Stones recommendations for high HRC, and vanadium carbide steels.

[Blank Blades.]

This is why some pages back I said that you shouldn't skimp on the stones and just get diamonds, which is what you got so hopefully it will work better. Once you said it is your side gig and 10V class is in play, there is no question you need quality diamond or CBN especially at finer grit. It is one thing when someone sharpens one folder in 10V once a year, but for you the time wasted and frustration can't possibly be worth the savings on the stones.

Yeah. I'm hoping they get here before the weekend. I'm going to be back out there Saturday, and it would be nice to have that with me. I can get by with what I have now, but like you said, the extra time and frustration counts for something.

Plus if people dont know much about steel, or sharpening and they see me taking forever with their knife, it can make me look bad. Most people just drop there knife off and come back later. There are some that stand there and watch me the whole time, and if makes me feel rushed and kinda uncomfortable in general. For some reason the people with the super steels seem to fall into the second category, not always, but most of the time.

 

[M1k3]

Yeah. I'm hoping they get here before the weekend. I'm going to be back out there Saturday, and it would be nice to have that with me. I can get by with what I have now, but like you said, the extra time and frustration counts for something.

Plus if people dont know much about steel, or sharpening and they see me taking forever with their knife, it can make me look bad. Most people just drop there knife off and come back later. There are some that stand there and watch me the whole time, and if makes me feel rushed and kinda uncomfortable in general. For some reason the people with the super steels seem to fall into the second category, not always, but most of the time.

I'd not only get something finer in the future, something coarser should be in your near future.

 

[Blank Blades.]

I'd not only get something finer in the future, something coarser should be in your near future.

I've got the atoma 140. It usually makes quick work of anything I throw at it.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I've got the atoma 140. It usually makes quick work of anything I throw at it.

If you get a hankering for another fast working stone, the Baryonyx Manticore chews up pretty much everything.

 

[inferno]

Even S30V can be challenging on regular water stones; and its a basic "super steel" that does not excite anyone.

all the regular japanese supersteels are slower than blue and whites of course. but not impossible. with shaptons s30v works, r2/sg2 works, srs15 works. i would guess hap40 to work too.

i have no idea how other brands of stones will work though. i would guess king hyper and choseras to work just as good as shaptons. dont know about the classic kings. i have a few stones at home that i'm guessing will not work very well or be very slow.

 

[Blank Blades.]

all the regular japanese supersteels are slower than blue and whites of course. but not impossible. with shaptons s30v works, r2/sg2 works, srs15 works. i would guess hap40 to work too.

i have no idea how other brands of stones will work though. i would guess king hyper and choseras to work just as good as shaptons. dont know about the classic kings. i have a few stones at home that i'm guessing will not work very well or be very slow.

I mean. It's not that it can't be done with my waterstones. It's just not practical in my case. I personally would prefer if I didn't need to go with diamond or cbn, just because I like my Japanese stones more.

 

[Rangen]

It's surprising how straightforward it is to sharpen kitchen knives by hand on an Edge Pro form factor stone, and they're much cheaper than bench stones. Also a good way to explore.

 

[Blank Blades.]

It's surprising how straightforward it is to sharpen kitchen knives by hand on an Edge Pro form factor stone, and they're much cheaper than bench stones. Also a good way to explore.

I may buy some in the future. If I do end up spending money I would rather spend the extra bit of money on the bench stone size. You know the saying buy once cry once.

 

[M-S-T]

I agree. Some faster stones can do it though. Even though I'm a big believer in superabrasives I'm not going to scream that you need diamonds for everything with a 4%+ of V. Can it be done? Yes. Is it very efective? Ofcourse not.

 

[inferno]

It's surprising how straightforward it is to sharpen kitchen knives by hand on an Edge Pro form factor stone, and they're much cheaper than bench stones. Also a good way to explore.

often you can get a full set small stones for the price of 1 bench stone.
for large and/or very curved knives taking the stone to the blade is usually easier imo.

 

[Blank Blades.]

Btw I got my venev Phoenix 240/400 in a day or two ago. I dont own any super steels myself, but I couldn't help myself. So I tried it with my vg10, and white 2. I actually kinda like it. The finish is better than diamond coated plates imo.

I tested positive for covid so I can't go to sharpen knives for people this weekend which is a big disappointment, because I really wanted to test this thing out. (Btw it looks like I'm asymptomatic so no worries. At worst I feel a little off when I first wake up in the morning, then after that I'm fine.)

 

[inferno]

do a shootout with some other stones to judge speed and finish.

 

[Blank Blades.]

do a shootout with some other stones to judge speed and finish.

Idk if I have to many comparable grit stones. Maybe I could put the 240 side against my cerax 320, dmt coarse, and king 300. Then the 400 side (about 700 jis I believe) against my chosera 800, and king 1200, I also sort of have about a mm thick falling apart "new cerax" 1000 grit, that might be useable for testing purposes, and of coarse my aoto (which will definitely lose).

 

[Blank Blades.]

do a shootout with some other stones to judge speed and finish.

I looked it up, the 240 is pretty comparable too my 300ish jis stones so I can do that.

 

[inferno]

you could simply test which stones give you the most similar finish compared to the d-plate.
and then test if those very stones are either faster or slower than the plate.

thats a good test imo.

 

[Blank Blades.]

you could simply test which stones give you the most similar finish compared to the d-plate.
and then test if those very stones are either faster or slower than the plate.

thats a good test imo.

Here is the finish of a few stones on a wide bevel compared to the 240 side. I'll do a speed test in a little. (I think the venev comes in second for finish, cerax is the winner for me, surprise, surprise.)

Dmt coarse, the worst of the 4

Venev 240 my second favorite

King 300, 3rd place imo

Cerax 320, not too bad.

 

[inferno]

the 240 side definitely seems to be in the 300 grit range.

 

[Blank Blades.]

the 240 side definitely seems to be in the 300 grit range.

It is 240 FEPA F, I think it translates to roughly 300ish or so JIS. I dont remember the exact conversion. The 400 is about 700 grit JIS. So the closest I'll be comparing it to, are my king 1200, chosera 800, "new cerax" 1000, and an aoto.

I'll be doing the test on finish with those. Then I'll go back to the 240(and the other ones in that range), and test speed on a cheap kiwi knife I dont care about wasting. Then follow up with the 400 for speed(and the other ones).

Too bad I dont have a super steel to run a test on.

 

[shinyunggyun]

So its christmas time, and I may just have a bit of extra money to buy myself a couple presents. So I thought why not get some stones that can help me sharpen those super tough modern steels.

I find that my I run into a bit of trouble with my current stones when I have to sharpen one of these knives for someone. I have a atoma 140, and a dmt coarse (around 325 grit) that I can use to get the coarse work done. After that I start to have trouble. My chosera 800 does work, just not to the best extent.

So I was hoping someone could give me some pointers on what I should look into getting. I would really prefer not to have to get diamond stones if at all possible, just because the price is insane. Maybe shapton glass? Kuromaku? Would either of those do better than the chosera?

I vouch for king hyper after having many successful, fast sharpenings with ZDP 189 and HAP 40 steels.

 

[Blank Blades.]

I vouch for king hyper after having many successful, fast sharpenings with ZDP 189 and HAP 40 steels.

I ended up getting venev resin bonded diamond stones. Its good for 10v, maxamet, and s90v type steels. I actually do want to pick up a king hyper at some point in the future though. I've heard there is a hyper 2000. I don't have a 2000 yet so that would be nice to add to my little stone collection.

 

[inferno]

i have the king hyper 1k not the soft one. its a good soaker. semi hard for a soaker. its about the same speed as naniwa 800 and shapton pro 1k give or take. it makes a very contrasty kasumi, but full of silver streaks! all in all i rather just whip out the shapton because it dries faster.

2 good 2k stones, shapton pro and nianiwa pro. very good.

 

[Blank Blades.]

Here are the 400 grit (700 JIS) comparisons. I'm getting a bit tired so I didn't make the finish on the wide bevel as perfect as possible. However they are good enough to give an idea of what each stone can do.

I honestly have a hard time picking between them. I think the new cerax 1000 looks the best, however the stone wears way to fast so it looses some points in my book. The next best in the lineup is the king 1200, and it wears much slower. The aoto did the worst on the finish, but hey it's awesome for edge work.

Here is the venev 240 it looks very nice for a diamond stone.

Next is the chosera 800

Cerax 1000

This is my cerax to give you an idea of how worn down it is.

King 1200

Tanba aoto

 

[M1k3]

.
I tested positive for covid so I can't go to sharpen knives for people this weekend which is a big disappointment, because I really wanted to test this thing out. (Btw it looks like I'm asymptomatic so no worries. At worst I feel a little off when I first wake up in the morning, then after that I'm fine.)

For me, around the end of the first week, I lost smell and taste and was asleep around 6 or 7 at night. Hope you recover fast.

 

[Blank Blades.]

For me, around the end of the first week, I lost smell and taste and was asleep around 6 or 7 at night. Hope you recover fast.

Me too. The test I took was last Wednesday. So it's been well over a week at least. Tonight I'm just starting to feel a bit under the weather. More off, and tired than anything. I took some acetaminophen, and decided to call it a night, for messing with my stones.

 

[Ruso]

Get well soon!

 

[kayman67]

Here are the 400 grit (700 JIS) comparisons.
...

While this is a more natural usage around here, might be somewhat underusing their potential.
At some point I saw something very interesting with leather cutting tools that translated into other types of usage more than I could have imagined. Using these plates made everything very easy, but at the same time, very efficient.
There was a very distinct increase in performance with close to no effort. Those tools never worked so well after just a few passes or any amount on any grit or type of a more traditional stone. This is one area where the gain is very different than just what the scratch pattern might suggest. Another interesting thing might be that the alloy didn't really matter. Anything was faster and maxed out in that amount of time. This is their secret power. Makes no real difference what the alloy is, being on top of the abrasives chain. But, I guess, a wider range of alloys might be needed to fully grasp just how much of a difference you get once you go up with the more demanding ones, top being, in my experience anyway, CPM REX 121.

 

[Blank Blades.]

While this is a more natural usage around here, might be somewhat underusing their potential.
At some point I saw something very interesting with leather cutting tools that translated into other types of usage more than I could have imagined. Using these plates made everything very easy, but at the same time, very efficient.
There was a very distinct increase in performance with close to no effort. Those tools never worked so well after just a few passes or any amount on any grit or type of a more traditional stone. This is one area where the gain is very different than just what the scratch pattern might suggest. Another interesting thing might be that the alloy didn't really matter. Anything was faster and maxed out in that amount of time. This is their secret power. Makes no real difference what the alloy is, being on top of the abrasives chain. But, I guess, a wider range of alloys might be needed to fully grasp just how much of a difference you get once you go up with the more demanding ones, top being, in my experience anyway, CPM REX 121.

I just wanted to use it on something big enough that I could actually get a good picture of what kind of scratch pattern it leaves. Then compare it to others.

I plan on just using it for sharpening customers supersteel knives when they get brought to me.

 

[SeattleB]

What do the knife makers use to sharpen these steels? I'm new to all of this. I read posts that state certain steels are difficult to sharpen, or that stainless-clad knives are no good because stainless "gums up the stones" or whatever. I always wonder what the blacksmiths use. They don't seem to have a problem.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

What do the knife makers use to sharpen these steels? I'm new to all of this. I read posts that state certain steels are difficult to sharpen, or that stainless-clad knives are no good because stainless "gums up the stones" or whatever. I always wonder what the blacksmiths use. They don't seem to have a problem.

It isn't exactly accurate to say the makers don't have a problem with some steels. They very much do. Ask Sal Glesser of Spyderco what it takes to cut and grind Maxamet. But it is all added costs and that's why high-alloy steels often cost so much more than others. Most large manufacturers will use a lot of fresh belts and most leave a pretty course edge (on most all steels).

Small makers will often finish on stones.