Help me find a killer 240mm workhorse - $300 budget

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Crestwood23

Member
Joined
May 30, 2024
Messages
18
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Location
NJ, USA
Hey y’all - looking for some guidance on my first major “real” Japanese knife purchase. My lovely wife is buying me a birthday present, and I want to try to get something that is a good fit for me and makes me want to make an excuse to prep more vegetables LOL. I filled out the questionnaire - if you could be so kind please take a look? I’m think a k-tip gyuoto would be my cup of tea as I’m a bit of a rocker and love the badass k-tip shape. Thanks for your help!

LOCATION

What country are you in?
USA

KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?

Chef’s knife - 240mm K-tip Gyuto or Kiritsuke

Are you right or left handed?
Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

Japanese

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?

240mm

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)

No - prefer carbon or blue 2


What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?

$300

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?

Home

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, dicing herbs, smashing garlic, mincing garlic, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, trimming meats

What knife, if any, are you replacing?

None

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINKfor the common types of grips.)

Hammer grip, pinch grip

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)

Rocking, chopping, push cut


What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

Better aesthetics - definitely

Comfort - sure

Ease of Use and Care - I’m ok with higher maintenance if it looks cool and holds an incredible edge.

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?

As long as possible.

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board?

Wood

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes - I am trying to get better with more practice - sometimes I cave and bring to a pro

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives?

Yes


Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I currently have a bunch of decent 210mm stainless chefs knives (Wustof, Shun, etc). I inherited a very large antique carbon steel chefs knife from a family friend. I have fallen in love with the patina, edge retention, and incredible bite and sharpness that the carbon steel knife has. I want a super badass Japanese version at a more manageable but still large 240mm length.
 
If you rock chop often, I'd suggest a ktip might not be the best. The profile will be flatter and the tip potentially more fragile if you rock up too high and dig it into the board. Not to say it can't work for you but wouldn't be my go to move.

See if you can find a Shigeki Tanaka blue 2, should suit a variety of cutting styles well and cuts great.

Couple gems on BST:

The Munetoshi here is well loved, a bit rustic but cuts well and a great white 2 heat treat. @blokey is an excellent and trustworthy seller. Great price. https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/drawer-overflown-sale-munetoshi-240-gyuto-left.71393/

Masashi has a pretty flat profile but if you're okay with that this is a nice price and great specs. A2 steel is semi-stainless, not as reactive as carbon but will patina slowly over time. I kinda want this but have too many knives right now. https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/...2024-masashi-yamamoto-kaijin-vs1-240mm.71867/

I'm not a laser guy but if you want a real thin k-tip this would be hard to beat: https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/konosuke-hd2-kiritsuke-gyuto-240-mm.67317/
 
You’re probably not TOO far off from going custom with @MSicardCutlery. I don’t want to speak for him about his pricing, but his prices are fantastic and his work is excellent.
Could do a simple handle & a more basic steel like 52100 and you get to work with him in the design phase.

Won’t be made in Japan but it’ll be as good or better than a lot of the other stuff on the market in that range
 
You’re probably not TOO far off from going custom with @MSicardCutlery. I don’t want to speak for him about his pricing, but his prices are fantastic and his work is excellent.
Could do a simple handle & a more basic steel like 52100 and you get to work with him in the design phase.

Won’t be made in Japan but it’ll be as good or better than a lot of the other stuff on the market in that range
this is what I was going to suggest. I think I got an aeb-l in my own exact design and workhorse chonky boi specs and a nice stabilized burl handle for around what you're looking to pay.
 
Lots of good workhorse knives at that price but the k tip narrows down options. Why the k tip vs a standard gyuto profile?
Thanks for all of the suggestions so far - much appreciated.

I was drawn to the k tip because it looks super cool and I don’t own anything like it. I have a bunch of more standard looking chefs knives, so the k tip felt more special and uniquely Japanese to me.

Maybe I could tone down the rocking? This is why I was looking for a k tip with a bit rounder gyoto belly. Or if my k tip dreams narrow things down to far and really doesn’t fit my technique, a more standard gyuoto shape is really my best bet?

I’ll admit my purchase decision here is maybe 60% aesthetics and 40% functionality. Maybe that’s a newb mistake?

Speaking of aesthetics, a few more must haves for me would be a darker wood handle (like a walnut or rosewood), and blade that isn’t too polished - I love the imperfect rusticness of a nashiji or kurouchi finish.

Thanks for your help!
 
If you have your heart set on a K-tip, go for it. But my 2 cents would be to try a traditional gyuto profile and maybe get a bunka as a next knife as a way to try a K-tip profile.

Mazaki makes knives with a nice rustic touch that cut well. You’ll get patina as well. https://www.knivesandstones.com.au/...white-2-kurouchi-gyuto-240mm-stabilized-birch

If you can find a Shigeki Tanaka B2, that would be a great option.
 
If edge retention is the most important consideration -- which I don't think it should be for a home cook -- you might consider Sukenari's Hap40, though it's pushing your price limit

https://mtckitchen.com/collections/...h-speed-steel-gyuto-240mm-9-4-rosewood-handle
Wow that’s nice! I wouldn’t say edge retention is my most crucial attribute, I just want something that holds an edge better than the softer German knives I currently have. Maybe its better for me to save up for the $400 mark as it seems like the ones that check the most boxes are closer to that price point.
 
Just about any Japanese knife will have better retention that the Germans you're used to. You might consider something like this as a knife for small jobs and then get a regular gyuto

https://carbonknifeco.com/products/...tagayasan-handle?_pos=25&_sid=a474e82e0&_ss=r

Hap40 is incredible, but it is a drag to sharpen without special stones. While I love it, it really is overkill for a home cook (which I am).
Does white 2 really have better edge retention than German steel? Especially when someone is rock chopping?
 
Does white 2 really have better edge retention than German steel? Especially when someone is rock chopping?
Interesting semantic question!

If we figure in that white 2 from even an average blacksmith can achieve an edge finer than any that can be put on Friodur etc., then it surely does have better edge retention. Given that German, Swiss etc. kitchen knives can all be made pretty sharp but not very sharp, while white 1 can easily be made very sharp, the equation becomes

nonzero time sharp/ zero time sharp.

So yes — I’d rather be frequently tuning up a white steel knife, and enjoying the temporary sensation of “sharp knife cutting food,” than fighting to get the Dubble Bubble of culinary alloys to an almost-sharp condition.
 
Does white 2 really have better edge retention than German steel? Especially when someone is rock chopping?
I think so. It doesn't have anything like the retention of something like R2, much less Hap40. But I think it's better in terms of retention than soft German stainless.

ETA - for a similar look, with much better retention, you could look at a Shibata R2 Bunka. It's fully stainless. Keep in mind that it is very, very thin. It will definitely be a different cutting experience:

https://carbonknifeco.com/collections/shibata-knives/products/shibata-kotetsu-bunka-175mm
 
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Interesting semantic question!

If we figure in that white 2 from even an average blacksmith can achieve an edge finer than any that can be put on Friodur etc., then it surely does have better edge retention. Given that German, Swiss etc. kitchen knives can all be made pretty sharp but not very sharp, while white 1 can easily be made very sharp, the equation becomes

nonzero time sharp/ zero time sharp.

So yes — I’d rather be frequently tuning up a white steel knife, and enjoying the temporary sensation of “sharp knife cutting food,” than fighting to get the Dubble Bubble of culinary alloys to an almost-sharp condition.
Honestly it was largely a rhetorical question. ;)

In my experience, yes, white 2 wins ease of sharpening and peak sharpness... but when it comes to which holds a usable edge the longest... for me the German stuff when properly executed (so for example higher end Wüsthof series) actually wins out over all the white 2 I tried, especially when you're doing stuff like rock chopping and / or using plastic boards.
I think there's so many caveats to any argument claiming better edge retention for white 2 that it's not much of an argument.

Of course the picture changes with other steels, and I'll admit it's debatable how important edge retention truly is in a home environment; it all depends on what you prioritize.
 
As to the original post... admittedly I never used a K-tip, but if you are someone who rockchops I think a traditional gyuto profile is way more suitable.
Also, if this is your first J-knife, it might help if you think about the justification between some of your preferences (like... why do you prefer carbon?)
For your style of cutting you might actually be better off with something that has a yo-handle.
Which sucks because... like most people your aesthethical preferences go elsewhere, but they might not necessarily be the best knife for how you work.
 
Just about any Japanese knife will have better retention that the Germans you're used to
Not a fan of the average Zwilling or Wusthof knife but the edge retention exceeds your typical white2 by far.
Also, define german stainless if you generalize that much!
Böhler N690 exceeds all low alloy steels when it comes to edge retention and that is not anywhere near the best of german stainless.
 
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