The Washita Thread

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stringer said:
Yeah I will probably have to get one to try. The price is right. I am also going to buy some Arkansas slip stones unless someone can talk me out of it. They wear so slowly anyway if you are just using them to finish razors, then what does it matter? They usually go for 1/3 to 1/2 the price of a bench stone of the same surface area.
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Don't do it. Slips aren't flattened or finished as well as bench stones from a good company like Dan's. Arks - especially black/translucents - are a nightmare to lap yourself. Your time and abrasives are probably worth more than getting a well lapped bench or pocket stone out of the box. I've spent enough time trying to lap/smooth Arkansas slipstones for carving tools that I can attest it isn't worth it. Burnishing them, sure... Getting them straight, nope.
 
checked all mine + the blacks are all much finer then the translucent + white Arkansas stones that i have -
 
stringer said:
Yeah I will probably have to get one to try. The price is right. I am also going to buy some Arkansas slip stones unless someone can talk me out of it. They wear so slowly anyway if you are just using them to finish razors, then what does it matter? They usually go for 1/3 to 1/2 the price of a bench stone of the same surface area.
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At the risk of detracting from the thread theme, have you considered a Spyderco Double Stuff? I don't have one but a lot of folks swear by them. Just an alternative thought. :)
 
You can make a stone holder really easy. I made my first in high school. I cut off a piece of 2x4 and chiseled out around my first stone to where it was inset. I then sanded and refinished the 2x4 with varnish. I have it here somewhere. It is not in the picture above.

The 2x4 gets it up off the table to where it is more comfortable to sharpen on.
 
Steampunk said:
Don't do it. Slips aren't flattened or finished as well as bench stones from a good company like Dan's. Arks - especially black/translucents - are a nightmare to lap yourself. Your time and abrasives are probably worth more than getting a well lapped bench or pocket stone out of the box. I've spent enough time trying to lap/smooth Arkansas slipstones for carving tools that I can attest it isn't worth it. Burnishing them, sure... Getting them straight, nope.
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Thanks for the double knowledge bomb.

Similar experience flattening a translucent Ark. Plate killer.
 
My new lucky Facebook find arrived today, and even better than I thought. Basically untouched NOS Lily White with all the original packaging. I can't decide whether I want to use it or not!

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And a family pic:

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captaincaed said:
Only if you shoot a short vid for the thread :upsidedownspin:
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Needless to say I couldn’t resist and did give one side a quick try last night - they are seriously fast and good when completely new. I will do again and film it, then might degrease and leave it as a pretty thing to look at for a while.

Though tbh I’m vanishingly unlikely ever to want to sell, so it probably doesn’t make much difference what I do.
 
Desert Rat said:
Great find cotedupy.
If it was mine I couldn't really use it much. So many used washita's out there with out labels that surly you can find one with any characteristic you desire.
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Yep I’m going to leave one side completely untouched, and probably just use the other a couple of times before retiring it for a little while. But it’d be nice to do a little vid with some impressions I reckon :)

As you say - Equally good stones that have lost their labels are relatively easily available still. So there doesn’t seem much point in using a mint 5x2 when I already have a great unlabelled 8x2.

I have made my peace with it now... this is my induction to becoming a fully-fledged, pretentious, ‘stone collector’.
 
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cotedupy said:
Yep I’m going to leave one side completely untouched, and probably just use the other a couple of times before retiring it for a little while. But it’d be nice to do a little vid with some impressions I reckon :)

As you say - Equally good stones that have lost their labels are relatively easily available still. So there doesn’t seem much point in using a mint 5x2 when I already have a great unlabelled 8x2.

I have made my peace with it now... this is my induction to becoming a fully-fledged, pretentious, ‘stone collector’.
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Looking forward to a video! 👍
 
A poorly-shot iphone video of the LW, as requested. I am even worse talking on camera than in real life. (You may need to change the settings at the bottom up to 1080 to make it better quality.)

https://drive.google.com/file/d/17SmRvtiCOFhHZkCzEWUYp-F65g82zxq4/view?usp=sharing
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And (as requested on the other thread ;)) HHT off the edge. I had to strop it more on my sleeve to get there - the edge was pretty agressive at the end of the main video.


 
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Just found this thread! I picked up a vintage washita earlier this year. I've been crazy busy, so I haven't finished cleaning it up yet. I degreased it a bunch, but there's still quite a lot of oil in there. I only lapped one side (even though it was glued into a box, both sides were heavily dished, so I'm guessing at some point it was flipped over in its box), I'm not sure when I'll get to the other side. But I did enough work to test it out a bit, although not very in-depth. I finished a few kitchen knives on it, and it worked really well - a nice, polished edge. It seemed to finish stainless steel a little better, but at the same time it hasn't been burnished that much yet so maybe it will handle carbon steel better eventually.

I want to try it in a progression with my razors soon, using the washita as a mid-range stone and my black ark as a finisher, but I'm just too wrapped up in my Jnats whenever I have a few spare minutes to hone, so I'm not sure when I'll actually get around to it. But I'm super happy to have the washita in my collection.
 
As far as I know, novaculite stones are not hard enough to sharpen some of the harder steels. Also, the structure of the stones makes them not as abrasive, take this with a grain of salt, and thus they burnish edges. Can you get a killer edge, yeah, is it worth it? if you like working a knife or any edged item for a couple of hours. Would I use one? no.
 
memorael said:
As far as I know, novaculite stones are not hard enough to sharpen some of the harder steels. Also, the structure of the stones makes them not as abrasive, take this with a grain of salt, and thus they burnish edges. Can you get a killer edge, yeah, is it worth it? if you like working a knife or any edged item for a couple of hours. Would I use one? no.
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Umm... So they can vary quite a lot. Purer novaculites are almost 100% Silica; almost all natural whetstones get their abrasive properties from Silica/quartz, so they'll abrade any steel that other natural stones do. The knife I was using in the video above wasn't some mega-hard 67 HRC steel (I don't have much experience with that kind of thing tbh), but not a very soft one either - it was Blue 2.

Because of the high SiO2 content novaculites will often abrade remarkably quickly too, but as you said - it certainly depends on the structure of them. Some novaculites are quite incredibly hard, if you read about cutting hard arks with diamond saws in the 19th century they'd be measuring progress in inches/day. But this extreme level of hardness, while making a stone finer, also makes it less friable and considerably slower. Softer novaculites can be extraordinarily quick - Washitas and Turkish are by some distance the fastest cutting natural stones I know.

(That's my experience/understanding anyway. And as I say - I'm not an expert on some of the mega hard steels. I sharpen almost exclusively Shirogami 2, Aogami 2, and Aogami Super.)
 
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cotedupy said:
Umm... So they can vary quite a lot. Purer novaculites are almost 100% Silica; almost all natural whetstones get their abrasive properties from Silica/quartz, so they'll abrade any steel that other natural stones do. The knife I was using in the video above wasn't some mega-hard 67 HRC steel (I don't have much experience with that kind of thing tbh), but not a very soft one either - it was Blue 2.

Because of the high SiO2 content novaculites will often abrade remarkably quickly too, but as you said - it certainly depends on the structure of them. Some novaculites are quite incredibly hard, if you read about cutting hard arks with diamond saws in the 19th century they'd be measuring progress in inches/day. But this extreme level of hardness, while making a stone finer, also makes it less friable and considerably slower. Softer novaculites can be extraordinarily quick - Washitas and Turkish are by some distance the fastest cutting natural stones I know.

(That's my experience/understanding anyway. And as I say - I'm not an expert on some of the mega hard steels. I sharpen almost exclusively Shirogami 2, Aogami 2, and Aogami Super.)
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I too am no expert but do recall trying to sharpen some of the newer steels and belgian coticules, novaculite stone I had and some of the water stones being used in the day would have a really tough time or not sharpen at all. Choseras were the way to go, I hear sigmas would also do a good job. I am sure theres new stones that do the trick with no issues, I also recall someone using a small "nagura dmt XC" to form a slurry on novaculite stones and getting better results.
 
memorael said:
I too am no expert but do recall trying to sharpen some of the newer steels and belgian coticules, novaculite stone I had and some of the water stones being used in the day would have a really tough time or not sharpen at all. Choseras were the way to go, I hear sigmas would also do a good job. I am sure theres new stones that do the trick with no issues, I also recall someone using a small "nagura dmt XC" to form a slurry on novaculite stones and getting better results.
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It's not just about the steels hardness, it's also about the amount and type of carbides in the steel.
 
I inherited this stone, which was in the same box as my grandfather’s straight razor. I soaked it in water and lapped both sides. One side has a ridge; the other is smooth. I’m not an experienced sharpener, but it put a good edge on a Sabatier stainless paring knife. It seems discolored on the ridged side. Can it be converted to a water stone for kitchen knives? I’m the wrong gender for a straight razor.
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Nice stone.
It looks pretty clean, not sure if it was used with oil before. Did you use it with oil or water for the paring knife or dry?
If it doesn’t repell water when you try to make it wet it can be used as water stone right away.
Else you will have to clean out the oil by some means, a few of which have been mentioned some posts before, but there are more experienced people here that can help with that.
But there is also nothing wrong with using it as an oil stone for sharpening kitchen knives.
 
I used it with water. It was dirty before I lapped it, but didn’t seem oily. I liked the feel.
 
The Smith's Washita were sold as oil stones. Whether they work as water stones I don't know.

I sharpen my kitchen knives with oil stones for years. After sharpening just wash with soap to get the oil off. If it is carbon steel then use an oil you can live with.
 
77kath said:
I used it with water. It was dirty before I lapped it, but didn’t seem oily. I liked the feel.
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That’s what I was expecting. If you like it with water and it works you can just use it this way. It might be possible that it would work better with oil though but I can also understand if you don’t want to try that. It could be a bit tricky to move back to water once you used oil.
 
I think I will try it with water again, on an old Opinel. That should give me a better idea how it works. Thank you both.
 
Also, things like windex, lightly soapy water and spit (ew) are actually pretty effective lubricants on stones with oil in them already. Using a stiff toothbrush and Barkeeper's friend will also help clean swarf out, if it starts to load up too much. Good luck, glad you have a family heirloom!
 
77kath said:
I inherited this stone, which was in the same box as my grandfather’s straight razor. I soaked it in water and lapped both sides. One side has a ridge; the other is smooth. I’m not an experienced sharpener, but it put a good edge on a Sabatier stainless paring knife. It seems discolored on the ridged side. Can it be converted to a water stone for kitchen knives? I’m the wrong gender for a straight razor.
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Nice stone, as many mentioned if it isn't already oiled up I don't see why you couldn't use it with water, IDK if it is recommended but I always like using slurries via a diamond nagura. You could use your late grandfathers razor as a leg shaver, just make sure your not hung over, also remember to strop. Let us know how it goes.
 
77kath said:
I inherited this stone, which was in the same box as my grandfather’s straight razor. I soaked it in water and lapped both sides. One side has a ridge; the other is smooth. I’m not an experienced sharpener, but it put a good edge on a Sabatier stainless paring knife. It seems discolored on the ridged side. Can it be converted to a water stone for kitchen knives? I’m the wrong gender for a straight razor.
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77kath said:
I think I will try it with water again, on an old Opinel. That should give me a better idea how it works. Thank you both.
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Yes, you can use it with water. I wouldn't. No, you're not going to ruin it by using water a couple times, but the stone will load up much quicker with water than if you use oil. Laxative grade mineral oil from the grocery store works well here and you don't need to douse it like you would with water. Just let the surface soak it in. Rub it around with your finger and let the stone absorb the oil. Now the swarf will be suspended in the oil. It will still load over time but will much easier to remove than if you'd been using just water.

When you're done sharpening, rub a little more oil on the dark streaks, wipe with a paper towel and then wash the stone with dish soap and hot water and let dry.

That's a great looking stone and even more awesome that it was grandpa's. It will last many more years.
 
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