Passaround: Jiro Tsuchime White #1 270mm Gyuto

Kitchen Knife Forums

Help Support Kitchen Knife Forums:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Nothing I'm reading so far would make me rush out to buy a Jiro. Its not a style that resonates with me from a performance perspective. But it's great to get some specific details regarding the grind, profile, HT and Jiro's overall philosophy, especially as he was responsible for every stage in production and finishing. Curious if this is one of the earlier iterations (don't remember if the SN was mentioned) or a latter version which I understand has been tweaked somewhat.
 
Nothing I'm reading so far would make me rush out to buy a Jiro. Its not a style that resonates with me from a performance perspective. But it's great to get some specific details regarding the grind, profile, HT and Jiro's overall philosophy, especially as he was responsible for every stage in production and finishing. Curious if this is one of the earlier iterations (don't remember if the SN was mentioned) or a latter version which I understand has been tweaked somewhat.

It was #48, I believe. https://www.toshoknifearts.com/collections/gyuto-270mm/products/eva-1048-fa270


[QUOTE="CiderBear, post: 668590, member: 37802 "What did you feel about the Taihei handle? I haven't seen another maker using this handle material before, so I'm curious how it feels like in hand and the grip when wet.[/QUOTE]

@CiderBear I too would be interested in other folks opinions. The handle was nicely tapered, but I found it a little slick and slightly cheap feeling. Think I would have liked it better in another more textured wooden material, or even just plain ho wood.
 
Thank you everyone for posting your thoughts on this knife.

What did you feel about the Taihei handle? I haven't seen another maker using this handle material before, so I'm curious how it feels like in hand and the grip when wet.
I didn't notice the handle much, which means it was comfortable and not slippery to me. I remember it being comfortable and not in the way.
 
I've got a petty with the same handle material and it feels a bit too smooth/insubstantial.
 
The handle felt smooth, but it wasn't noticeable into prep. I should have paid attention to it, but was the smoothness solely from polishing, or was the handle processed/coated/etc. in some way?

I also would have liked a larger handle with butt chamfering, but that's personal preference.
 
My thoughts and opinions based on about 3 total hours with the knife in hand:

Several who have already posted thoughts have shared some great information that is good for the group and useful for prospective buyers. I hope my contribution does not become too repetitive as my experience reflects similarly to what has already been shared.

I was not able to form any initial impressions objectively. I was really excited about this new maker and I received a lot of the hype openly. Of all the pros/ cons surrounding this maker, price is the most impactful point.

In many ways I think such a high price point will probably hurt this maker in the long run. The “flavor” of these knives is definitely to my liking. I very much enjoy the blacksmith’s finish and tastefully simple handles as worn by this particular blade. The steel is perfectly traditional. The shape is as familiar as Gyuto profiles can be. The net sum of all these factors is a perfectly functional and straightforward tool. Exactly what it needs to be. No more, no less. But also in many ways vanilla and not unlike many scores of alternatives from reputable makers that also deliver at a much more appropriate price point. My take- price is a major bummer because I love this knife!

The knife has a soul that speaks to my heart. Feels great in hand. The balance, feedback, heft, aesthetics, and performance were all ringing my bells and brought me joy in using the knife. I wanted to keep it but I’m a knife whore so I easily fall in love with stuff that makes no sense for me financially or practically. I’m glad it’s not mine and I’m glad I didn’t lay out the change on this one. Because you can get where this one goes for less cash and have leftover funds for some shiny new stones.

The overall performance was good. It’s not an all-star knife. It’s a very well executed Gyuto in a nicely treated White 1. I really wanted to sharpen this knife. Most of all I wanted to sharpen it! So I did.

But sharpening frustrated me because I don’t like the original bevel profile. It has a convexed kireba leading into a more severely convexed primary bevel, finishing out with a micro-secondary bevel at the edge. So you have the effect of a gradual to aggressive curve angle terminating at an invisible edge. Not for me. I like a similarly convexed face/bevel but I profoundly enjoy results of thinning and rebuilding a v-profile secondary bevel (due to much lower sharpening angle). I sparingly lest infrequently micro bevel my double bevel knives. Call me crazy. Sharpening this knife was frustrating because I didn’t want to modify the original bevel configuration. Devil on my shoulder wanted to convert it to a thinner, more delicate cutter, skating the edge of irresponsibly thin. That’s what I enjoy.

The sharpening character of the knife did not disappoint however. The steel felt really good on the stones. I felt like the Nakagawa heat treat was extremely well executed. I was able to build really crisp apexes that responded well to stropping and touch-ups. I felt like I could control easily how much bite/tooth I wanted on the edge. Deburring was pesky but I think that was a result of the unfamiliar high sharpening angle I held to keep the knife in original configuration.

Stones I used:
Sigma ii 3k, 6k
Shapton Glass 2k
Nano Hone 1k, 6k
JNATS- Natsuya, couple Suitas, couple hard finishers Narutaki style
I strop on cBN loaded balsa, 2u or 1.5u

Perceived sharpness was good. Apex stayed crispy for a long time but these edges wanted to roll more than micro-chip so touch ups were frequent and effectively easy. Cutting performance was in line with previous reviewers. But again it’s thick for my preferences.

Obviously I polished the knife. Main reason was I really was curious about the reactivity. And I’m not a patina guy anyway. But that’s why reactivity is important to me. How often/hard would I be scrubbing on this thing? Not as often as most, I found. The cladding is awesome! It reacts beautifully and relatively slowly. I don’t know about this so I’m guessing: it seemed like there was more core steel and less cladding in this blade than what’s usual for any given sanmai. Seemed like the cladding was ultra thin if not wispy at the core junction. Also a few delam spots? The Kurouchi seems fragile too. Like it could be gone in a half year or so possibly.

Overall this knife felt right. It’s a good fit for me. I would love to own this knife. Arguments could be made to justify price and I would especially object less if I thought the maker himself was getting most of it! I intend to create or exacerbate zero controversy, so I emphasize now: all thoughts written here are only my opinions. Opinions can change. Opinions can be wrong.

I cannot emphasize enough how awesome this experience has been. I gained so much out of the time invested, and I am really happy to have had the opportunity to participate. Huge thanks to all involved!
WOW, awesome review! Thanks so much for sharing!!!!
 
@tgfencer @Barmoley @madelinez @lagrangeL2 (oh gosh your username gives me violent flashbacks): thank you folks for your impressions on the handle. Do you have any experience with ichii or ebony? How smooth does this taihei feel compared to those?
Smoother than ichii, but not as smooth as ebony, but i am sure there are variations on all of these, finish dependent.
 
@CiderBear Also lighter than ebony. Not sure about ichii. Texture is hard to pinpoint as finish makes a big difference. For example, I've had ultra smooth ebony and quite grippy ebony and I'm sure the same could be said for this taihei stuff.
 
I thought Taihei was the handle maker, not the wood. . .
 
Nice reviews everyone. I would love to know how this knife compares to the classics like Wat, Takeda, TF, Tanaka, Maz, etc... $800 is pretty steep for any knife
 
Received the knife today. First impressions are good. Looking forward to trying it out tomorrow.

Here are some pics of the handle for those who were curious.
IMG_20200129_174550.jpg
IMG_20200129_174441.jpg
 
So unfortunately my kids brought home something from daycare and I was sick for the majority of the week I had the Jiro, so I didn’t get to put it to use as much as I would have liked to. That being said, I think I still got a pretty good feel for the knife.


My first impression of it taking it out of the box were as I expected. The knife looks awesome in my opinion! I love the overall aesthetic of Jiro’s knives. The feeling in the hand was great. I love the handle and it just felt perfect in the hand. It had nice balance and didn’t feel huge for a 270.


Over the week I used it on some potatoes, cooked steak, onions, peppers, garlic, ginger, carrots, raw beef, and apples. I tried to cut as wide a variety of food as I could without putting anything to waste. I thought it cut very well in pretty much all aspects. Food release was good, but not perfect. I am mostly a push cutter but tried to rock it a little, slice and do some tip work just to see what it could do. And I think it did everything very well, but I wouldn’t say it excelled at anything in particular. I think it probably felt best cutting bell peppers because of the large flat spot. Dicing onions was not its strong suit. Maybe it was me and just the fact I haven’t been using a 270 much lately but horizontal cuts felt clumsy.


Personally I’m happy with my knife sharpening skills, but I don’t know if others would be! So I did not take it to the stones. So unfortunately I can’t say much to that.


Overall I think there was nothing to complain about. It’s a great knife! I personally really want to give the western version a try and I think I would like a 240 or 210 better. As for the price – I don’t know. I don’t have experience with the super high end knives a lot of you guys have so I think it is hard for me to compare it to others in the price range.


Thanks for setting this up Kevin! It was definitely a fun experience.
 
Jiro arrived at my place in great condition!
Going to make lunch with it without any presharpening.
Current measurements
Length: 275mm
Heel height:54.5mm
Weight: 9.6oz or 273g

First impression: it’s a great 270 knife, didn’t feel big at all. The point balance is right at kanji. I wasn’t excepting much from Jiro at first to be honest. However the balance feeling of power and swiftness just got me excited about this experience!
76445E11-2BE1-4DC7-BEBC-BACF2E64A3AF.jpg

42880AF5-1388-4A95-BAA3-5D2C354EED5F.jpg
49E467F8-F93F-4563-9CB4-E89F1EF5B1D3.jpg
IMG_9887.jpg


I will post a lot of feedback separately along the way so my feedback won’t be blurred up by “general feeling”
 
Thanks to Ashy for doing this pass around. And sorry for the delayed review. I can't really say to much about the blade that hasn't already been said, but here goes.
I really like the over all feel and appearance of this blade. Spine an choil are not polished but are comfortably rounded. Ku finish is thin but looks nice and matches the blades rustic appearance well. My first impression of the handle was it feels slick. But never bothered me in use and in my opinion seems to fit the blade well.

I was able to use the knife for 3 days at work. First impression on the board was kind of meh. But the more I used it the more It grew on me. Didn't really Excell at anything but doesn't ever let you down either. At 270+mm and 272g, It never seems unwieldly or tiresome.
Profile might not be for everyone but the huge flat spot works well for me. Food release for me seemed really pretty good. Wedged a bit but nothing outrageous,except for carrots but these were what I was working with that week so not fair I guess.
IMG_20200130_084004.jpg

Cladding is less reactive than I am used to. A stable patina formed quickly and evenly without any drama.

Edge retention is about what you would expect for white 1. I didn't raise a burr on the stones. A couple quick strops on my hard takashima or aoto brought the edge right back to where it should be. The blade was sharpened a bit different than I sharpen my own knives. It has a bit of a "macro bevel" and a little thicker behind the edge than I am used to. Still performed pretty well, but with one good session on the stones I bet it could be really impressive.
Overall I really enjoyed using this knife. Didn't ever feel like I wanted to put it down, or send it on to the next guy. Think it is a really nice "working man's" knife. Unfortunately, with a collector's price tag.
 
Sorry for the late feedback, I was planning on posting my first time user experience 2 days ago, then I got distracted by work.

Before you read the feedback below, please consider that I am only a hobbyist home cook, my reviews only speak for myself. The knife has been around working hard for few month now, the bevels might not speak true as if it was right out of the box.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I will describe my first time user experience as shocking.
The knife performed excellent against soft protein and veggies. Especially during push cuts, you can go through large chunks of beef with ease. The 275mm cutting edge with extra long flat belly definitely helped.
On harder surface veggies like Carrots and Leeks however, the performs was shockingly poor. As I have to push for it to cut through.


My first impression of this knife can be summarized as:

The look:
A good looking KU gyuto, feels great and balance well in hand. I haven't used a 270mm blade for a while, so this was a big knife for me.

The cut:
Jiro cuts soft proteins and veggies very well. The knife has difficult time to cut through harder objectives like Carrots and leeks.

The blade geometry and design:
I like the extra flat bevel for push cuts, I didn't get to use the tip much but 1 onion. To use the tip on this 275mm beast, I had to raise the heel off the cutting board for about 9mm, on a 240mm shige I will only need to bring up 6.5mm. With my kitchen table setting at 90mm off the ground and I am 5'8ish (175cm) tall, it was not very convenient for me to use. However I believe this is more so a 270mm vs 240mm kind of deal than Jiro.
The bevel on this Jiro for sure will need to be thinned. If I own this knife and had the option to thin it down on the stone for an hour, it will be a totally different beast.

Is it worth the price?
the 270mm knife might not do it justice, as in many way (other than push cutting large chunk of meat) I didn't find the length comfortable.
If you would ask me base on my own usage, rather I will pay for the price today, I will say no.
However it's a cool knife, there are many things Jiro is doing great at. I think if you priced the knife right, one day it can get there in the 800 range, but to start at 850 is a far reach.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I personally believe that the blade needs to be thinned. If you run your thumb along the bevel from edge to spine you will feel a big hump? and it's pretty thick behind the edge. The bevel is designed like an Axe (quoting someone on KKF ;)) seems like its designed for heavy use.

To confirm the under performance wasn't caused by deviation of the testing subjects and edge sharpness, I performed the actions below:

1. I compared the cuts with 4 other gyutos; 220 Tsourkan, 240 Shige, 240 Munetoshi honyaki, 240 Toyama SS. They all performed well against the same carrots and leeks.

2. I repeat test 1 on a different carrot, result the same.

3. I touched the blade up on fine stone after getting Kevin's approval and repeat test 1. result got little better on the Jiro but I would still consider as poor.

In this photo below you will see where the carrot start to resist the bevels.
IMG_0045.jpeg

In this photo you can see where the carrot completely stopped the bevels.
IMG_0042.jpeg


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So I am planning on shipping the knife out on Friday to the next member.
If you guys believe I did something wrong here or there are more you want me to try, please advice.
I would love to consider.
 
the edge always gets fat from passarounds because everyone sharpens it but never bothers to thin the bevels out of fear of messing up the finish. when i did tanaka passaround it came back an axe, lol.
 
the edge always gets fat from passarounds because everyone sharpens it but never bothers to thin the bevels out of fear of messing up the finish. when i did tanaka passaround it came back an axe, lol.
After the last person is done, the knife will be going back to @Forty Ounce for thinning and sharpening before it's offered to the PA group/forum.
 
Knife shipped just now to the next gentleman!
Which brings it me. And thank you so much, Kevin, for including a neophyte in this circle. Perhaps I can share my impressions from an unfamiliar perspective. It was larger than my comfort level, but the weight felt beautifully balanced. Cut through soft vegetables with ease, but seemed a bit sluggish cubing cooked/cold chicken breasts.

For me, the knife exudes personality. Strong, bold, unpretentious. I absolutely loved the handle - right size, beautiful, functional, secure in the hand, and beautiful attention to detail. From a purely aesthetic viewpoint, the elegance of the wood balanced the boldness of the metal craft. Thank you, again, for the privilege of this participation.
 
Back
Top