Vine Wood WIP

[Luftmensch]

hey man. you should look into "tung oil", i use pure tung oil from liberon. its a hardening oil.
you need to dilute it to 50% with either acetone or white spirit/paint naphta the first few rounds. then you can put 3 coats of pure oil on there. it will last for years. wait 24h between applications.

you want to dilute it the first rounds so it sucks in deep in the wood. then after the solvents have evaporated the oil hardens and polymerizes, stabilizing the wood and turns it waterproof.

tung oil is similar to linseed oil but it wont turn yellow.

i however have found a cheaper diluted oil (60%) that i simply dunk handles in for a few h. then let dry 1-2 days. then start applying 100% oil coats to for 3 days. i have handles that are 5-6 years old and they still look like new. tung oil is the ****!

danish oil/gun stock oil/furniture oil is usually diluted tung oil. but its better to simply get the pure stuff from the start imo. because with the diluted stuff you never get 100% oil that you want for the top coats.

Agreed! I am a Tung oil evangelist.

I feel it is worth adding... it is food safe ONLY if you use pure Tung oil. 'Tung oil' that you buy at hardware stores (Bunnings ) will likely have really, really nasty drying agents in them. Same goes for linseed oil. I am not claiming these are bad products - they are just not intended for food contact.

In NSW these guys deliver in reasonable time frames (I believe they are wing of The Wood Works). As per their recommendation, I dilute the tung oil with citric turpene (also food safe) - the smell.... the smell! Beautiful!

Highly recommended.

 

[Luftmensch]

This reminds me quite precisely

Hey @juice... how does "quite precisely" resonate with your style guide?

 

[cotedupy]

hey man. you should look into "tung oil", i use pure tung oil from liberon. its a hardening oil.
you need to dilute it to 50% with either acetone or white spirit/paint naphta the first few rounds. then you can put 3 coats of pure oil on there. it will last for years. wait 24h between applications.

you want to dilute it the first rounds so it sucks in deep in the wood. then after the solvents have evaporated the oil hardens and polymerizes, stabilizing the wood and turns it waterproof.

tung oil is similar to linseed oil but it wont turn yellow.

i however have found a cheaper diluted oil (60%) that i simply dunk handles in for a few h. then let dry 1-2 days. then start applying 100% oil coats to for 3 days. i have handles that are 5-6 years old and they still look like new. tung oil is the ****!

danish oil/gun stock oil/furniture oil is usually diluted tung oil. but its better to simply get the pure stuff from the start imo. because with the diluted stuff you never get 100% oil that you want for the top coats.

Ta for the reminder! I've was meaning to get some for a while, but keep forgetting... I've used it a couple of times before when I nabbed a bit from a friend, and yeah - really liked it, tho I hadn't thought about letting it soak in to harden. It's kinda my thinking with the oil and hardwax applications early, as well as for finishing, so glad my random hunch is actually a thing! The hardwax oil I used I think has a lot of Tung oil in it, but is quite thick, so won't penetrate as deeply.

Will pick some soon, that soaking when diluted sounds ideal for a lot of the wood I use

 

[cotedupy]

Agreed! I am a Tung oil evangelist.

I feel it is worth adding... it is food safe ONLY if you use pure Tung oil. 'Tung oil' that you buy at hardware stores (Bunnings ) will likely have really, really nasty drying agents in them. Same goes for linseed oil. I am not claiming these are bad products - they are just not intended for food contact.

In NSW these guys deliver in reasonable time frames (I believe they are wing of The Wood Works). As per their recommendation, I dilute the tung oil with citric turpene (also food safe) - the smell.... the smell! Beautiful!

Highly recommended.

Actually sorry - now that you mention Bunnings and citric turpene - I have bought tung oil a couple of times before. I believe this stuff is mostly, or completely Tung oil, diluted with citric turpene... https://www.bunnings.com.au/feast-watson-250ml-kitchen-timber-oil_p1520221

It was very good. And yeah... the smell is ace!

 

[juice]

Hey @juice... how does "quite precisely" resonate with your style guide?

It's better than "fairly unique"

 

[Luftmensch]

Actually sorry - now that you mention Bunnings and citric turpene - I have bought tung oil a couple of times before. I believe this stuff is mostly, or completely Tung oil, diluted with citric turpene... https://www.bunnings.com.au/feast-watson-250ml-kitchen-timber-oil_p1520221

It was very good. And yeah... the smell is ace!

You could checkout the MSDS for more information - I am mediocre at reading them.

I err on the side of paranoid for things near food. Once handles are dry, it probably doesnt matter what product was used (aka Feast Watson shouldnt be a worry). For a food preparation surface (e.g. cutting board)... I would stick to 100% pure tung oil - (assuming those products can be taken at face value).


Edit:

The marketing brief says:

With a clear, natural Tung oil, Kitchen Timber Oil is perfectly designed to nourish and protect your kitchen benches, cutting boards, salad bowls and all interior timber against water and spill damage.

Unless they are being naughty, that would mean the product is rated for contact with food once dry. Looking through the MSDS, they don't say how much Tung oil is in there. The listed composition is: Naphtha 30-60%, Turpentine 1-10%, d-Limonene 1-10%. The remaining is 20-68% could be Tung, wouldn't be surprised if it were closer to the 20% side

 

[gregfisk]

Pretty much none of the products you buy off the shelf actually have tung oil in them. It’s just marketing to confuse people. They are all basically wiping varnishes. Pure tung oil will say pure tung oil on the label, the rest of the products are varnish or a varnish oil blend. They don’t even have tung oil in them. Pure tung oil takes days to dry unlike wiping varnish. Some common wiping varnish brands are Watco danish oil, Formsby’s tung oil, General finishes arm r seal, Minwax tung oil finish and pretty much every brand you see on the hardware store shelves. I’ve been using a varnish oil blend from Minwax but I’m going to try General Finishes arm R seal next which is a varnish finish. My understanding is you can put them on thicker and they dry faster. It seems like everyone has there favorite combination that works for them. I personally put on 6 or 7 coats of Minwax tung oil, sand that down with 200 grit sandpaper until smooth then wipe on one more light coat. Then I hand apply Minwax paste wax in a thick fashion and heat it until it melts with a heat gun. Wipe it off with a soft rag and it’s done. Heating the wax makes it grippy so the handle doesn’t slip in your hand. I really like the feel of it. This process gives me a high gloss finish. If you want a less shiny finish you can either wipe it off at each coat or don’t do as many coats in the first place.

 

[juice]

Unless they are being naughty

Which is the default behaviour for corporations, especially in countries that have extremely lax laws around this sort of thing (possibly due to a recent president doing favours for people who he thinks can do him favours at some point...)

 

[Luftmensch]

Which is the default behaviour for corporations, especially in countries that have extremely lax laws around this sort of thing (possibly due to a recent president doing favours for people who he thinks can do him favours at some point...)

Definitely... I have used hardware store danish oil and linseed oil on various woodwork projects. No problems.

I wanted to seal a huon pine board for use in the kitchen. I was going to make it a cutting board but the grain is nice, i couldnt bring myself to use it. It is more charcuterie board now. I spent a long time reading about wood sealing products rated for food contact. My conclusion was that i didn't have full confidence in the lack of information surrounding the products that hardware stores commonly stock.

In the end, 100% tung oil thinned with citric turpene and rubbed down with bees wax rose to the top of my list for food-safe options. Of course... you have to assume those products are being sold honestly! But at least you know what the ingredients are...

Pure tung oil takes days to dry unlike wiping varnish.

Yup! To anyone who is interested, I would say this is the main downside. Apply a coat... wait two days for it to dry... Apply another coat... and so on. It is time intensive (although... not really... a few minutes of work followed by lots of waiting). If you have the patience to do it, you are rewarded with an extremely durable and beautiful finish.

I have never used 100% pure linseed oil but I imagine it is similar...

My understanding is you can put them on thicker and they dry faster

I know you are talking about another product, but with tung oil, thick coats are ill-advised. It really is a 'go slow' product

I used to do a couple of base coats of 75%/25% (turpene/oil), a couple of coats of 50%/50% and then a couple of 100% tung. If the wood is sucking up the thinned oil, you can put down thick coats. As soon as the wood fibers start to become saturated and you are using pure tung oil, you really have to use thin coats otherwise the drying times are ridiculous. Worse, you also risk creating gummy, resin-like spots on your surface - these can be irritating to work with and rectify (they just clog sandpaper etc...)

 

[cotedupy]

I shall have to get some and see how it compares to the Feast Watson. I actually used it for other things (chopping board, magnetic knife rack, &c.) rather than handles, but I'm pretty sure didn't take days to dry, so obviously has other stuff mixed in.

It does sound like it might try my (lack of) patience a bit though!

 

[Luftmensch]

I shall have to get some and see how it compares to the Feast Watson. I actually used it for other things (chopping board, magnetic knife rack, &c.) rather than handles, but I'm pretty sure didn't take days to dry, so obviously has other stuff mixed in.

It does sound like it might try my (lack of) patience a bit though!

Like I say... hardware store brands are fine for most project! They are designed to be effective and convenient. I use them in most projects.

The only thing that gave me pause was wooden food preparation surface. If you don't want a 'wet' finish (mineral oil), food-safe drying oils and wax are a good substitute. Since I had the oils and wax... I decided to extend that paranoia to knife handles!


In the end the health risk from using general/furniture products on knife handles is probably very low once the products have set. The responsible thing to do is make sure you know what you are putting on them and understand the risks and exposure involved.