Been a while since we had a Cleaver chat.
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natto
Senior Member
@Perzua
From Poland this taiwanese knife might be of interest. About 215*105, 370g, thin grind, flat profile. Low reactivity indicates some chromium in the steel. I love it.
A german forum got some pictures.
From Poland this taiwanese knife might be of interest. About 215*105, 370g, thin grind, flat profile. Low reactivity indicates some chromium in the steel. I love it.
A german forum got some pictures.
Interesting, sadly not many smaller Taiwanese shops don't sell their stuff overseas, they make some interesting stuff with Hitachi blue and white steels.
Witch one ?
natto
Senior Member
Damn, €35,99 ? Really ? It will works ?
That looks like a nice, cheap cleaver, but the CCK 1303 is the classic 'gateway cleaver.'
natto
Senior Member
At least it is a pretty good first cleaver, without wasting money. So far no one was disappointed. Some strokes on a fine stone to clean up the edge, and the knife is ready to cut. Cutting performance is like Robert Herders simple carbon series. Only the edge lasts longer.
Have fun
From Germany it is a third of a cck. From reading it should be in the same league. But I can't compare them dirctly.
natto
Senior Member
I like local shops. Between two jobs there was time to check every exotic shop I saw, to check for ingredients and tools. Most shops are relatet to a region and offer some unique stuff from there. That knife is from about two or more decades ago. Boat people from Vietnam and others showed me some cooking. I knew where to buy, and they showed me how to use. Crazy and great times.
With enough time and no money I missed to take a chop block. That might have been the last proper chop block available, a unicorn in germany. From time to time some nice things come and go, without much notice from us. Thats ok to me, nice tools should be used. At least I was lucky enough to start with a good cleaver. Now that knife is available online. At least one of this reasonable cleavers is available from Germany. Or within Europe.
It looks like there are less offers for reasonable carbon cleavers from year to year So I recommended that knife on german forums, to push the demand. That worked like a charm. The knife sold off and came back a few times. Now it might be available as long as its made. (fingers crossed)
The steel of that knife is not reactive. It might be semi stainless, about 5% chromium. Lots of citrus can build patina and color it from grey to black. Some scrubbing every other week can keep the knife from building patina. But no idea where they buy steel.
TsienYen offers a few knives from Taiwan. I like the shop for offering different sizes. The model Taiwan is thicker at the edge than the ChinShun from Ugou. And the small belly needs a different cutting motion. It would benefit from some thinning... Looks like a modern production with a little more abuse resistance, nothing special.
The Chin Shun looks more handmade with a nice thin grind. And my knives from Taiwan got a rest for index and thumb. The thin part of the blade is ground across to the choil. Quick and dirty pics of the model Taiwan grip area:
There is a slight hollow grind to support the pinch grip. And there are stamped phone numbers on taiwanese knives.
With enough time and no money I missed to take a chop block. That might have been the last proper chop block available, a unicorn in germany. From time to time some nice things come and go, without much notice from us. Thats ok to me, nice tools should be used. At least I was lucky enough to start with a good cleaver. Now that knife is available online. At least one of this reasonable cleavers is available from Germany. Or within Europe.
It looks like there are less offers for reasonable carbon cleavers from year to year So I recommended that knife on german forums, to push the demand. That worked like a charm. The knife sold off and came back a few times. Now it might be available as long as its made. (fingers crossed)
Yes, same situation here. But you never know what shows up in local shops. One batch of ccks was sold local at crazy good prices.
The steel of that knife is not reactive. It might be semi stainless, about 5% chromium. Lots of citrus can build patina and color it from grey to black. Some scrubbing every other week can keep the knife from building patina. But no idea where they buy steel.
TsienYen offers a few knives from Taiwan. I like the shop for offering different sizes. The model Taiwan is thicker at the edge than the ChinShun from Ugou. And the small belly needs a different cutting motion. It would benefit from some thinning... Looks like a modern production with a little more abuse resistance, nothing special.
The Chin Shun looks more handmade with a nice thin grind. And my knives from Taiwan got a rest for index and thumb. The thin part of the blade is ground across to the choil. Quick and dirty pics of the model Taiwan grip area:
There is a slight hollow grind to support the pinch grip. And there are stamped phone numbers on taiwanese knives.
Sorry I actually backed out, I just can't find any information of them in Chinese, the only thing I can find is that they are founded in 2015 with minimum required start up fund....It did not mean that they are not an old manufacturer or anything, it could be they just registered for the brand. Most of their product online are sold overseas, maybe they only sell them in store in China or Hong Kong. Also I got a NOS Toyama iron clad Nakiri, absolutely tap chop monster, really different from all my other knives include CCK, really had a lot of fun preparing dinner with it.
Jville
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I’ll be honest the Toyama 210 nakiri is one of my favorite knives that I have ever used. If ever a nakiri could be a daily driver for me this is it. I sold a bunch of knives and kept it. I knew if I cleared out my knives it is one that I would use a lot. I just shaved a bunch of onions with it the other day.
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Just goes to show everyone has their own personal tastes. I pretty much hated my Toyama 210. Sold it to a fellow forum member and never looked back. I just found it too big for a nakiri and and too small for a Chinese cleaver.
Jville
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Yeah, very true. It’s about perspective. For me, it has the power of a small cleaver in this compact package. 165/180 nakiris feel more limited to me. I really only crave to use, especially 165mm, when I’m doing something like a case of small mushrooms. With the Toyama, I feel like you can attack an all around prep list. It has enough length to use on 1 of almost anything, enough power to aid in cutting, nimble enough to use in variety of ingredients, and the combo of very forward balance and that grind drops through ingredients as effortlessly as anything I’ve had my hands on. And since it’s bigger you get better scooping than a small nakiri, although that’s where it lacks from a small cleaver. Plus awesome edge retention.
It's just super fun for me to tap chop everything with it, something I always find kind lacking in 165mm and some 180mm nakiri, while CCK is nice I just find it leaning more towards push cut for me with the overall super thin blade.
Jville
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Plus CCK, is not going to hold the same type of edge, so I feel like it lends to slicing, not that you can’t chop with it of course. But having a certain sharpness helps on chopping
tostadas
Hobbyist / Craftsman
I agree the shape and overall package of the CCK is great. But the steel itself leaves much to be desired compared to nicer knife steels
I'd pay a lot for a magnacut cck, or just 52100 or aebl...
tostadas
Hobbyist / Craftsman
My Markin cleaver is essentially a pimped out CCK in 52100
I'm still on the waitlist, hopefully soon...
I was chopping some carnitas today at work and was thinking about CCK’s. Because I’m really new on cleavers I need to be enlightened. Which option should be better for chopping meat in pro kitchen environment with regular cutting boards; Kau Kong(1400s), BBQ Chopper(1500s) or Bone Chopper(1600s). In theory, bone chopper is more versatile, heavy, also great for bones. However, it may be super heavy, not really usable though. (I think I can’t see how heavy they are on website.) I’m using a cheap dexter slicer and an asian market chopper for almost everything. They are ok though, I actually don’t need a new one. However, why not if a bone chopper can do the job. Maybe I need even two of them maybe? 
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Sounds like the CCK BBQ might be your best choice. I have one but I tend to use a medium weight all metal cleaver(Rice Knife brand) I picked up in Malaysia or a Sugimoto No. 7 more for finely dicing meat.I was chopping some carnitas today at work and was thinking about CCK’s. Because I’m really new on cleavers I need to be enlightened. Which option should be better for chopping meat in pro kitchen environment with regular cutting boards; Kau Kong(1400s), BBQ Chopper(1500s) or Bone Chopper(1600s). In theory, bone chopper is more versatile, heavy, also great for bones. However, it may be super heavy, not really usable though. (I think I can’t see how heavy they are on website.) I’m using a cheap dexter slicer and an asian market chopper for almost everything. They are ok though, I actually don’t need a new one. However, why not if a bone chopper can do the job. Maybe I need even two of them maybe?
Jville
I used to work in a Mexican restaurant
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Sap Vua
Dao Vuo makes a good heavy cleaver. I got one from Bernal cutlery. It would be good for chopping meat. I’ve used it to grind meat and I’ve also broken down large veal bones with it. It’s pretty inexpensive also.I was chopping some carnitas today at work and was thinking about CCK’s. Because I’m really new on cleavers I need to be enlightened. Which option should be better for chopping meat in pro kitchen environment with regular cutting boards; Kau Kong(1400s), BBQ Chopper(1500s) or Bone Chopper(1600s). In theory, bone chopper is more versatile, heavy, also great for bones. However, it may be super heavy, not really usable though. (I think I can’t see how heavy they are on website.) I’m using a cheap dexter slicer and an asian market chopper for almost everything. They are ok though, I actually don’t need a new one. However, why not if a bone chopper can do the job. Maybe I need even two of them maybe?
Xunzi
Well-Known Member
Looking for a hardcore cleaver. Basically to destroy bones or cut open green coconuts. Just short of a machete in other words. Preferably, rustic looking, i.e. mirror polish is not the look I'm going for. Any suggestions?
Tbh a hand saw would work better for those task.
Xunzi
Well-Known Member
Any suggestions for a Japanese-made, rustic looking handsaw? ;-)
Those leaf spring machetes made in Vietnam come to mind as a good option.
Xunzi
Well-Known Member
I used to have a good machete. But in all honesty, are you telling me that cleavers cant handle a green coconut? We're talking fresh coconut, few chops and the scalp is off.
tostadas
Hobbyist / Craftsman
I'd say any $10 medium thickness cleaver from the super market will do. That's what I use for coconuts
Sorry really not my thing... But as Tostada said most cleaver would work for green coconut, I'm commenting more on the bone part, depends what kind of bone you want to cut, for larger beef bones hand saw works a lot better and safer, for large poultry and smaller pork bones a good heavy cleaver would be nice.
Jville
I used to work in a Mexican restaurant
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Dao Vuo heavy cleaver cones to mind. Had one in stock at Bernal.
