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For those that recommended I try the Toyamas, you were absolutely right. Wow, what a difference sharpening those versus the cheapo stainless knives I was practicing on. I can actually get the edge I want on those knives.
 
Bravo, sir! Learning is good! To me, the two most important things for me to keep in mind: 1) Variable pressure is my friend, as has been mentioned by others. For me, this is an important aspect of refining the edge. 2) Let my upper body do the work; the hands/arms are largely "knife-holders" to keep the angle consistent. Keep getting better and enjoy the process!
Tom
 
unprofessional_chef said:
I sharpened my mom's JA Henckels International Fine Edge Pro on my chosera 2K a few days ago. The edge easily cuts paper, hair, food the same as my VG10 knives at home.

The Henckels Fine Edge Pro knives are made in China with "nothing special" stainless steel.

This guy in the video has terrible technique but the point is you can still get a good edge even on cheap steel. Him stropping edge leading on leather is cringe worthy. :nono: He did cheat a bit by using a strop.

[video=youtube;7dFFEBnY0Bo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dFFEBnY0Bo[/video]
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Out of curiosity and desire to learn more, what's so terrible about the technique shown in this video?
 
Garm said:
Out of curiosity and desire to learn more, what's so terrible about the technique shown in this video?
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I'm a firm believer in edge trailing passes only. You can see him using edge leading passes on the stones and leather strop. Everyone will tell you and this is not debatable to never use edge leading stokes on leather strops. Because you can cut and ruin the leather.

He probably spent almost 2 hours going through a 5 stone progression then a final strop. Which I don't think is necessary.
 
Edge trailing only with strop I understand. Edge trailing only on stones? Don't think so.
 
StonedEdge said:
Edge trailing only with strop I understand. Edge trailing only on stones? Don't think so.
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Why not? If stone only techniques yield great results? I finish my knives with single passes on each side. I start this process with edge leading and then end with edge trailing on hard ohira suita. This yields arm hair shave sharpness. No strop at all.

Strops kill the refined tooth I can achieve with jnats.


Straight razors are a different story entirely.
 
I'm talking about not using edge leading strokes at all. I use edge leading on stones to finish as well
 
StonedEdge said:
Edge trailing only with strop I understand. Edge trailing only on stones? Don't think so.
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I thought it pretty typical to apply pressure only on trailing strokes. At least that is what I took from the tutorial videos that Jon and Korin put out when I first started sharpening. I do zero edge leading strokes, ever. However, I see no issue with people using leading strokes if that works for them. :)
 
cenc said:
My apologies, I misunderstood what you were getting at.
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No apology needed! Now that I think about it I think I may have also misunderstood the post i commented on too haha
 
Good thing you switched to practising on the knives you intend to use. I don't see people at the driving range practising with beater clubs then playing with their good ones.

Also, I apply pressure on both the edge trailing and edge leading stroke for a few passes then switch hands and mirror the same action on the other side. To each his own of course but i wouldn't shy away from edge leading pressure.
 
I would stay away from the 400. unless you are removing a huge chip or re-profiling the knife the 1000 is plenty to create a good bevel. Do you have a loop to look at the edge? Can be had on Amazon or Ebay for $6.00 US. Nothing fancy just a simple 30x jewelers loop.

You first need to establish a definite bevel. As close to a single plane across the entire edge on both side converging to a very fine apex. At 1000 grit this is about as sharp as the knife will get. From there you are polishing the bevel and the edge but it is not getting much thinner at the apex. Different polish levels will yield different results on tomatoes, potatoes, meat and fish. A more polished edge should also last longer with proper cutting technique. The 6000 will take a lot of work to remove the 1000 scratches, but you don't really need to. You are just refining the 1k edge and leaving some useful toothyness. To see the effect, take an old dinner knife and work the side of the knife on the 1k stone and look at the result. The work the 6k and see the difference. This is what is happening on your edge.

Also you need a way to know when the bevel i set. Two come to mind. Tomato test. Get a basket of cherry tomatoes. When the bevel is set it should easily cut the skin of the cherry tomato with little pressure. Just hold the tomato in one hand and gently slice at several points on the edge. Some sections will come on line earlier than others. Check the whole edge.

Another is the fingernail test. If you place the edge on your finger nail with just the weight of the edge point down, with a finished bevel the edge will grab the nail and not slide. If not a finished bevel the edge will slide off your nail. Again check the whole edge.

Others will tell you to create a burr on one side and then switch sides and move the the burr to the other side. This works too. But I don't like dealing with burrs and wire edges that need to be removed.
 
StonedEdge said:
I'm talking about not using edge leading strokes at all. I use edge leading on stones to finish as well
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What I meant to say is pressure only on edge trailing stroke on stones. And zero pressure on the edge leading stroke to bring the knife back to it's original position for another pass. I'm a firm believer in this technique.

What I was getting at is the guy in the video is clearly applying pressure on the edge leading strokes. And the way he holds the knife with the edge facing away results in a lot of wobble and little control maintaining a consistent sharpening angle.
 
Chef, I'd be a little careful with making such strong empirical statements.

I've always applied equal pressure when sharpening and I can assure you, my edges are long lasting and sharp.

There are different ways but no inherently absolute way to a sharp knife. Ever see Bob Kramer sharpen?

I'm not changing my technique until I hear Jon weigh in.


unprofessional_chef said:
What I meant to say is pressure only on edge trailing stroke on stones. And zero pressure on the edge leading stroke to bring the knife back to it's original position for another pass. I'm a firm believer in this technique.

What I was getting at is the guy in the video is clearly applying pressure on the edge leading strokes. And the way he holds the knife with the edge facing away results in a lot of wobble and little control maintaining a consistent sharpening angle.
Click to expand...
 
In fact I watched his knife sharpening video on his Zwilling stones yesterday. Not sure how well that works on a full bolster knife. I've used the edge facing away strokes in my sharpening journey. It has always marred or scratched the blade. I feel the pressure points aren't ergonomically natural resulting in wobble.
 
Pressure on edge trailing leads with me to a more convexed bevel, pressure on edge leading to a straighter bevel.
 
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