubo more. The Okubo won on horizontal cuts as it slipped through with a little more ease. The thinness of the Wat's spine helped it not push apart onion as much on vertical slices. First video is Okubo.
All in all great knife, hasn't take much patina even after I let steak sit on it for 45 minutes. I can see some good stuff on the polished core steel but the coarse grind marks seem to negate fun patina colors
How is the Gyuto from Okubo in comparison? Not a nakiri lover but Okubo seems to get a lot of high praise
I've sprinkled various love letters to it around the forum. Not sure if you saw this post of mine already with specs and such. It's far and away my favorite workhorse and has really cooled my buying lust. Has no business cutting as well as it does. Better food release than any knife I own(ed) including an S-grind and shamed Toyama 240. Kinda reminds me of an upsized Munetoshi. Really looks more like a giant santoku, not much distal taper. I can tell he spent more time on the heel and it's gorgeous, the tip is just a hair thick for me, I wish the grind came up a little higher on it but it's perfectly usable...I'm just spoiled by Shindo/Mazaki/Munetoshi tips. I'm gonna thin the first 30 mm or so and then I would honestly be happy with it as my only gyuto.
This is the only video I have, my very first onion cut with it so was still learning in real time but you get the gist.
Here’s some video too
Alrighty, I got busy and totally forgot to post this up.
Sasaoka Nakiri:
It's an overall very thin knife with pronounced concave bevels. Light and lasery. Michael lists it as "YSS Aogami #2/Nantetsu" which I take to mean iron cladding but so far it has shown little to no propensity to patina.
Now, this particular example has some interesting scratches.
The scratches are on both sides and as you can see they are angled as if from sharpening. But they overlap the main blade face and down into the concave bevels. They are clearly from a coarse abrasive.
I mean, it's obvious that clean lines and attention to detail aren't the focus here. What is it the TF guys say? Oh yeah, wabi sabi. Everything is straight and sound and the knife slices like a demon so it's staying but those scratches do kinda have me scratching my head as to when and why they got there...
What say you KKF?
Michael did offer to cover the knife if I was unsatisfied.
Sasaoka Nakiri:
It's an overall very thin knife with pronounced concave bevels. Light and lasery. Michael lists it as "YSS Aogami #2/Nantetsu" which I take to mean iron cladding but so far it has shown little to no propensity to patina.
Now, this particular example has some interesting scratches.
The scratches are on both sides and as you can see they are angled as if from sharpening. But they overlap the main blade face and down into the concave bevels. They are clearly from a coarse abrasive.
I mean, it's obvious that clean lines and attention to detail aren't the focus here. What is it the TF guys say? Oh yeah, wabi sabi.
Everything is straight and sound and the knife slices like a demon so it's staying but those scratches do kinda have me scratching my head as to when and why they got there...What say you KKF?
Michael did offer to cover the knife if I was unsatisfied.
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Illustration of my patina comments on both Okubos an what I suspect will be similar on HHC's Sasaoka above. Patina forms on polished parts but the coarse grind marks kinda negate anything from forming. I turned down exposure to help highlight the differences:
Had to flex the alpaca socks for @BillHanna
Had to flex the alpaca socks for @BillHanna
BillHanna
Gotta get ready for ARM
TheDza
Senior Member
man I am digging that kurouchi
Coarse stone strays from initial bevel setting not fully removed in subsequent progression. When these become unacceptable on a $100 nakiri with good steel that admittedly cuts well, we've lost the point, pun intended. There's a large market for cutlery with more attention paid to polish and fluff and it'll be paid for, too. Michael is too generous.
Yeah I got this guy with one of Michael's coupons so it was even under $100. I've also bought enough knives from Michael that I think he knows I wouldn't be upset about it. He warned me upfront and said he was a little confused by how the scratches got there. All that did was make me more eager for it to arrive so I could see what he was talking about.
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My santoku had similar coarse grind marks
They all went away when I thinned it and now it patinas like mad
Pitbull for scale
Did you notice any change in food release after thinning? For better or worse? I'm a far better sharpener than actual maintainer/thinner so I've been hesitant to effectively "flatten" the grind by thinning and lose some of that delightful food release. I know the rocking for convex method, but it's still just a lack of confidence thing.
Food release definitely improved afterwards which is unexpected, I’d expect a smooth polished bevel to increase stiction but I find it sticks for 2 cuts and then falls off. I’d assume convex it’s in geometry and hitting the KU part shakes it off
Definitely a better knife after thinning and flattening
I used the venev 100/240 for the coarse work and took it up to 2000 on naniwa then some jnats just for fun
Getting a coarse venev really changed my hesitance to thinning and flattening
They cut incredibly fast
I say it lowers any concern or resistance to taking the bevels to a stone. Call it a feature, Michael should charge extra for it!
Gyuto, Okubo or Kurogane? Wait isn't an issue. Michael said Kurugane-san would make a taller gyuto also, 52ish mm. So, can anyone speak to both by chance? I have an okubo santoku that I am very pleased with and would like to see if that grind magic translates with the gyuto as well (I've heard it does!).
I saw a list from my buddy you got a Okubo Gyuto and they were all listed 50-55mm Height. Unless something changed. It had a lot of belly, but he loves how it cuts.
Okubos gyutos look like giant santokus anyway. When doing my custom Michael said I could spec up to 55 mm. Came out a 57. Agree with @Rideon66 about most of his stuff having a lot of belly, that's why I asked for a flatter heel and am happy I did. The front big curve still makes it nice to mince garlic and it was a pleasant surprise to help on cutting big heads of cabbage.
is a review of an Okubo santuko (by a Very Fast Talking young chappie)
Enjoy.
Last fall I told Michael that I wanted a 210 migaki, >50mm tall. After about a month he sent me this. 215x53. The edge is a continuous gentle curve, I think that's what people are referring to when they say they have belly. Aesthetically, I might've thought flatter would've been better (like a wat) but in practice it's actually kind of nice. There's something special about the grind and the heat treat. Here it is as it was new. After using it a while I ordered a ku 170 nakiri.
No joke dude talks without breathing!
It seems like there are way more words coming out than the subtitles are reflecting !
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