Am I expected to reprofile the bevels on a OOTB knife?

[Taffalito]

Hi,
I'm quite new to higher end (japanese) knives and have ordered my first quality gyutos and petties. As I read about OOTB, brand new knives, it seems to be rather common behavior among knife enthusiasts to automatically at least touch up or do some lighter sharpening, or in some cases do a complete reprofile/full progression on the bevel.

At least to a newbie like me, a rational approach is to accept the factory edge (although maybe with some minor "touch up") until it blunts and then, but not until then, do a full progression.

Are factory grinds really that "bad" on $200 gyutos, or are knife nerds very picky? Since I'm so new to whetstones, I don't feel comfortable at all to regrind a brand new $200 knife.

If I pay that sum for a higher end kitchen knife, I assume it is ready to use OOTB, but the more I read the more confused I get.

What is your take on this issue?

 

[blokey]

If it is usable, just use it. People just had their own preference with edge behavior, some like zero edge, some like put micro bevel, some like lower grit toothy stone, some like high grit finish, some just has particular liking for edges off that one stone.

 

[ModRQC]

It’s a bit of a self-explaining thing. With more experience of more and more « better » knives than the last » and experience on stones comes a point where you’re not satisfied with what you get and know how to make it much better. If you don’t « see » it then you don’t need to do anything more than what you said. Until you’ll do.

Also it’s not entirely impossible to get a « bad » grind. Or a knife too thick for its own good. It’s rather common from cheaper knives. It still should go the natural flow of what I said above.

 

[Taffalito]

The question to me is, will there be a night and day difference between my until now best performing chef knife, a Zwilling Pro, and my soon to be delivered Sugimoto CM gyuto? I'm now talking performance OOTB.

 

[blokey]

If it is like my Sugimoto carbon you’re gonna be pretty happy

 

[Taffalito]

If it is like my Sugimoto carbon you’re gonna be pretty happy

Happy to hear that!

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Good replies above and I'll just expand by saying that what you're often reading about is us just lightly reworking the edge. Quite often it's some strokes on a higher stone to bring the edge up some. But for sure, cost does not automatically equal performance, Japanese or otherwise. Especially with handmade products. That's why it is good to do some research here and if needed, ask questions. Many of us have $80USD that will leave a $200 Wusthof Ikon in the dust.

Keep in mind, that a thin-edged Japanese knife in a harder steel is, generally speaking, much easier to sharpen than a softer, thicker-edged knife.

Also, remember the edge just initiates the cut but it's the knife's geometry that is responsible for most of the performance. Geometry cuts!

And never hesitate to ask for sharpening advice. If you haven't already, look through the sub-forum and you'll find several threads by new sharpeners that should help but you can always ask too. KKF folks are very helpful!

 

[Corradobrit1]

OOTB edges on hard steel JKnives like TF W#1 and AS can be quite chippy. Always a good idea to give them a fresh bevel on stones and that will remove the microchipping, at least in my experience.

 

[KasumiJLA]

I think you'll have fun with the OOTB edge, especially if it your first Japanese knife. But you can always improve performance if it's not to your liking. Take the time to appreciate how the knife works, to see what you like or don't like and then you can have fun tweaking it to your liking when the honeymoon is over. I think @blokey summed up what I think well

 

[stringer]

The question to me is, will there be a night and day difference between my until now best performing chef knife, a Zwilling Pro, and my soon to be delivered Sugimoto CM gyuto? I'm now talking performance OOTB.

The knife is just a tool. It's performance depends on the skill of the person using it and what they are trying to use it for. Not trying to be an ass. But the best way to improve performance is by practicing cutting things. Not upgrading knives. The sugimoto might be a better performer for you eventually. But there could be a learning curve where you need to make adjustments to your technique to get the full benefit of a different knife design. Is a pickup truck better than a hatchback? Depends on who is driving and where they are going.

 

[ModRQC]

The great truth behind KKF is the more you see the more you do - and buy obviously, but the former is much more interesting. We’ve got members just like you a year or two ago that are now making knives, or handles, or went semi-pro with sharpening and got more advanced equipment, and we’ve even got more than a few that just crafted their own guided sharpening system. In the end, the sharpening bit that is the base skill most promoted here leads many people into doing much more.

 

[Taffalito]

The knife is just a tool. It's performance depends on the skill of the person using it and what they are trying to use it for. Not trying to be an ass. But the best way to improve performance is by practicing cutting things. Not upgrading knives. The sugimoto might be a better performer for you eventually. But there could be a learning curve where you need to make adjustments to your technique to get the full benefit of a different knife design. Is a pickup truck better than a hatchback? Depends on who is driving and where they are going.

Nothing wrong with my cutting skills, in the context of cutting skills using dull knives that is.

 

[Delat]

I agree with all of the above, just use the knife and see how you like it. Do some test cuts first on copy paper and paper towels so you have a baseline and frame of reference for initial test-cut sharpness vs actual use, and also so you can use test cuts later to decide if the knife is dull enough to sharpen.

I personally don’t think a complete sharpening novice should worry about setting his own bevel initially or doing any kind of “progression”. For your first knife when it needs sharpening, I’d go with the sharpie method and try to hit the existing angle/edge, and use a medium or fine stone (1-2k range).

Later when you’re confident in your skills and want to build muscle memory and have a consistent bevel across all your knives, that’s the time to try setting your own bevel with a coarse stone. Even a coarse stone there is really only necessary if your own sharpening angle turns out to be more shallow than the OOTB edge angle so you end up needing to take off the original bevel shoulders.