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Wicked distal taper

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icanhaschzbrgr

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Russian kitchen knife makers seems to be completely unknown here on KKF, so I decided to post some pictures from another forum:




A slicer by (probably the best kitchen knives maker in Russia) Gennady Prokopenkoff.
This knife has pretty complex geometry where different parts has different grinds and owners of such slicers consider them to be a truly gems.

The price is high and waiting list is painfully long, but I hope to get my hands on one of those one day :)




Here's a video from last year's knife show where Gennady Prokopenkoff demonstrates performance of his chef knife:
[video=youtube;0rWyzxE2hIY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rWyzxE2hIY[/video]
 

rick alen

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The concave taper makes sense, but has to be done right to prevent wedging.

Rick
 

icanhaschzbrgr

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I believe he can make any profile/geometry he wants as the skill is definitely there.

According to this article he copied this geometry from an old chef knife made by Russian master Ivanov in the end of 19th century. I'll try to translate a little bit here.



Ivanov's original chef knife is on top




Spine near the handle is 7,5mm and goes down to 1mm in 10mm from edge. Total blade length is 305mm, 50mm height and weights for full 375 grams.
The tip is flexible and can be used for filleting tasks. Part near the heal is more suitable for brutal tasks, also this part has straight grind and tapers nearly to 0mm close to the edge. The rest part of knife has S grind and also tapers nearly to 9mm close to the edge.

Master and owners of those chefs knives claims them to be an exceptional cutters.
 

labor of love

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I think the slicer is interesting. Is there also a taper along the edge? Like, is the heel super thick and the secondary bevel gets thinner towards the tip?
 

icanhaschzbrgr

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I think the slicer is interesting. Is there also a taper along the edge? Like, is the heel super thick and the secondary bevel gets thinner towards the tip?
Maybe, but I don't know. Description was very brief and it's not obvious from pictures. I'll ask more details about this geometry/profile when I have a chance.
 

labor of love

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I get that impression from watching the video. Although, the profile seems more geared towards pull cuts.
 

icanhaschzbrgr

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Today I met with our local knife nut who owns few knives by Prokopenkoff. I had a chance to hold that wicked chef knife and few slicers. What can I say… that chef is absolutely insane. Despite that huge spine knife is pretty good balanced in hand and doesn't feels too heavy.

Slicers feels super light and nimble with only minor flex near the tip. The thick spine has a pretty dramatic taper down and behind the edge the knife is thin along the whole length. I don't really have much use for a slicer in the home kitchen, but they almost forced me to place an order for one. Really nice knives.

Also handled a few petty knives by Prokopenkoff but wasn't impressed by them.
 

rick alen

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This sort of complex geometry would benefit from solid modeling and machining on a cnc miller or surface grinder to produce consistent curvatures and benefit the development process as well. Couple ideas in mind, for one, is to create a blade that is no thicker than it needs to be at any point for a superlight front-end and lazer-like qualities that do not sacrifice useful stiffness or contribute significantly to wedging - and for another to create geometry which allows for great food release at the mid-rear portions of the blade. To the latter end it would benefit to use geometry like the Richmond Ultimatum, that I understand is flat-ground on one side and has all the complex curvature on the other.

Rick
 

Timthebeaver

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This sort of complex geometry would benefit from solid modeling and machining on a cnc miller or surface grinder to produce consistent curvatures and benefit the development process as well. Couple ideas in mind, for one, is to create a blade that is no thicker than it needs to be at any point for a superlight front-end and lazer-like qualities that do not sacrifice useful stiffness or contribute significantly to wedging - and for another to create geometry which allows for great food release at the mid-rear portions of the blade. To the latter end it would benefit to use geometry like the Richmond Ultimatum, that I understand is flat-ground on one side and has all the complex curvature on the other.

Rick
These Prokopenkoff knives are very interesting, thank's for sharing.

I suspect that they are light years better than an Ultimatum, which isn't the exemplar of masterful grinding (to put it mildly) as I understand it. I believe tk59 completely reqround a stock version, as it was such a dog.
 

Pensacola Tiger

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... geometry like the Richmond Ultimatum, that I understand is flat-ground on one side and has all the complex curvature on the other.

Rick
Rick, your understanding is incorrect. The Ultimatum is ground on both sides. Poorly.



 

Canadian

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A strong distal taper is one of the [critical] aspects of kitchen knife design that the large Japanese brands just don't get--and I've been through a lot of them.

Beautiful knife.
 

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